FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 Just now, mrags said: If the odds are that bad against 2 coaches that have actually made the Super Bowl, then what are they against a guy that has never been there as a HC like McDermott? I’ll take the bet now I guess. I’ll give you $5 and you pay me like $20m if he wins it. Fair? I do not think McD is a top 10 coach. I believe he benefits from having his dream defense between draft picks and free agency and completely lives off the offense the way it is and his future HOF QB. but since you asked, here’s a list of coaches I’d rather have than McD, not in any particular order: McVay Harbaugh Taylor Stefanski Campbell Ryans Pederson Reid McDaniel Shanahan Daboll Siriani Vrabel Bowles I'm not arguing that McD will surpass Reid. I think that's insane. You said you thought Sirianni might. It's possible, but extremely unlikely. The history of the NFL tells us this. I'm so glad that you posted a list though. McVay - fair, think he's a star HC Harbaugh - living off an SB from a decade ago. 1 playoff win since 2014. He's purple McDermott. Taylor - meh, he's okay, but I don't think he's special. Stefanski - 2 winning seasons and 1 playoff win, thought Deshaun Watson was worth a fully guaranteed contract and picks? Puke. Campbell - first playoff appearance ever. Nah. Ryans - great young coach, bright future, fair Pederson - Living off an SB from 6 years ago, but he's solid I guess. They choked away their division lead. Reid - yup McDaniel - never won a playoff game, completely choked away a massive division lead and now in a gigantic week 18 game? Think he's a good coach but when McD spanks him again, it will be clear he's #2 in the division Shanny - fair Daboll - the Giants are harrible. Danny Dimes was a disaster. He won COTY and one playoff game, so I'll give it to you. Sirianni - nah, he's looking more and more like a complete fraud. I think it's more likely McD is an HC in 2 years than Sirianni is. Vrabel - I like Vrabel. I think he can flat out coach and I think his teams are usually really tough. Titans are terrible now. Give it to you. Bowles - this is a joke, right? Anyone who has ever watched the Buccaneers ever, including Brady's twilight year, would know that Bowles' inexplicable coaching decisions have cost them many games. He was also a disaster in NY and hasn't learned. No chance. I think there's 8-9 in here that are arguable. The Bowles inclusion is absolutely bizarre, I think he's McD with a head injury personally. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 Winning cures all 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcam2012 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 29 minutes ago, FireChans said: Completely fair. Here's a list of the HC's hired in the last 3 seasons. Ryans Gannon Reich Steichen Daboll O'Connell McDaniel Eberflus Staley Saleh Smith McDaniels Campbell That list has 3 playoff wins between them. Now obviously, a lot of those teams are mediocre to bad, which is why they were in the head coaching market to begin with. But how many of those guys have bright futures in the league, in your opinion? Probably Steichen, McDaniel, Ryans and maaaaaaaybe O'Connell/Daboll. Campbell will probably be a solid HC, I don't think he's spectacular. Reich, McDaniels, Smith, Saleh, Eberflus, Staley are/were all disasters. Nice breakdown. Not a lot to quibble about here. I think it boils down to whether you feel a coaching change would be beneficial and worth the risk. Not an easy decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 32 minutes ago, FireChans said: I'm not arguing that McD will surpass Reid. I think that's insane. You said you thought Sirianni might. It's possible, but extremely unlikely. The history of the NFL tells us this. I'm so glad that you posted a list though. McVay - fair, think he's a star HC Harbaugh - living off an SB from a decade ago. 1 playoff win since 2014. He's purple McDermott. Taylor - meh, he's okay, but I don't think he's special. Stefanski - 2 winning seasons and 1 playoff win, thought Deshaun Watson was worth a fully guaranteed contract and picks? Puke. Campbell - first playoff appearance ever. Nah. Ryans - great young coach, bright future, fair Pederson - Living off an SB from 6 years ago, but he's solid I guess. They choked away their division lead. Reid - yup McDaniel - never won a playoff game, completely choked away a massive division lead and now in a gigantic week 18 game? Think he's a good coach but when McD spanks him again, it will be clear he's #2 in the division Shanny - fair Daboll - the Giants are harrible. Danny Dimes was a disaster. He won COTY and one playoff game, so I'll give it to you. Sirianni - nah, he's looking more and more like a complete fraud. I think it's more likely McD is an HC in 2 years than Sirianni is. Vrabel - I like Vrabel. I think he can flat out coach and I think his teams are usually really tough. Titans are terrible now. Give it to you. Bowles - this is a joke, right? Anyone who has ever watched the Buccaneers ever, including Brady's twilight year, would know that Bowles' inexplicable coaching decisions have cost them many games. He was also a disaster in NY and hasn't learned. No chance. I think there's 8-9 in here that are arguable. The Bowles inclusion is absolutely bizarre, I think he's McD with a head injury personally. A fair discussion would also link the QBs on all of their teams as well. Then contrast with Allen. McD doesn't have Palmer, Dalton, or Ryan to work with. He has Allen. Is he making the most of that opportunity? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 11 minutes ago, PBF81 said: A fair discussion would also link the QBs on all of their teams as well. Then contrast with Allen. McD doesn't have Palmer, Dalton, or Ryan to work with. He has Allen. Is he making the most of that opportunity? A truly fair discussion would also list their entire teams including their QB. But I don't think TBD supports that bandwidth. If we switch McD and Shanny only, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? Maybe. If we switch McD and Sirianni, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? I believe so, in McD's favor. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 8 minutes ago, FireChans said: A truly fair discussion would also list their entire teams including their QB. But I don't think TBD supports that bandwidth. If we switch McD and Shanny only, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? Maybe. If we switch McD and Sirianni, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? I believe so, in McD's favor. This is where we differ. I feel like if you switched McD with anyone of those coaches they would be the same or worse than all of them. 22 minutes ago, PBF81 said: A fair discussion would also link the QBs on all of their teams as well. Then contrast with Allen. McD doesn't have Palmer, Dalton, or Ryan to work with. He has Allen. Is he making the most of that opportunity? Thank you. Of all the arguments about those coaches and what they’ve accomplished. None of them (minus Reid, or maybe Taylor) have a QB with the talent and upside of Allen. He’s being wasted by this defensive minded, play not to lose, conservative waste of a coach. But he gives great speeches and he’s a really great guy so I guess we should keep him. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 (edited) 10 minutes ago, mrags said: This is where we differ. I feel like if you switched McD with anyone of those coaches they would be the same or worse than all of them. Thank you. Of all the arguments about those coaches and what they’ve accomplished. None of them (minus Reid, or maybe Taylor) have a QB with the talent and upside of Allen. He’s being wasted by this defensive minded, play not to lose, conservative waste of a coach. But he gives great speeches and he’s a really great guy so I guess we should keep him. You think the Eagles would have a bottom 2 defense in the NFL with McD out there? Man oh man. Not too mention killing McD for being "conservative" (he isn't, really) but taking Bowles over him? Wild stuff. Respect your opinion but I think we are seeing vastly different things. Edited January 3 by FireChans 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 (edited) 2 minutes ago, FireChans said: You think the Eagles would have a bottom 2 defense in the NFL with McD out there? Man oh man. Not too mention killing McD for being "conservative" (he isn't, really) but taking Bowles over him? Wild stuff. Respect your opinion but I think we are seeing vastly different things. Yeah we are. You see a guy that you want to keep at all costs because he brought the team out of the abyss. I see a guy that’s hindering our chances of moving forward and not winning meaningful games. Edited January 3 by mrags 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 2 minutes ago, mrags said: Yeah we are. You see a guy that you want to keep at all costs because he brought the team out of the abyss. I see a guy that’s hindering our chances of moving forward and not winning meaningful games. This week is pretty meaningful. I bet he wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 41 minutes ago, FireChans said: A truly fair discussion would also list their entire teams including their QB. But I don't think TBD supports that bandwidth. If we switch McD and Shanny only, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? Maybe. If we switch McD and Sirianni, and keep everything else the same, are their records much different? I believe so, in McD's favor. So iyo McD is optimizing Allen then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 2 minutes ago, PBF81 said: So iyo McD is optimizing Allen then? No. But imo no coach in the NFL is optimizing any of their teams right now, except maybe Harbaugh and the Ravens and Shanny and the Niners. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 21 minutes ago, FireChans said: This week is pretty meaningful. I bet he wins. Ok. Then let’s see how he does in the playoffs against real playoff teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel2014 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 I feel real good about this game, I don't care how we win it.... Just win it!!! I also really like our chances in the playoffs also. It seems like team offense all around the league is down a bit this year with a few exceptions obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 (edited) 13 minutes ago, FireChans said: No. But imo no coach in the NFL is optimizing any of their teams right now, except maybe Harbaugh and the Ravens and Shanny and the Niners. Sounds like a little hedging there. 🤨🤔😁 The others don't have Allen. 9 minutes ago, BuffaloBillsGospel2014 said: I feel real good about this game, I don't care how we win it.... Just win it!!! I also really like our chances in the playoffs also. It seems like team offense all around the league is down a bit this year with a few exceptions obviously. We should. Miami's coming in with one receiver, one RB, the receiver they are fielding injured, an injured QB. They're as decimated by injuries as they've been all season. If we can't win it, it'll make a bigger statement going the other way. Winning is expected for this game, we're the better team in better shape. Edited January 3 by PBF81 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 (edited) 21 minutes ago, mrags said: Ok. Then let’s see how he does in the playoffs against real playoff teams. Miami is a playoff team. They have your boy McDaniel who you think is a better coach. Unfortunately, he gets dog walked by McD. Only meaningful if we lose, I guess. 13 minutes ago, PBF81 said: Sounds like a little hedging there. 🤨🤔😁 The others don't have Allen. We should. Miami's coming in with one receiver, one RB, the receiver they are fielding injured, an injured QB. They're as decimated by injuries as they've been all season. If we can't win it, it'll make a bigger statement going the other way. Winning is expected for this game, we're the better team in better shape. No they just have Lamar Jackson, a soon to be 2 time MVP. And an offensive roster that is vastly better than ours at almost every position in the case of the Niners. It's not hedging at all. The Ravens and Niners are playing excellent football right now. The Bills are not. That may not be the case in two weeks. We'll find out. We know that the Ravens have endured multiple disappointing seasons with Harbaugh not optimizing his team and/or Lamar and here there are now. Same with the Niners. That's the NFL. Edited January 3 by FireChans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 minute ago, FireChans said: Miami is a playoff team. They have your boy McDaniel who you think is a better coach. Unfortunately, he gets dog walked by McD. Only meaningful if we lose, I guess. Oh I have no doubt they will win this week. And win some games in the playoffs. And then he’ll turtle up like the ultra conservative coach he is later in the playoffs. Taking FGs whenever he gets the chance. Punting from the 45 yard line to play the field position game. Not utilizing Superman at the QB position. Having terrible clock management and taking terrible timeouts at horrible times. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 6 minutes ago, FireChans said: Miami is a playoff team. They have your boy McDaniel who you think is a better coach. Unfortunately, he gets dog walked by McD. Only meaningful if we lose, I guess. No they just have Lamar Jackson, a soon to be 2 time MVP. And an offensive roster that is vastly better than ours at almost every position in the case of the Niners. It's not hedging at all. The Ravens and Niners are playing excellent football right now. The Bills are not. That may not be the case in two weeks. We'll find out. We know that the Ravens have endured multiple disappointing seasons with Harbaugh not optimizing his team and/or Lamar and here there are now. Same with the Niners. That's the NFL. Which skill positions on the Ravens are better than ours? Also, I thought you just said that's they were also underachieving? You seem to be arguing against yourself here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 3 minutes ago, mrags said: Oh I have no doubt they will win this week. And win some games in the playoffs. And then he’ll turtle up like the ultra conservative coach he is later in the playoffs. Taking FGs whenever he gets the chance. Punting from the 45 yard line to play the field position game. Not utilizing Superman at the QB position. Having terrible clock management and taking terrible timeouts at horrible times. Sean McDermott ranked 8th in fourth down aggression index a few years ago. Kinda tough to argue with that stat. 2 minutes ago, PBF81 said: Which skill positions on the Ravens are better than ours? Also, I thought you just said that's they were also underachieving? You seem to be arguing against yourself here. What? I said the Niners. Did you read my post? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 11 minutes ago, FireChans said: Sean McDermott ranked 8th in fourth down aggression index a few years ago. Kinda tough to argue with that stat. What? I said the Niners. Did you read my post? How many FGs last week? 5. Thought so. How many pints near mid field? Thought so. just stop. You obviously aren’t going to change my mind and I’m obviously not going to change yours. I hope I’m wrong and McD proves me wrong. And if he does I’ll gladly say I was wrong. The question is, if he fails again at the worst time like .13 seconds, like multiple other screw ups. When it means the most. How will you react. You still going to make excuses for him? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 minute ago, mrags said: How many FGs last week? 5. Thought so. How many pints near mid field? Thought so. just stop. You obviously aren’t going to change my mind and I’m obviously not going to change yours. I hope I’m wrong and McD proves me wrong. And if he does I’ll gladly say I was wrong. The question is, if he fails again at the worst time like .13 seconds, like multiple other screw ups. When it means the most. How will you react. You still going to make excuses for him? I don’t know. Depends on what happens. I will laugh at the Harbaugh love if they get bounced in the playoffs again early and ask if he’s still such a better coach. I’ll also laugh when McDaniel gets trounced and bounced and ask if he’s still such a better coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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