Bruce Smith and Maybin

[Magox]

You realize Maybin has never played a football game at a weight of over 234 lbs., right??

He will though!

 

I will bet your left nut on it

[Dwight Drane]

Gee, what a shame that the FO didn't call you before the draft. All those guys that study the tapes and observe and travel all year and don't know anything....tsk tsk tsk!

 

Maybe, just maybe, Hardy with his 6'6" frame could put on more than 218 IF it was necessary, and Maybin at 6'4" almost CERTAINLY can sustain more than the 248 he's credited with now. The guy is very lean now, man. And the 230 you mentioned.... pretty redicules!

 

It is a shame. When it comes to athletic conformation, studying tapes, and traveling across the country, I've been on a few payrolls myself.

 

You can't push athletes to do something their body isn't meant to do without giving up results. I have had this conversation about Ryan Miller being overworked.....I have had this conversation about Marshawn Lynch not having the wheels to hold up for a 8-10 year career.....I have had this conversation as to why pitchers are so fragile this day and age....and it is obvious that many organizations don't understand the links when it comes to certain physical and medical issues.

 

I am not saying Maybin will be a bust.......he is amazing at reacting north/south and has the tools to be a nice speed rusher. I predict he will have multiple interceptions in a zone blitz gimmick. His weak spot is going to be misdirection.....I think you can beat him with the screen. He also will not be big enough to take up space against the run. We all know how well those undersized DEs have played the run for us the past decade...right?

 

As a physical specimen expected to play an elite role as a DE.....Orakpo is twice the pick Maybin is. That is all I am saying.

[American Tatonkas]

Most DE in the league are in an average window of 240 to 260 only a couple are over that. Peppers is one of the biggest and he is around 270.

[Magox]

It is a shame. When it comes to athletic conformation, studying tapes, and traveling across the country, I've been on a few payrolls myself.

 

You can't push athletes to do something their body isn't meant to do without giving up results. I have had this conversation about Ryan Miller being overworked.....I have had this conversation about Marshawn Lynch not having the wheels to hold up for a 8-10 year career.....I have had this conversation as to why pitchers are so fragile this day and age....and it is obvious that many organizations don't understand the links when it comes to certain physical and medical issues.

 

I am not saying Maybin will be a bust.......he is amazing at reacting north/south and has the tools to be a nice speed rusher. I predict he will have multiple interceptions in a zone blitz gimmick. His weak spot is going to be misdirection.....I think you can beat him with the screen. He also will not be big enough to take up space against the run. We all know how well those undersized DEs have played the run for us the past decade...right?

 

As a physical specimen expected to play an elite role as a DE.....Orakpo is twice the pick Maybin is. That is all I am saying.

I doubt that! When they played OK state, The impression that stays with me regarding Orakpo is him getting manhandled at the goal line twice by a young TE named Pettigrew. I mean, he was thrown to the side like a rag doll, and mind you, Pettigrew is a TE, wait until Orakpo tries using his bench press strength against Pro tackles. It won't be pretty. That is all I am saying

[Leonidas]

I doubt that! When they played OK state, The impression that stays with me regarding Orakpo is him getting manhandled at the goal line twice by a young TE named Pettigrew. I mean, he was thrown to the side like a rag doll, and mind you, Pettigrew is a TE, wait until Orakpo tries using his bench press strength against Pro tackles. It won't be pretty. That is all I am saying

 

I hope you're right. I preferred Orakpo because, even though he has a lower ceiling, he has a much higher floor. I can see him getting 8 sacks a season for the next 12 years. Maybin seems like a guy that will have three his first year or two and then either boom to fifteen or bust out of the league. And Orakpo, at his size, seems to be better against the run. But it's all speculation anyhow.

[billybob]

Why would anyone compare Maybin with Bruce Smith they are nothing alike physically- DEs that are of similar builds would include Robert Mathis, Manny Lawson, Jevon Kearse and Maybe Richard Dent- I guess you could say both Smith and Maybin have very long arms and tremendous first step but Bruce had a much larger frame and immense lower body size and power.

[Lurker]

Bruce was closer to 300 than 280 when he started. Then he decided to dedicate himself to conditioning. These are not the same types of De's to even compare as has been stated. Maybin at his best possible outcome could translate to a Jason Taylor/ Jevon Kearse type player.

Word.

 

Bruce was one of the few NFL guys who was in better shape as a 10-year vet than as a rookie. I just hope Maybin has some of the same competitive fire...

[Lurker]

Bruce had a much larger frame and immense lower body size and power.

Without the pads, Bruce looked like a praying mantis...huge thighs, small waist, powerful torso.

[Dwight Drane]

Without the pads, Bruce looked like a praying mantis...huge thighs, small waist, powerful torso.

 

 

Just how well DO you know Bruce?

[papazoid]

Bruce Smith was much lighter than his listed weight.....he had like 4% body fat......i remember seeing him in training camp at fredonia next to other players like Teddy Washington and Pat Williams.....he looked over a hundred pounds lighter than those guys.

 

As far as maybin goes.....he will be able to get to whatever weight the Bills want him to play at.......as far as comparing him to Bruce for talent.....probably won't get close....but one can hope.

[Speedy G]

If Maybin is that quick, they'll be able to zone blitz with him in there, and when he drops into coverage, they wont lose anything because he's so quick, could be interesting?

[billybob]

Bruce Smith was much lighter than his listed weight.....he had like 4% body fat......i remember seeing him in training camp at fredonia next to other players like Teddy Washington and Pat Williams.....he looked over a hundred pounds lighter than those guys.

 

As far as maybin goes.....he will be able to get to whatever weight the Bills want him to play at.......as far as comparing him to Bruce for talent.....probably won't get close....but one can hope.

 

I think it was more the case that Pat and Ted were much heavier than their listed weights- Pat pushed 350 and Ted 400

[spartacus]

Donte is listed at 5'10" 208, and Maybin is 6'3" 249 (expected to play at 255), with Bruce at 6'4" 262. Not even close...

list him at whatever you want

 

he played at 225 in the Rose Bowl

 

he needs to add muscle and keep the speed at the higher weight

 

for him to be effective at all, Fewell has to gameplan to take advantage of his speed and hide his size.

 

hopefully the D coaches have more of a clue than what the offensive coaches did to exploit Parrish's skills

[Steely Dan]

Bruce may have gotten up to 280 early in his career, but in his peak he played at 263 or thereabouts.

 

BB.com has Maybin at 6'3" 249

 

These are some of Bruce Smiths listed weights during the SB years they are taken from pre-season magazines and they get their information from the teams. You have to be skeptical of these weights because teams very often list heights and weights in a fictional way.

 

1988 Lindy's Pro Football Guide shows Bruce at 6'4" 285

 

1991 Street and Smith's Pro Football Guide has Bruce at 6'4" 280

1991 Lindy's Pro Football Guide has Bruce at 6'4" 280

 

1992 Sporting News Football Guide has Bruce at 6'4" 273

1992 Street and Smith's Pro Football Guide 6'4" 273

 

1993 Sporting News Draft Guide has Bruce at 6'4"

1993 Athlon Football Guide has Bruce at 6'4" 273

 

If Maybin wants to be an every down DE he's going to have to add about 25 pounds IMO so he'll be able to stand up against the run. I think he can do it without losing speed as long as he does it through the Bills strength and conditioning coaches. It probably won't be til next season that he'll have the weight and the speed together. JMO

 

OT but the new TE Shawn Nelson is 6'5" 240 and this is how he compares with Pete Metzelaars and Keith McKeller.

 

1991 Street and Smith's Pro Football Guide has Metzelaars at 6'7" 250

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

1991 Lindy's Pro Football Guide has Metzelaars 6'7" 250

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

 

1992 Sporting News has Metzelaars at 6'7" 273

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

1992 Street and Smith's Pro Football Guide Metzelaars 6'7" 250

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

 

1993 Sporting News Draft Guide has Metzelaars 6'7 254

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

1993 Athlon Football Guide has Metzelaars 6'7" 250

Keith McKeller 6'4" 245

 

 

 

 

Gee, what a shame that the FO didn't call you before the draft. All those guys that study the tapes and observe and travel all year and don't know anything....tsk tsk tsk!

 

Maybe, just maybe, Hardy with his 6'6" frame could put on more than 218 IF it was necessary, and Maybin at 6'4" almost CERTAINLY can sustain more than the 248 he's credited with now. The guy is very lean now, man. And the 230 you mentioned.... pretty redicules!

 

 

Word.

 

Bruce was one of the few NFL guys who was in better shape as a 10-year vet than as a rookie. I just hope Maybin has some of the same competitive fire...

 

Somebody posted a link to an article about how Maybin has been committed to conditioning. The guys body looks like it was stamped out of steel. Bruce Smith was notorious for burning out the stair climbing machines at the Bills training facility and hopefully Maybin will be doing something like that himself.

[Spiderweb]

Bruce played as little as 262 lbs when he played for Buffalo and that was in a 3-4 defense.

 

I recall reading on a number of occasions that Bruce slipped under 260 during the course of a season.

[NewEra]

I personally do not believe that Maybin needs to bulk up and I hope that the Bills do not push that on him. He is very close in size with Jason Taylor. And we know how Jason Taylors career has gone.

 

he NEEDS to get stronger. Whether or not you classify that as bulking up or not idk.

[MaineMoxie]

There's another problem in comparing these two. The NFL has changed dramatically since Bruce was playing. In the early '90s it was not all that common to have an offensive lineman over 300 pounds. Nowadays they're almost all over 300. Here's an interesting article about the topic with some hard stats to back it up: http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/conten...eight_1029.html

[MaineMoxie]

I should add that, buried toward the bottom of the article, is this quote:

 

When Indianapolis Colts President Bill Polian kept hearing coaches talk about the importance of size, he decided to put the theory to a test, comparing winning percentages to the average weight of players on each team over about 10 seasons.

 

"We found higher weight had no bearing on winning — none," said Polian, who was the general manager in Buffalo when the Bills played in four Super Bowls. "There was a lot of noise about 'Big is the answer.' We tested it. It's not valid."

[Dwight Drane]

There's another problem in comparing these two. The NFL has changed dramatically since Bruce was playing. In the early '90s it was not all that common to have an offensive lineman over 300 pounds. Nowadays they're almost all over 300. Here's an interesting article about the topic with some hard stats to back it up: http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/conten...eight_1029.html

 

Size doesn't matter....I agree. Your frame, and how you carry your size does matter however. That is where I took issue with Hardy, and why I am concerned with Maybin, although not as much. A player is a player....but an athlete is an athlete. When you are built like an athlete, your odds of becoming a player increases greatly. Maybin is muscular....but he is lean where it counts...down low. That is where an athlete generates all of his power from.

 

If you want to see what a freak of nature athlete looks like, check out Jason Smith from Baylor. Now Jason Peters was sort of a poor man's version of Smith when it comes to body type, and you could see his talent level. He just has rocks for brains.

 

Even on the offensive line you always hear about "This guy has a big bubble." You can be fat as a lineman, but when you carry that weight in your butt and your upper thighs...it allows you to stay in balance. Your power is still generated down low and you are able to drive through players.

 

Nowadays with all the drugs and enhanced workout schemes, it can be tougher to see a pure athlete for what he is. Some Bills from the glory days that were built like winners were Biscuit first and foremost....Bruce....a guy that I was shocked didn't become a mainstay because of his ability and smarts, Mark Maddox....Andre Reed..(still looks like he could play)...Will Wolford..(a little fat, but balanced throughout like nobody's business)...and it is tough for me to think of a can't miss guy at DB...but given our history, that probably isn't surprising.

 

Guys that got it done on heart and head...Talley...that's why everyone loved him so much...he probably weighs 175 now....Kelso...come on, he's a math teacher!.....Jeff Burriss......you see, it is harder to come up with stars that aren't built like pros.

 

But there are guys in the middle like Thurman, who is another example of a guy having the right center of distribution down low to get the most out of his power potential...that aren't obvious looking athletes that went on to be Hall of Famers. Kent Hull....another who isn't smooth and ripped, but had good balance and drive. Tasker........but these guys all had it Down Below.

 

With the last few drafts.....I do not have faith that some of our decision makers grasp the physics of an athlete. I would bet good money that Orakpo and if his knee isn't totally shot, Malcolm Kelly, will have more accomplished careers than Maybin and Hardy. Sure, I can be wrong......I thought Tony Hunt would make it in this league as an RB. But I am fairly confident we reached on this one again.

[JJBuffalo]

I think of Strahan when I look at Maybin in a way. He is 6'5" and Strahan played his best football at about 255-260lbs. Maybin is only a few pounds away from that, if not there already. The key will be his playing strength, use of leverage, play recognition, and using proper technique. Strahan had an excellent variety of moves that he used to perfection. He was probably the best at getting leverage against the opposing lineman and then having his way with the guy. Hopefully Maybin can be effective in the same manner

 

 

Personally, he has the same frame, and reminds me of, john abraham. Hopefully he can play like him too.