VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 More stellar journalism. The majority of draft picks aren't signed, especially first-rounders, yet it's "news" that Maybin may miss the start of (the Bills' early-starting) camp. I guess there hasn't been enough negative TO news to talk about. And the Bills aren't going to break ranks and sign Maybin without the guys slotted near them signing. They don't want to overpay and be criticized by the other teams, and the players' agent doesn't want to potentially get too little and be criticized by the other agents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bufcomments Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 More stellar journalism. The majority of draft picks aren't signed, especially first-rounders, yet it's "news" that Maybin may miss the start of (the Bills' early-starting) camp. I guess there hasn't been enough negative TO news to talk about. And the Bills aren't going to break ranks and sign Maybin without the guys slotted near them signing. They don't want to overpay and be criticized by the other teams, and the players' agent doesn't want to potentially get too little and be criticized by the other agents. Maybe not so with Maybin but the two rookies guards I would really like to see them on the first Sat. They need as many reps as they can get and besides you can make an offer close to what the low first rounders(in Woods case) got last year. Why does this front office not have any balls and do things first for a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Maybe not so with Maybin but the two rookies guards I would really like to see them on the first Sat. They need as many reps as they can get and besides you can make an offer close to what the low first rounders(in Woods case) got last year. Why does this front office not have any balls and do things first for a change. They may have to in this case. Hopefully at least a couple more 1st rounders close to the 11th spot get signed, to at least give them some parameters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Just one question: Okay, so the Bills are allegedly waiting for other teams to sign their picks so they can "slot" their players. Fine. But who are the other teams waiting for? Meaning: Just this once, because the Bills will be in camp before any of those other teams, can't they work out acceptable contracts for their players without waiting to see what everyone else does? Lead, not follow? I realize that goes against the deeply-ingrained culture at One Bills Drive, but it's worth a thought. It starts from the top on down. Usually once the first pick is signed, it sets a guideline for the 2nd, then the 3rd, and so on. The 1st pick usually gets about 10% higher than the 1st overall pick the year before, though it does get tricky if it's a QB, which is the case this year. Also, Jake Long took less money than the 10% annual raise, so that is something the adds into Stafford's argument as well. Once the top picks sign, it usually creates a domino effect. But if they haven't, teams such as the Bills are put in a tough spot because there really are no guidelines to go by, and neither side wants to risk getting owned (by signing, then once the other picks sign and the market is set, you realize you could have gotten a lot more). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 They have rarely, IIRC, had a problem getting the first round pick in on time. What the hell is the problem!! I think Whitner may not have signed on time but I'm not sure. Are you kidding? Where have you been? We have this problem almost every year. It is rare our top pick is in camp for the start. McKelvin wasn't signed in time, Whitner wasn't signed in time, and Marshawn was signed until the morning of camp (I believe he missed the first practice, and arrived for the afternoon, but not sure). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I'm aware that Maybin isn't holding out yet, but I just have something to say. I will NEVER understand players who engage in a contractual holdout, especially before their rookie season. These guys should be so fuggin excited that they have the opportunity to play in the NFL that they should be nervously counting down the days until training camp, NOT squabbling over how many millions of dollars they'll be making in their first few seasons. I know that their D-bag agents have a lot to do with it, but I'm just trying to imagine myself as an NFL rookie and I know that there's a 0% chance I'd be holding out. You're right. You should just show up at your job without knowing how much you're getting paid, or what your medical benefits are, just because you should be happy to have a job. Good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Why would ESPN single out Maybin as not reporting to camp on time?? - Only 2 First-rounders have been signed - camp hasn't opened yet This is a non-story. And why are people assuming that the Bills haven't even begun negotiations with Maybin's agent? This whole thread is one big WTF?? Because we are the first team to open up camp. Other teams don't open for another week. We don't have our top pick signed, unlike other teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mousetrap08 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Oh! Boy! another Bills training camp and more holdouts GEEZE! I just don't understand this front office. They only had since last April to get these players sighned.what are they waiting for.Probaley just a way to low ball thier draft picks so Mr. Wilson can stuff more money in his own pockets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Oh! Boy! another Bills training camp and more holdouts GEEZE! I just don't understand this front office. They only had since last April to get these players sighned.what are they waiting for.Probaley just a way to low ball thier draft picks so Mr. Wilson can stuff more money in his own pockets. Are people just stupid? Can they not read what has been written just a FEW posts before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max997 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I'm aware that Maybin isn't holding out yet, but I just have something to say. I will NEVER understand players who engage in a contractual holdout, especially before their rookie season. These guys should be so fuggin excited that they have the opportunity to play in the NFL that they should be nervously counting down the days until training camp, NOT squabbling over how many millions of dollars they'll be making in their first few seasons. I know that their D-bag agents have a lot to do with it, but I'm just trying to imagine myself as an NFL rookie and I know that there's a 0% chance I'd be holding out. what you fail to realize is that the average career of an NFL player is 3.5 years so for a lot of players their rookie deal is the only deal they are ever going to sign so they want to get as much out of it as possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Anyone think of the possibility that maybe the players agents are the reason this is happening? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 : so sorry No problem. Sorry for losing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 What's the big surprise? To us it is a sport. To them it is a business, that is why they have (business) agents to make sure they get as much money as they can. It is not the agents "fault", they are just doing what they are paid to do by the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mousetrap08 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 No problem. Sorry for losing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Here's an idea.... Could the rookies without contracts show up but not participate in contact drills? So they're making a "good faith" effort to be there, learn and get/stay in shape, but not risking injury that would hurt their contract/career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Here's an idea.... Could the rookies without contracts show up but not participate in contact drills? So they're making a "good faith" effort to be there, learn and get/stay in shape, but not risking injury that would hurt their contract/career. I don't think they can. They have clauses that protect them during mini-camp/OTA's but I think it does not apply to trainng camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Quint Posted July 23, 2009 Author Share Posted July 23, 2009 Good question, meaning one to which I don't know the answer. Washington and Indy played the HOF Game last year. I'll check their rookie signings and report back. Washington didn't have a first-rounder, but loaded up on passcatchers in the second with Devin Thomas, Malcolm Kelly, and Fred Davis. Indy also traded away their first-round selection. They took G Mike Pollak in the second, LB Phillip Wheeler in the third. So the deals were done, but on the brink of training camp. Typical. That, and the extra week built into the schedule this year, are why I'm not overly concerned ... yet. Would be nice to have everyone on the field by the end of the weekend, though. Thanks for looking that up. I'll consider it a problem if Maybin & Wood miss more than the first week, but I expect it to be at least the first few days of camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Here's an idea.... Could the rookies without contracts show up but not participate in contact drills? So they're making a "good faith" effort to be there, learn and get/stay in shape, but not risking injury that would hurt their contract/career. I believe they have insurance policies for the OTA's and mini camps. I'm not sure why they don't cover TC's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanInUticaTampa Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I know the bills are in a tough situation in signing maybin, but it would be nice if they signed a pick (or a couple) higher than their 5th before camp starts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I'm aware that Maybin isn't holding out yet, but I just have something to say. I will NEVER understand players who engage in a contractual holdout, especially before their rookie season. These guys should be so fuggin excited that they have the opportunity to play in the NFL that they should be nervously counting down the days until training camp, NOT squabbling over how many millions of dollars they'll be making in their first few seasons. I know that their D-bag agents have a lot to do with it, but I'm just trying to imagine myself as an NFL rookie and I know that there's a 0% chance I'd be holding out. I dont understand why these kids dont try to sign the moment they get drafted. Maybin is 21 years old, and will be getting millions of dollars with his signing bonus. If I were him I would want my millions in April... I couldn't wait till July or August. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush... or something like that. Just ask for a little more than what McKelvin got last year and be done with it. Then invest your money for a couple extra months and you may be even when its all said and done. Just simple time value of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I dont understand why these kids dont try to sign the moment they get drafted. Maybin is 21 years old, and will be getting millions of dollars with his signing bonus. If I were him I would want my millions in April... I couldn't wait till July or August. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush... or something like that. Just ask for a little more than what McKelvin got last year and be done with it. Then invest your money for a couple extra months and you may be even when its all said and done. Just simple time value of money. One-word answer: agents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I don't think they can. They have clauses that protect them during mini-camp/OTA's but I think it does not apply to trainng camp. I believe they have insurance policies for the OTA's and mini camps. I'm not sure why they don't cover TC's. Yeah, that's why I was thinking non-contact type participation. I guess they could still get hurt standing on the sideline or something. And certainly, there's only so much meeting room/book learning they could do. I was just wonder aloud if anyone's ever thought of it before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FluffHead Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 On his twitter account he has been saying the right things and seems genuinely anxious to get this out of the way and get on the field. www.twitter.com/AaronMaybin58 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Yeah, reading everything over, it sounds like this is going to be a brief annoyance and not a crisis. Nobody's doing anything unusual, it's just the usual logjams in the system are conflicting with our early camp start. As long as Maybin and Wood are in the first 20 or so first rounders to sign, I'll be happy. Now, with at least one 2nd rounder having signed, I think it's time to do the job with Levitre and Byrd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I'm thinking that there will be a larger number of 1st, 2nd round no-signs. Most owners already have sell-outs for their tix. They know with the way things are, there will be no-shows - less parking and concession cash. If I owned a team, and a high round pick and his hired gun played hardball - see ya. Enjoy your draft re-entry next year. Not inking Your Majesty to an upfront guaranteed $$$ deal sure looks good on my balance sheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 a rookie salary cap would settle this issue at least for the rookie year. it would have the potential to complicate things later on depending on length of rookie contracts. as it stands, this is the way the system works and i don't begrudge rookies for not reporting until they get a fair deal. i do know that some teams in the past have truly attempted to low-ball first-round draft picks, which has complicated talks. and they low-balled them even though the players drafted immediately before and after them had signed. all i'm saying is though some here blame the player, there's also a team involved and it takes two to tango. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 jw Hi! john.....missed ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 One-word answer: agents. Yes, but the agent is hired by the player, not the other way around. The player can dictate how the agent acts. If I were a drafted player like Maybin, I would have made sure my agent got me a contract ASAP, or I would make him my former agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Hi! john.....missed ya! thanks. ... by the way my cable's been acting up. the damn "start over" function and some of the indemand stuff's been acting up. anything you can do about that? been back for a few days, actually had a discussion about all things Irish on the off the wall board and ready to head to camp tomorrow, which annually marks the end of my summer the moment i step foot on campus. wondering what the buzz will be about, eh? jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Yes, but the agent is hired by the player, not the other way around. The player can dictate how the agent acts. If I were a drafted player like Maybin, I would have made sure my agent got me a contract ASAP, or I would make him my former agent. That is easy to say, but you are talking about young guys...................some of which are not all that intelligent, most will follow the advice of the agent they hired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 That is easy to say, but you are talking about young guys...................some of which are not all that intelligent, most will follow the advice of the agent they hired. while there are some agents who practice questionable tactics, many more are in fact looking out for the players' interest while also making a living for themselves. there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. and though i find many of the athletes i cover to be, in fact, intelligent -- and my encounters with Maybin indicate to me that he's very bright -- wouldn't it behoove them to get their market value. in fact, your argument is a little contradictory or confused at the least. if the athlete is not intelligent, then he certainly should follow the agent's advice. and if the athlete is intelligent, he then knows enough to hire a reputable agent and then follow that person's advice. i don't understand how the player is the bad guy in this. the system needs fixing and, once again, teams have a role in this as well. you'd hire a lawyer and real estate agent to buy a house, right? same deal. if you didn't, well, good luck with that, eh? jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Not considered a holdout until camp starts. a player that is not under contract can't be holding out there is nothing to hold out from He is simply an unsigned player- with the inability to market his services anywhere else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 I don't really consider what these guys are doing as egregious as a guy who's already under contract holding out. They really can't step on the field until they're under contract - otherwise they're totally exposed if they get hurt on day one. It's their first contract, and they'll report is soon as the 'slotting' process runs it's natural course. Probably w/in a few days after camp opens. Now if they have a great rookie season and decide to hold out next season, well f&ck 'em, I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 I'm thinking that there will be a larger number of 1st, 2nd round no-signs. Most owners already have sell-outs for their tix. They know with the way things are, there will be no-shows - less parking and concession cash. If I owned a team, and a high round pick and his hired gun played hardball - see ya. Enjoy your draft re-entry next year. Not inking Your Majesty to an upfront guaranteed $$$ deal sure looks good on my balance sheet. that's a workable policy for teams that plan for the future however, a team like the Bills screwed themselves by totally relying on most of their high picks to start from day 1. of course, the Bills would probably play hardball because saving bucks is much more important than putting a quality product on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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