A problem could be brewing in the

[Bob in SC]

All I know is that it is great to have people to talk to about old time players.

 

(Holding up a beer in a toast to AD!  )

786344[/snapback]

 

Cookie Gilchrist. Back when linebackers weighed 210. He was unstoppable on short yardage plays. Cheers, old timer!

[Pyrite Gal]

Here's a complete list of every Bills play Sunday with under five yards to go:

 

2nd and 3: pass incomplete

3rd and 3: pass incomplete

4th and 3: pass incomplete

2nd and 5: McGahee run for 6

1st and 5: pass incomplete

2nd and 5: Thomas run for 1

3rd and 4: sack

2nd and 4: McGahee run for 13

3rd and 4: pass for 20

4th and 3: pass for 2

2nd and 1: McGahee run for 6

2nd and 5: McGahee run for 5

2nd and 4: McGahee run for 2

3rd and 2 pass for 8

2nd and 5: pass for 8

2nd and 4: pass for 15

2nd and 4: pass for 8

2nd and 2: McGahee run for 1

3rd and 1; Losman run for -9

3rd and 1: pass incomplete

 

McGahee picked up the first down on 4 of 6 plays.  On the eight 3rd and 4th down plays, he didn't get a carry.  I don't see this as his fault.  Lets give him the ball a bit more.

786201[/snapback]

 

Bingo!

 

Thanks you for your work which totally undercuts the premise of the originsl post! It reminds of that scene in Annie Hall where someone is issuing his fact free opinions about the work of a particular author and Woods takes fault with him.

 

The original whiner says no but Woody reaches off screen and brings out the author himself who then informs the complainer that he clearly does not understand the author's work.

 

Allen then says, Don't you wish real life was really like this.

 

Well it isn't, but fortunately the internet is not real life so one can actually share true facts that totally undercut an original argument.

 

My sense is that this is probably true about some of the other fact-free opinions about WM which are offered like:

 

1. He does not make any effort- Well duh! Actually running into a line of oppposing screaming defensive players is an effort in itself. Perhaps one wants to complain that he makes less effort than other RBs, His 71 carries are 3rd among the top 30 rushers and even his ypc which previously was lower than the norm is well above 4 and is quite solid this year so even this complaint does not hold much water when one looks at the collected objective facts.

 

2. He is going to leave the Bills anyway and is just goofing off until he scores a big contract to go elsewhere- Well duh! I also doubt he will retire as a Bill since actually few players retire with the team which drafted them/ However, WM is our RB this year. In addition, WM is our RB next year. I;m not sure when his contract ends but if we want to keep him when he hits FA after 2007 we have the ability to tag him if we choose to and keep him a Bill in 2008. This time period already puts his career beyond the NFL average and we can barely plan for next year and palns beyond that are easily altered by reality. Has WM said word 1 that he wants to leave? I do not think so. Beyond an off-hand rambling by Rosenhaus last year I have not even seen a hint that he is gonna be a problem yet some treat it as a done deal that he is gone when he simply will be a Bill for the forseeable future if we want that to happen. Besides if he is so obviously be a slacker why would anyone pay him a huge contract.

 

3. Willis says he doesn't weghtlift and this is why he cannot do blitz-pick ups- The post which made this argument was one of the sillier ones. Hello Newman, better upper body stength will not help you pick up the blitz. Looking desperately for some logic in this post, it may be arguing that his lack of weight-lifting with the team was linkws to his lack of effort. However, this argument ignores the fact that his harsh stiff arm which showed a bit yesterday with Jauron running him outside instead of abandoning it like MM had shows great upper body strength.

 

Even if the complaint is that he should strengthen his legs to increase durability he sure is showing a great ability to make carries compared to most RBs so durability does not seem to be the issue.

 

The bottom line in my opinion is that if your question is whether WM is perfect. I would say no. His blitz pick-up obviously needs serious work, He pulled off a great one last week but immediately followed that up with a whiff. Ge whiffed badly at a crtical time yesterday. It was understandable that he missed a dew in his first full year, but he should do better now and the misses this season are unacceptable.

 

However, he demonstrated last week he can do it and the issue is that he needs to consistently do it and claims he cannot do it at all are simply factually incorrect.

 

He has also needs to score TDs like he did in his truncated 1st year, but a lack of TDs has so many other necessary elements like play calling an OL blocking involved you need to lay out a very in depth case to rationally claim the problem is the RB on this.

 

He also needs to be more productive as a receiver, but again you need both the play calling and the QB choosing to go to you to make this happen. They misfired to him on a high pass in the 1st quarter and generally abandoned this approach until late in the game. Saying he sucks due to this is also irrational.

 

WM is far from perfect, but through week 3 even given his clear failings I think one can reasonably call him an elite RB.

[Bill from NYC]

Some player have the odd talent to pound the ball for those few yards. Roosevelt Leaks with the Bills, for one. Cut short career, but Ki-Jana Carter was another.

 

Too bad about Carter. Fine hands and a teriffic blocker, A-1 attitude.

 

Dumb choice by the B'gals. They had a healthy Garrett Hearst, and passed over OT Boselli.

786354[/snapback]

 

Leaks was great at short yardage. How about a guy from Colgate named Marv Hubbard?

 

I wish that SDS would do a board about football history, but I think that you, me and AD would probably be the only ones posting on it.

[Alaska Darin]

Leaks was great at short yardage. How about a guy from Colgate named Marv Hubbard?

 

I wish that SDS would do a board about football history, but I think that you, me and AD would probably be the only ones posting on it. 

786421[/snapback]

Don't leave out KRC. He's really good with that stuff.

[Bill from NYC]

Don't leave out KRC.  He's really good with that stuff.

786423[/snapback]

 

I didn't know that.

 

I think what bugs me is that many football fans look at a team like the cowboys and really believe that Aikman and Smith were the keys to their success.

In truth, Erik Williams and Leon Lett (before their drug/legal problems) might have been the best players in history at their positions. Their lines were simply unstoppable.

A close friend of mine ran into Kent Hull at the Mardi Gras. Hull told him that there was absolutely nothing that he could do with Leon Lett. Although I didn't hear the conversation, I saw pictures, and I believe this guy.

 

At least time has been kind to the steel curtain. A good percentage of people seem to understand that it was their star studded defense that won them championships. Their offense was very good, but was marked by balance imo. Where they DID shine was at wideout.

[Kelly the Dog]

I didn't know that.

 

I think what bugs me is that many football fans look at a team like the cowboys and really believe that Aikman and Smith were the keys to their success.

In truth, Erik Williams and Leon Lett (before their drug/legal problems) might have been the best players in history at their positions. Their lines were simply unstoppable.

A close friend of mine ran into Kent Hull at the Mardi Gras. Hull told him that there was absolutely nothing that he could do with Leon Lett. Although I didn't hear the conversation, I saw pictures, and I believe this guy.

 

At least time has been kind to the steel curtain. A good percentage of people seem to understand that it was their star studded defense that won them championships. Their offense was very good, but was marked by balance imo. Where they DID shine was at wideout.

786433[/snapback]

Who do you think Jimmy Johnson or Jerry Jones would have taken if they had the choice of two of the four, Aikman, Emmitt, Erik Williams and Leon Lett.

[X. Benedict]

If I remember correctly Okoye was a bigger Track and Field star than a football player in college. I think he was a decathalete and he was pretty good.

 

Jacobs is nifty though. I love to watch him play.

[Bill from NYC]

Who do you think Jimmy Johnson or Jerry Jones would have taken if they had the choice of two of the four, Aikman, Emmitt, Erik Williams and Leon Lett.

786438[/snapback]

 

Long term....Smith and Aikman, but as I said, Lett and Williams were probably the best ever at their positions (with a possible exception being Joe Greene at DT).

 

As Lett and Williams faded, so did the cowboys.

[Hardy Pyle]

...he wasn't called the Nigerian Nightmare for nothing!

[Alaska Darin]

I didn't know that.

 

I think what bugs me is that many football fans look at a team like the cowboys and really believe that Aikman and Smith were the keys to their success.

In truth, Erik Williams and Leon Lett (before their drug/legal problems) might have been the best players in history at their positions. Their lines were simply unstoppable.

A close friend of mine ran into Kent Hull at the Mardi Gras. Hull told him that there was absolutely nothing that he could do with Leon Lett. Although I didn't hear the conversation, I saw pictures, and I believe this guy.

 

At least time has been kind to the steel curtain. A good percentage of people seem to understand that it was their star studded defense that won them championships. Their offense was very good, but was marked by balance imo. Where they DID shine was at wideout.

786433[/snapback]

The Steelers OLine was awfully good then, too. Pinney, Kolb, Webster, Mansfield. They were easily the best team I ever saw. Talent all over the place and a defense that literally had a star at every position. When Andy Russell is the unsung guy in your starting lineup, you're damn good.

[Pyrite Gal]

Long term....Smith and Aikman, but as I said, Lett and Williams were probably the best ever at their positions (with a possible exception being Joe Greene at DT).

 

As Lett and Williams faded, so did the cowboys.

786445[/snapback]

 

Its hard to consider some one the best ever when his little brain caused him to be involved in two of the stupidest plays in football history.

 

The one Lett faux pas os famous among Bills faithful as his showboating gave Don Beebe a lift to his career that brought him fame that certainly he was able to ride to a big payoffs as Beebe slapped the ball from his hand for a touchback as he strolled into the endzone in a blowout.

 

That dumb play is certainly understandable and even forgivable as it had no game effect in a blowout of the final game of the season.

 

However, his other notable error was a big time one as it cost his team the game before a national audience on Thanksgiving (and I believe they might have even missed the playoffs by 1 game that year) which was him unexplainedly sliding into a ball which would have been a dead ball where the 'Boys simply ran out the clock. However, by careening into it in the snow he made it a live ball which the other team recovered and went on to win the game.

 

Lett maybe is notable for briefly being the best physical specimen at the position ever, but it goes with noting his physical great play that he was a mental midget on and off the field.

 

One faux pas can happen to anyone.

 

A second error might be a mere coincidence.

 

However, when you add the drug transgressions that cost him a suspension from being to even apply his physical talemts, this third problem constitutes a trend and its hard to consider any such miscreant the greatest anything except a screw up. In fact, of he was that talented a player, it simply makes his idiocy even more of an unacceptable waste.

[MDH]

Who do you think Jimmy Johnson or Jerry Jones would have taken if they had the choice of two of the four, Aikman, Emmitt, Erik Williams and Leon Lett.

786438[/snapback]

 

I don't know who they would have chosen but I would take Aikman and Williams. I know I'm in the minority but I'll go to my grave thinking that Smith was one of the most over-rated RBs (in terms of strictly running the ball) I've ever seen. Without that dominant OL he doesn't come close to the rushing record (Although I'm not sure he would have come close to it had Sanders not retired early).

 

I don’t know how many times I saw Smith running free into the secondary without ever being touched and it wasn’t because of his great vision where he saw a cut back lane and hit it. He was a straight ahead runner that simply took the play where it was designed to go. A good back to be sure, but not one of the greatest of all time Imo.

[Buftex]

Over the last two years MaGahee hasn't been able to score in the red zone or pick up many 3rd and shorts....

785800[/snapback]

 

 

Good call...I find the Bills lack of an effective short yardage game on either side of the ball, to be the most troubling aspect of the team, for a few years now. Even back in 2004, when the defense was so dominating the last 10 games, 3rd & 4th and short situations were brutal for them. It is that way again. They can't stop anyone when they need a yard or two to sustain a drive, and they can't get a yard or two when they need it to sustain a drive...it is pretty diheartening, and the one area where you can point to the lack of dominance by both the O & D lines, as the teams achilles heals...as cliche as it is.

 

As for the offense, I would love to see the hard stats. My rememberance of 2005 season was that McGahee didn't really get the opportunitys he should have in short yardage situations. I remember Shaud Williams bobbing and weaving for 3 yard losses, ill fated QB sneaks, stupid gadget plays, and very little of just McGahee getting the ball...the coaching staff (staffs) seems to have little confidence in the O-line, in this area.

[Dibs]

Good call...I find the Bills lack of an effective short yardage game on either side of the ball, to be the most troubling aspect of the team, for a few years now.  Even back in 2004, when the defense was so dominating the last 10 games, 3rd & 4th and short situations were brutal for them.  It is that way again.  They can't stop anyone when they need a yard or two to sustain a drive, and they can't get a yard or two when they need it to sustain a drive...it is pretty diheartening, and the one area where you can point to the lack of dominance by both the O & D lines, as the teams achilles heals...as cliche as it is. 

 

As for the offense, I would love to see the hard stats.  My rememberance of 2005 season was that McGahee didn't really get the opportunitys he should have in short yardage situations.  I remember Shaud Williams bobbing and weaving for 3 yard losses, ill fated QB sneaks, stupid gadget plays, and very little of just McGahee getting the ball...the coaching staff (staffs) seems to have little confidence in the O-line, in this area.

786909[/snapback]

WM has only had 2 opportunities for 3rd/4th & short this season(3 games).

In week one he failed with the 4th & 1(A.Thomas had a 3rd & short success in this game when WM hurt his ankle)

In week two he succeded on 3rd & 2.

Every single other 3rd/4th & short has beed a pass attempt(one being a fake punt pass)....except for a JP QB sneak.

The coaching staff have not given him enough oportunities to show us either way whether there is a problem there or not.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

As for the offense, I would love to see the hard stats.  My rememberance of 2005 season was that McGahee didn't really get the opportunitys he should have in short yardage situations.  I remember Shaud Williams bobbing and weaving for 3 yard losses, ill fated QB sneaks, stupid gadget plays, and very little of just McGahee getting the ball...the coaching staff (staffs) seems to have little confidence in the O-line, in this area.

786909[/snapback]

 

3rd down stats for willis run/rec 2005

 

first the total # of 3rd down opportunities

 

3rd down 15 28 66 0.0 2.4 1 7 60 0.0 8.6 19 10.1 3 0

 

situational 3rd down

Situation G Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD Rec Yds Y/G Avg Lng YAC 1stD TD

 

3D, < 3 yds 12 21 42 0.0 2.0 0 0 0 0.0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0

 

3D, 3-7 yds 6 4 23 0.0 5.8 1 3 42 0.0 14.0 19 11.0 3 0

 

3D, 8-10 yds 5 2 3 0.0 1.5 0 2 -1 0.0 -0.5 0 3.0 0 0

 

3D, 11+ yds 3 1 -2 0.0 -2.0 0 2 19 0.0 9.5 17 16.0 0 0

 

Shaud Williams 3rd down opportunities

 

3rd down 12 11 43 0.0 3.9 0 8 54 0.0 6.8 13 8.0 2 0

 

Situation G Rush Yds Y/G Avg TD Rec Yds Y/G Avg Lng YAC 1stD TD

 

3D, < 3 yds 3 2 5 0.0 2.5 0 0 0 0.0 0.0 0 0.0 0 0

 

3D, 3-7 yds 6 3 3 0.0 1.0 0 3 19 0.0 6.3 9 6.0 2 0

 

3D, 8-10 yds 5 2 6 0.0 3.0 0 3 12 0.0 4.0 8 7.3 0 0

 

3D, 11+ yds 5 4 29 0.0 7.3 0 2 23 0.0 11.5 13 12.0 0 0

 

the thing that strikes me is Willis doesnt seem at least from looking at the stats that he was really off the field that much on 3rd down it seems more of a case that we just didnt give him or shaud the ball. Honestly the thing Im impressed about in McGahee's 3rd down #'s is the rec #'s and makes me wonder why we didnt attempt more passes to the flat or dumpoffs to get him out in space. Not good on 3rd and short. I hate to put this all on one person. I think its a combination of oline and willis, I'm willing to give this new group time as willis has not had a signifcant amount of 3rd and short opportunities this season.

 

However looking at this years stats Id implore the bills to keep running willis to the left side of our offensive line where he's averaging a staggering 6.7ypc on 24 attempts for 161 yards. Im worried looking at these stats about the right side of our line, where willis has rushed 21 times for 56 yards and only 2.7 ypc. So Either Tutan Reyes and Mike Gandy are far superior run blockers, or something is really wrong with villarrial or peters, but willis has had far more success running to the left side of the line this year. On the surface this could also explain a lot of the non success on 3rd and short, if one side of the oline just isn't holding up, but like dibs pointed out there really is little relevance to complaining about 3rd and short this season as willis only has 3 attempts on 3rd down, and only 1 on 3rd and short.

[Buftex]

The coaching staff have not given him enough oportunities to show us either way whether there is a problem there or not.

786915[/snapback]

 

Yeah, that is my feeling too...but why has this been the case for three years now? Is it just a lack of confidence in the line, or is it a reflection of how they feel about McGahees' abilities? Either way, it is very frustrating. Like I said, the short yardage offense and defense has to improve...

[keepthefaith]

two words for you, jason Peters, put him in the backfield

786331[/snapback]

 

Might be a good idea, but you need players that can play low in short yardage situations. Peters might be a bit tall for that. Willis does not run low well or through small seams as well as some backs IMO.

[BADOLBILZ]

Over the last two years MaGahee hasn't been able to score in the red zone or pick up many 3rd and shorts. The line hasn't helped but the number of failed attempts is astonishing. Sooner or later we will have to let A-Train have a shot in this role if Willis can't get it done. I feel like the decision hasn't already been made because of the impact it might have on MaGahee.

 

You would think with MaGahee's size we wouldn't have the need for a short yardage back. He will feel the same way, and it will probably bother him even more since he feels like he's a true feature back.  Maybe he needs that fire lit under him to get things going, but if we switch to Thomas in short yardage he needs to accept the decision, and do everything in his power to improve.

785800[/snapback]

 

That wouldn't bother Willis. Haven't seen anything bother Willis since the Fiesta Bowl incident. Probably part of the problem.

[Pyrite Gal]

Might be a good idea, but you need players that can play low in short yardage situations.  Peters might be a bit tall for that.  Willis does not run low well or through small seams as well as some backs IMO.

786952[/snapback]

 

I will not be surprised if we see Peters in the backfield as they try different things in the redzone as:

 

1. Now that Marv is back at GM and one of the things he always held onto responsibility for when he was HC, regardless of who the OC might be was rezone playcalling. Under Marv they developed using Butch Rolle as an effective redzone tool and I think they will try to replicate using the TE well in that role.

 

2. Peters was initially a TE when drafted and was known for his soft hands, further in his ST stint with the Bills he not only blocked a punt but kept on gioing and recovered uit for a TD in the endzone showing his nose for the zone.

 

3. The actually already have used Peters as a TE eligible player and attempted a shovel pass to him on a long FG attempt in the NYJ game, I'm not sure what happened but it look like the holder (Moorman I assume) misfired on the shovel pass. Peters may escape blame and they will try him when the get in the redzone.

 

Peters presents a number of issues when the team goes to 2 TE sets on the goalline. Employment of him as a TE elegible presents options for the Bills because he really well my operate as a blocker primarily and the RDE is effectively taken out of the rush as he has to watch Peters because he may have to cover him on a quick pass.

 

If the RDE or outside rusher on that side does come for the QB. then Peters is free to catch the ball.

[stuckincincy]

Stuckincincy---the greatest of all in getting into the endsone---although he did it more by instinct than brute force.............

Marcus Allen.

786360[/snapback]

 

 

Right you are - what a remarkable player he was. A real money player. I looked up his stats...6 Pro bowls, Hall of Fame, 123 rush touchdown.