Has Josh Allen reached his ceiling?

[Sherlock Holmes]

He has reached his basement floor and his ceiling is still 100 floors up

[GunnerBill]

18 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Josh has normal trust issues imo.

 

He didn’t trust the OL to start 2023. He was bailing out of the pocket in like 1 second predicting them to fall apart. He has settled in a little bit more as the season as gone on. 
 

I think he doesn’t trust Davis on the contested catches anymore. He’s starting to trust Shakir and Kincaid. He trusts Diggs over everybody. And when Diggs is beating coverages consistently, Josh is consistent. When Diggs ain’t, Josh ain’t.
 

Money-wise, I think it’s impossible but trading for a Diontae Johnson-type guy next year to pair with Diggs would completely unlock Josh, imo. Diggs, Johnson, Shakir, Kincaid, Knox, rookie WR would probably best one of the best pass catcher groups in the AFC.

 

Yea Gabe is gone. Whatever they do at WR2 needs to be an upgrade. Either via trade or draft. 

[hondo in seattle]

13 hours ago, AZSanta said:

I have been an Allen supporter since he was drafted. I felt he was a perfect fit for the city. He is in year 6 of his career and has put up fairly consistent stats the last 3 years. Have we seen his best football or can he be better? By better I mean 5000+ passing yards and 50+ total tds. I personally believe he has hit his ceiling. I think he is what he is and I think we can win a Super Bowl with him playing at this level. I am just curios what others opinions are as to what they expect from him the rest of his career.

 

No.   I think to see Josh at his very best...

 

(1)  Get him an OC that can make optimal use of his unique skill set while at the same time correcting/covering up his flaws.  Dorsey wasn't that guy.  

 

(2)  Get him an OL.   This year's OL is probably his best yet.  But I'd love to watch Josh with time to operate behind an elite line.  A dominant OL would also force defenders to respect the run game instead of sitting back in two-high zones.  

 

(3)  Get him a better receiving corps.  In fact, I'd be thrilled with just one change: replace Gabe with a speedster with hands.  

 

Do these three things and Josh will start winning MVP awards and setting even more records.  

 

 

 

[AZSanta]

13 hours ago, Augie said:

We should sell high. Very high. 

I'm not saying we should trade him. I love watching him play. As I said I believe we can win a Super Bowl with him as is. I ' think we will see Drew Brees or Tom Brady level of excellence from him. I'm okay with it.

13 hours ago, Buffalo03 said:

I think he can hit 5000 passing yards eventually but 50 TDs might be a stretch. How much more do you want from him? Lol

I said i believe we can win a Super Bowl with him. I don't see him going to another level like Brees, Brady, Mahommes, and Manning.

[Mikie2times]

I think 2021 was his ceiling (for now). He was nearly perfect in several games that year. He had a coordinator that understood what he needed to be successful. Defenses had yet to adjust to what we see now, so you got to see his full skill set on display. Teams didn't spy him all the time. They didn't slow rush him so he was able to escape a lot which opened his rushing and improvisation more. Things we just don't see nearly as often as teams have taken it away. 

 

I think a better question would be what would he need to do in order to be better. From my perspective the offensive system needs to be a better fit. Dabs was excellent at designing plays that helped Josh be deliberate with his decisions.  His weapons need to be a better fit. He is made for a big body WR and we have never given him one. Somebody like a Courtland Sutton with a big catch radius. Then I think it's just about maturity and personal and mental growth. As a player and as a person. He appears to me to still be somewhat stuck in that college mindset. "let's get F'in wasted". You see it in his golf outings. All that is fine. But it speaks to what I'm saying. An extremely well adjusted person at the top of his craft is not doing those things. A CEO of a company does not ask that person to run his business. He see's it right away, that person just isn't ready yet. 

[AZSanta]

12 hours ago, Fan in Chicago said:

What do you have to support your contention besides your own belief? This is a strange post. 

Yep. 

I am going by his past 3 seasons with similar stats mid 4000 passing yards and just above 40 tds. Combine that with his psychological issues and I think we have seen the best he can give from him. I love the guy I have 2 of his Jerseys, one up on my wall. He is the best thing to happen to Buffalo since Levy, Kelly, and Polian.

[GoBills808]

3 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

I think 2021 was his ceiling (for now). He was nearly perfect in several games that year. He had a coordinator that understood what he needed to be successful. Defenses had yet to adjust to what we see now, so you got to see his full skill set on display. Teams didn't spy him all the time. They didn't slow rush him so he was able to escape a lot which opened his rushing and improvisation more. Things we just don't see nearly as often as teams have taken it away. 

 

I think a better question would be what would he need to do in order to be better. From my perspective the offensive system needs to be a better fit. Dabs was excellent at designing plays that helped Josh be deliberate with his decisions.  His weapons need to be a better fit. He is made for a big body WR and we have never given him one. Somebody like a Courtland Sutton with a big catch radius. Then I think it's just about maturity and personal and mental growth. As a player and as a person. He appears to me to still be somewhat stuck in that college mindset. "let's get F'in wasted". You see it in his golf outings. All that is fine. But it speaks to what I'm saying. An extremely well adjusted person at the top of his craft is not doing those things. A CEO of a company does not ask that person to run his business. He see's it right away, that person just isn't ready yet. 

An extremely well adjusted person at the top of their craft isn't playing golf? 

[AZSanta]

12 hours ago, ToGoGo said:

Stupidity thread. 

I/m sorry my opinion offends you snowflake

[Augie]

55 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea Gabe is gone. Whatever they do at WR2 needs to be an upgrade. Either via trade or draft. 

 

I was one holding out hope that he could become a steady and complete WR. Sadly, it looks like that will not happen in a Bills uniform. I can live with that, especially when I keep hearing about how strong and deep the WR draft class is. We just need to nail one or two of those guys and we will be set with Diggs, Kincaid and the supporting cast. 

[Mikie2times]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

An extremely well adjusted person at the top of their craft isn't playing golf? 

They don't hit the course and shotgun beers as the status quo. Plenty of people in this world with self control. Nobody is going to pick a person who doesn't have that to lead an organization. 

[JaCrispy]

The Patriots and Chiefs were his ceiling…And that’s fine with me, because you can’t get any better than that…

 

So, now the question becomes ‘how consistently can he be at, or near, his ceiling?’

[AZSanta]

11 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

I cannot wait to bump this thread in a couple years

I will be ecstatic if i'm wrong. So lets revisit this when he is 35 years old.

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Mikie2times said:

They don't hit the course and shotgun beers as the status quo. Plenty of people in this world with self control. Nobody is going to pick a person who doesn't have that to lead an organization. 

Is that the status quo when he golfs?

[Mikie2times]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

Is that the status quo when he golfs?

he has videos on youtube that get posted of his golf outings. I used to drink like he does. Not exactly hard to spot the type. 

[GoBills808]

5 minutes ago, AZSanta said:

I will be ecstatic if i'm wrong. So lets revisit this when he is 35 years old.

No offense but I question whether you would recognize his ceiling if you saw it

 

The consternation around Allen this year is fascinating to me...he is playing the most efficient ball out of any QB in the league rn in the midst of probably his best season ever and people can't stop talking about what's wrong w him.

[Mikie2times]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

No offense but I question whether you would recognize his ceiling if you saw it

 

The consternation around Allen this year is fascinating to me...he is playing the most efficient ball out of any QB in the league rn in the midst of probably his best season ever and people can't stop talking about what's wrong w him.

You're basically insulting the guys because he asked a pretty legitimate question. You're so sensitive about anything to do with Josh it's hard to even have a logical conversation with you. You have eyes dude. He single handedly lost us the Jets game and probably at least one more if you're being honest. You will cling to EPA. When EPA doesn't fit your narrative it will be TD's. When TD's doesn't fit your narrative it will be other players. On it goes, the cycle of the insanity. The OP never said Josh wasn't an elite QB. Get off the horse.  

[jethro_tull]

Talent level- yes.  Game smarts, decision making and maturity- no.  

[AZSanta]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

No offense but I question whether you would recognize his ceiling if you saw it

 

The consternation around Allen this year is fascinating to me...he is playing the most efficient ball out of any QB in the league rn in the midst of probably his best season ever and people can't stop talking about what's wrong w him.

No offense taken. I certainly there is potential for him to be better. My main concern with him is his maturity level and mental ability to deal with adversity. He seems to take negative games to heart and maybe feels the pressure of the fans and media bashing his turnovers. You can see it in his demeanor when they lose and his post game press conference. I hope he can grow into a more mature QB with age and experience. He needs a mentor. McDermott aint doing him any favors with his coaching style

[KDIGGZ]

Absolutely reached his ceiling athletically 2 years ago and is now in decline. He can continue to play at a high level if he relies less on his athleticism and is able to develop his game mentally. But he got to this point by having a strong arm and scrambling ability and not needing to have good timing and good play recognition so it would be re-learning how to do things.

 

Cam Newton could not do it. As soon as he declined athletically he was done. Michael Vick was able to somewhat. He became more of a pocket passer after prison. Big Ben was never the fastest guy but once he lost his athleticism he was basically a statue out there but he was so big and hard to bring down that he was able to take some hits and still deliver the ball. Could go either way but yes I think Josh has already peaked and it will be a completely different Josh than what we are used to by the end of his contract. If he re-signs we will be signing a completely different guy at that point.

[AZSanta]

2 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

Absolutely reached his ceiling athletically 2 years ago and is now in decline. He can continue to play at a high level if he relies less on his athleticism and is able to develop his game mentally. But he got to this point by having a strong arm and scrambling ability and not needing to have good timing and good play recognition so it would be re-learning how to do things.

 

Cam Newton could not do it. As soon as he declined athletically he was done. Michael Vick was able to somewhat. He became more of a pocket passer after prison. Big Ben was never the fastest guy but once he lost his athleticism he was basically a statue out there but he was so big and hard to bring down that he was able to take some hits and still deliver the ball. Could go either way but yes I think Josh has already peaked and it will be a completely different Josh than what we are used to by the end of his contract. If he re-signs we will be signing a completely different guy at that point.

Well said. Thanks for your response.