Why is it never brought up

[Jerry Christ]

That for the last several years our plays/playbook has sucked.

 

I mean seriously

[Cornerville]

You think that has NEVER been brought up?

 

Seriously???

[Jerry Christ]

You think that has NEVER been brought up?

 

Seriously???

 

its always the qb play, not the actually plays

[ricojes]

its always the qb play, not the actually plays

Well, they got rid of Turk. I know that was a hot topic for discussion. AVP can't change the playbook now, he can change the plays that are called, but he's stuck with the playbook for this year. But it's not always the QB, it's usually the coach, Ralph, "GM", or former GM's that get the blame on this board..

[Jerry Christ]

Well, they got rid of Turk. I know that was a hot topic for discussion. AVP can't change the playbook now, he can change the plays that are called, but he's stuck with the playbook for this year. But it's not always the QB, it's usually the coach, Ralph, or "GM" that gets the blame on this board..

I agree, but when was the last time as a whole we actually liked a qb?

 

 

I mean heck, even people hated flutie who didn't do anything but win, or go down trying.

 

We will, never have an offense where the qb has complete control unless they have a headfast attitude and personality

[jjamie12]

its always the qb play, not the actually plays

Because you have absolutely NO WAY of knowing whether the plays suck or the execution sucks. ZERO.

 

(Unless you're a Bills coach, or know the plays, their different derivatives and have access to game film)

[Jerry Christ]

Because you have absolutely NO WAY of knowing whether the plays suck or the execution sucks. ZERO.

 

(Unless you're a Bills coach, or know the plays, their different derivatives and have access to game film)

I agree, so what do we know?!?!

[ricojes]

I agree, so what do we know?!?!

We know:

The Bills should be 2-1 right now, but blew it in NE and stand at 1-2 0-1.

This game on Sunday is huge, an early must win.

Running game has been very good, and we get ML back which should only make it better.

Trent still checks down too much, LE and TO are being wasted in the offense, but is it the QB's, OC's, or HC's fault?

AVP is learning on the fly, but I have confidence in him, something I did not have with TS.

The Bills injuries are pilling up again this year, but I think they have more depth than last year.

If the Bills can squish the fish this week and beat a lowly Cleveland team in Buffalo, they can be 3-2 1-1, going to NJ for big showdown!

Keep the faith.

GO BILLS!!!

[reddogblitz]

Because you have absolutely NO WAY of knowing whether the plays suck or the execution sucks. ZERO.

 

(Unless you're a Bills coach, or know the plays, their different derivatives and have access to game film)

 

Well, if we're sitting in the stands and see WRs open (which I have) and Trent not throw it to them and instead go to RBs behind the LOS, what does that make you think? Makes me think it's execution by our QB and not the plays themselves. But that's just me.

[John from Riverside]

I have one feeling I would like to express and then I will leave it for thought.....

 

I never worry what our offense is going to do when they get the ball after a kickoff or punt.....no matter if the ball is at the 50 or the 5

 

I start growing increasingly nervous as we get closer and closer to the end zone........

 

and then this offense shows me why I should feel that way....it is almost like DJ TRIES to find ways not to score touchdowns and thinks field goals are just so much cooler.....UGG

[SouthernMan]

Well, if we're sitting in the stands and see WRs open (which I have) and Trent not throw it to them and instead go to RBs behind the LOS, what does that make you think? Makes me think it's execution by our QB and not the plays themselves. But that's just me.

 

 

Which brings me to a pet peeve of mine....

 

Why, with wide screen technology, can't we at home get a more expanded view of the field?

 

At the very least, show some end zone views on replay. On passing plays especially, we almost never have any idea what's going on 20 yards past the quarterback, at least until the ball is in the air. I have no idea where T.O. and Evans are until the very end of a play in which their involved. We're unable to see the play develop from from the field position of the QB to that of the WRs. We see the WRs leave the LOS then all we can do is guess what they're doing down field.

 

As TV viewers, it'd be great to get better field perspective on where the wideouts are and how the coverage is reacting and to see if they are in fact open! I feel like we're missing half of the game when we have to watch on TV.

 

A few years ago there was some talk of using digital technology to give the TV viewer more options, including being able to use their remote controls to play director and toggle between camera angles. I wonder what ever happened to that concept?

 

Why are we still stuck with 1960's camera perspective for 99% of the game action? I'd love it if that overhead camera on a wire was used more often to see the whole thing, as viewed from behind the QB. They used to use it frequently on MNF. They may still, I dunno. Makes you feel like you're right there hovering over the play instead of sitting in section 322, row 20.

 

For those of you who have been able to be at the game, how open have our receivers been? Is Edwards turning into our next Rob, Drew, and JP - scared to launch it and let the receiver fight for it? Always looking for the sure thing? Or are these guys unable to get open sufficiently?

[nero47]

I have one feeling I would like to express and then I will leave it for thought.....

 

I never worry what our offense is going to do when they get the ball after a kickoff or punt.....no matter if the ball is at the 50 or the 5

 

I start growing increasingly nervous as we get closer and closer to the end zone........

 

and then this offense shows me why I should feel that way....it is almost like DJ TRIES to find ways not to score touchdowns and thinks field goals are just so much cooler.....UGG

Excuse me, but DJ is not calling the plays or audibilizing at the line. Any dolt can see that if you don't execute you won't score. Quit playing madden football where you do it all. Watch the tivo if you have it and you will see where the players mistakes kill us, not the plays being called.

[DanInUticaTampa]

I agree, so what do we know?!?!

 

 

What we "know" is plenty of speculation. It has been brought up a million times the past several years that the playcalling has been more than questionable. Even when mularky was here and he called a fleaflicker on the goal line all the way through turks rush, rush, pass, punt routine. The playcalling has been the most questioned aspect of this team.

[spartacus]

Because you have absolutely NO WAY of knowing whether the plays suck or the execution sucks. ZERO.

 

(Unless you're a Bills coach, or know the plays, their different derivatives and have access to game film)

 

your first clue that the play design sucks is when your 2 WRs run the same plays into double coverage by the deep safety over and over and over and over. . .

 

maybe a crossing route or WR screen to get the WR the ball before the safety can apply the 2nd layer of coverage

 

yeah the play design absolutely blows

[Mark Vader]

I have one feeling I would like to express and then I will leave it for thought.....

 

I never worry what our offense is going to do when they get the ball after a kickoff or punt.....no matter if the ball is at the 50 or the 5

 

I start growing increasingly nervous as we get closer and closer to the end zone........

and then this offense shows me why I should feel that way....it is almost like DJ TRIES to find ways not to score touchdowns and thinks field goals are just so much cooler.....UGG

I know exactly how you feel John. Was'nt it a shock how the Bills scored two offensive touchdowns in the red zone against the Patriots?

[Mark Vader]

We know:

The Bills should be 2-1 right now, but blew it in NE and stand at 1-2 0-1.

This game on Sunday is huge, an early must win.

Running game has been very good, and we get ML back which should only make it better.

Trent still checks down too much, LE and TO are being wasted in the offense, but is it the QB's, OC's, or HC's fault?

AVP is learning on the fly, but I have confidence in him, something I did not have with TS.

The Bills injuries are pilling up again this year, but I think they have more depth than last year.

If the Bills can squish the fish this week and beat a lowly Cleveland team in Buffalo, they can be 3-2 1-1, going to NJ for big showdown!

Keep the faith.

GO BILLS!!!

I'm with you ricojes. Yes we should be 2-1, but that's the breaks is'nt it? I think many fans here put far too much emphasis on the loss to the Saints. Yes it sucked that we lost when we had many opportunities to win that game.

 

Despite that, I am still optimistic. The Bills have only played 3 games and there is just too much of the season left to throw in the towel. I think that overall the Bills are improving. The O-Line has played far better than I expected, although they will be tested this Sunday. Trent had a bad game against the Saints, but he looked good in the first two games. Getting Marshawn Lynch back will be a big help. The defense and defensive playcalling has also improved.

 

These next two games are pivotal for the Bills season. They must beat the Dolphins and Browns. Ending the streak of losses to division opponents and getting a 3-2 record before they face the Jets would be very good for the Bills morale.

 

Again, the Bills have got to get Evans & Owens involved much more than they are now. They must put a big emphasis on that. I hope AVP can get them more invovled.

 

I am keeping the faith and I believe the Bills will be 3-2 after these next two games. GO BILLS!!!!!

[SouthGeorgiaBillsFan]

Well, they got rid of Turk. I know that was a hot topic for discussion. AVP can't change the playbook now, he can change the plays that are called, but he's stuck with the playbook for this year. But it's not always the QB, it's usually the coach, Ralph, "GM", or former GM's that get the blame on this board..

 

What? LOL. Professional football teams can't change the playbook in mid-season? Just lol.

[SouthGeorgiaBillsFan]

Which brings me to a pet peeve of mine....

 

Why, with wide screen technology, can't we at home get a more expanded view of the field?

 

At the very least, show some end zone views on replay. On passing plays especially, we almost never have any idea what's going on 20 yards past the quarterback, at least until the ball is in the air. I have no idea where T.O. and Evans are until the very end of a play in which their involved. We're unable to see the play develop from from the field position of the QB to that of the WRs. We see the WRs leave the LOS then all we can do is guess what they're doing down field.

 

As TV viewers, it'd be great to get better field perspective on where the wideouts are and how the coverage is reacting and to see if they are in fact open! I feel like we're missing half of the game when we have to watch on TV.

 

A few years ago there was some talk of using digital technology to give the TV viewer more options, including being able to use their remote controls to play director and toggle between camera angles. I wonder what ever happened to that concept?

 

Why are we still stuck with 1960's camera perspective for 99% of the game action? I'd love it if that overhead camera on a wire was used more often to see the whole thing, as viewed from behind the QB. They used to use it frequently on MNF. They may still, I dunno. Makes you feel like you're right there hovering over the play instead of sitting in section 322, row 20.

 

For those of you who have been able to be at the game, how open have our receivers been? Is Edwards turning into our next Rob, Drew, and JP - scared to launch it and let the receiver fight for it? Always looking for the sure thing? Or are these guys unable to get open sufficiently?

 

I don't have any trouble realizing the coverage just based on the defensive alignment and the first few steps they take on TV. Doing it from behind the LOS with 300lb mean SOBs flying at your face is a different story.

 

Let me just also point out that three things must happen for the ball to be thrown effectively downfield:

 

1. The receiver must get behind the coverage. When the WR is double teamed or the defense is playing a soft zone, this is nearly impossible, and thus the correct read is to throw the ball where the coverage has vacated, an action that is referred to with much reverence on this board as "checking down".

 

2. The QB must recognize the coverage AND have a receiver who can exploit that coverage. Lee Evans can not do this effectively because he lacks the size to be effective over the middle and in jump ball situations. TO can do this extremely well but we all know how he is prone to drop balls.

 

3. The QB must have time to plant and throw. This is by far the most important and has been by far the biggest problem. If you cannot block a 4 man rush you simply cannot expect to be effective throwing the ball. It is a fundamental rule that is the basis for so many defensive schemes in the NFL. If teams are rushing 5 or more defenders then it is unrealistic to expect the O-line to be able to consistently pick up the rush and therefore you must exploit blitzes with screens and short quick passes to the areas that are vacated by the blitzing defender(s).

 

Last year we had problems with #1 and #3. This year we still have problems with #1 and #3. And as long as #1 and #3 are continuous problems, it is hard to say whether or not #2 is occurring with enough accuracy to be effective.

[RayFinkle]

Well, they got rid of Turk. I know that was a hot topic for discussion. AVP can't change the playbook now, he can change the plays that are called, but he's stuck with the playbook for this year. But it's not always the QB, it's usually the coach, Ralph, "GM", or former GM's that get the blame on this board..

AVP has been a member of the offensive coaching staff for a number of years now. He has had planty of input into the playbook.

[spartacus]

I don't have any trouble realizing the coverage just based on the defensive alignment and the first few steps they take on TV. Doing it from behind the LOS with 300lb mean SOBs flying at your face is a different story.

 

Let me just also point out that three things must happen for the ball to be thrown effectively downfield:

 

1. The receiver must get behind the coverage. When the WR is double teamed or the defense is playing a soft zone, this is nearly impossible, and thus the correct read is to throw the ball where the coverage has vacated, an action that is referred to with much reverence on this board as "checking down".

 

2. The QB must recognize the coverage AND have a receiver who can exploit that coverage. Lee Evans can not do this effectively because he lacks the size to be effective over the middle and in jump ball situations. TO can do this extremely well but we all know how he is prone to drop balls.

 

3. The QB must have time to plant and throw. This is by far the most important and has been by far the biggest problem. If you cannot block a 4 man rush you simply cannot expect to be effective throwing the ball. It is a fundamental rule that is the basis for so many defensive schemes in the NFL. If teams are rushing 5 or more defenders then it is unrealistic to expect the O-line to be able to consistently pick up the rush and therefore you must exploit blitzes with screens and short quick passes to the areas that are vacated by the blitzing defender(s).

 

Last year we had problems with #1 and #3. This year we still have problems with #1 and #3. And as long as #1 and #3 are continuous problems, it is hard to say whether or not #2 is occurring with enough accuracy to be effective.

 

 

your basic premise is horse-hockey

 

WRs on every team in the NFL catch passes 15-25 yards downfield every Sunday without "getting behind the coverage". There are holes in the zone all over the field, which we are miserable at exploiting because Trent will not throw the ball unless the the DB has essentially fallen down to leave the WR wide open.

 

Our offense is so predictable because the only guys going deep into the double coverage are TO and EVans basically on every play. change it up and send the TE deep and throw a screen, slant or crossing pattern to TO when he has only the short guy to beat.

 

Good offenses are designed and executed to get their playmakers the ball so they can make plays. The Bills offensive philosophy is to castrate itself by using its playmakers as decoys and to be content to throw checkdowns and then punt to complete the 3-and-out

[BillsVet]

I don't have any trouble realizing the coverage just based on the defensive alignment and the first few steps they take on TV. Doing it from behind the LOS with 300lb mean SOBs flying at your face is a different story.

 

Let me just also point out that three things must happen for the ball to be thrown effectively downfield:

 

1. The receiver must get behind the coverage. When the WR is double teamed or the defense is playing a soft zone, this is nearly impossible, and thus the correct read is to throw the ball where the coverage has vacated, an action that is referred to with much reverence on this board as "checking down".

 

2. The QB must recognize the coverage AND have a receiver who can exploit that coverage. Lee Evans can not do this effectively because he lacks the size to be effective over the middle and in jump ball situations. TO can do this extremely well but we all know how he is prone to drop balls.

 

3. The QB must have time to plant and throw. This is by far the most important and has been by far the biggest problem. If you cannot block a 4 man rush you simply cannot expect to be effective throwing the ball. It is a fundamental rule that is the basis for so many defensive schemes in the NFL. If teams are rushing 5 or more defenders then it is unrealistic to expect the O-line to be able to consistently pick up the rush and therefore you must exploit blitzes with screens and short quick passes to the areas that are vacated by the blitzing defender(s).

 

Last year we had problems with #1 and #3. This year we still have problems with #1 and #3. And as long as #1 and #3 are continuous problems, it is hard to say whether or not #2 is occurring with enough accuracy to be effective.

 

I'm not challenging your fanhood by saying this, but being at the game gives a whole new vantage point as opposed to watching at home. That said, Owens and Evans were getting open, and you don't have to get behind the coverage to do this. The greatest skill a WR can have is the ability to get separation from the defender. This requires solid route running and a good understanding of when the ball will be thrown. I'm not saying Evans and Owens are the best route runners, but they were open, and Edwards elected to throw short.

 

Protection wasn't terrible, but Edwards has been holding onto the ball longer than he should. It's almost as if he doesn't trust himself, the receivers, or both.

[colin]

i think our issues on O and D tend to be that we are too "balanced". we are a jack of all but a master of none. by this i mean we want trent to read before and after the snap, go through progressions, find the open guy, etc etc. we don't seem to have any plays that are specialized in running one way to one guy. we don't have those pre snap quick throw reads that the pats use all the time, we don't have those inside/outside routes that the colts run all the time when manning sees something in the d. we have seen freddy make some good plays, but have we seen him covered by an LB and we exploit that? i don't recall that, just swing outs when everyone else is running around down field.

 

these quick slants, direct quick passes, one read one throw type plays let the O run very quickly and put pressure on the D. since we just have to be perfectly balanced to handle every kind of D on every kind of play we end up not being ready for any of it.

 

imo as a fan these aggressive quick plays on O dictate to the D and put them on their heels (we see them beat us on D all the time). that's going to open up everything. i think that's what we did in NE.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Well, they got rid of Turk. I know that was a hot topic for discussion. AVP can't change the playbook now, he can change the plays that are called, but he's stuck with the playbook for this year. But it's not always the QB, it's usually the coach, Ralph, "GM", or former GM's that get the blame on this board..

 

Why?

 

Can't you have a playbook for the year with 16 different variations... Basically 16 different playbooks. KISS: Keep Simple Stupid. With that, IMO... I thinkyou can have 16 different "looks."