Potential Number 1 pick Jalen Carter Arrest Warrant

[Doc]

56 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Of course he's going to fight the charges---he's looking at massive civil suits down the road.  He would love to have charges dropped for that reason.

 

Problem his defense has is that Two people died because of the actions of the 2 drivers. The have him on tape committing the 2 misdemeanors. He lied to the cops repeatedly.  The incident is a national story.  Why wouldn't the DA take this slam dunk as it is?  It's not like he will do time.

 

If that were true, he'd have been charged with far more than just 2 misdemeanors.  They have video of the accident and there were 2 other passengers in the SUV that crashed that survived, and they undoubtedly already talked to police about what happened (as much as they could remember).  The person responsible is Chandler Lecroy, who was driving drunk.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Doc

[Mr. WEO]

16 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

If that were true, he'd have been charged with far more than just 2 misdemeanors.  They have video of the accident and there were 2 other passengers in the SUV that crashed that survived, and they undoubtedly already talked to police about what happened (as much as they could remember).  The person responsible is Chandler Lecroy, who was driving drunk.

 

What else might he be charged with other than what he was charged with?

 

Why was she driving so fast?  Was she not racing the other car?  You know she was.  Will the other passengers say it was not Carter that she was racing?  How does this play out? 

[Doc]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

What else might he be charged with other than what he was charged with?

 

Why was she driving so fast?  Was she not racing the other car?  You know she was.  Will the other passengers say it was not Carter that she was racing?  How does this play out? 

 

I have no idea what else he might be charged with.  But it's been almost 7 weeks since the crash and I doubt they'll find any more evidence at this point.  And I'm not sure what else they could find.  Even if he said "let's race" it's still on her for being drunk and listening.

 

Any lawyers know if there's a precedent for this?

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I have no idea what else he might be charged with.  But it's been almost 7 weeks since the crash and I doubt they'll find any more evidence at this point.  And I'm not sure what else they could find.  Even if he said "let's race" it's still on her for being drunk and listening.

 

Any lawyers know if there's a precedent for this?

 

No one is claiming it's not "on her".  They have him on film driving recklessly and racing, so they charged him with those.  Not much wiggle room there.

 

It's much harder to argue that, had he simply said goodnight to his drunk friends and gone home, that the same outcome would have happened without the racing between the 2 drivers, unless you are prepared to argue that racing had nothing to do with the outcome of the passengers in that car.

 

 

 

 

[Doc]

57 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

No one is claiming it's not "on her".  They have him on film driving recklessly and racing, so they charged him with those.  Not much wiggle room there.

 

It's much harder to argue that, had he simply said goodnight to his drunk friends and gone home, that the same outcome would have happened without the racing between the 2 drivers, unless you are prepared to argue that racing had nothing to do with the outcome of the passengers in that car.

 

Yeah and that's why I said he'll likely get a misdemeanor. 

 

Her fatal error was getting behind the wheel while drunk, during which there are any number of ways to get yourself killed that don't involve drag racing.

 

You know, sometimes a victim is wholly responsible for what happens to him/her.

[Mr. WEO]

7 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yeah and that's why I said he'll likely get a misdemeanor. 

 

Her fatal error was getting behind the wheel while drunk, during which there are any number of ways to get yourself killed that don't involve drag racing.

 

You know, sometimes a victim is wholly responsible for what happens to him/her.

 

He's only been charged with misdemeanors.  Both based on the videos.  That's not being debated.

 

So your position  is that racing played no role at all in the crash?  None...?

[Doc]

31 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

He's only been charged with misdemeanors.  Both based on the videos.  That's not being debated.

 

So your position  is that racing played no role at all in the crash?  None...?

 

Yes I agree it wasn't being debated.  The only debate was how many misdemeanors he would be charged with and that remains to be seen.

 

And in this instance, being drunk was the main reason for the crash.  Was Carter responsible for her being drunk and getting behind the wheel?  Speeding likely played a role but did Carter force her to speed?  What if she's the one who said "let's race" and/or others in her car implored her to race him?

 

Again being charged with just 2 misdemeanors after 7 weeks with video and witnesses says to me no further charges are coming.   But as above, that remains to be seen.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Doc

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yes I agree it wasn't being debated.  The only debate was how many misdemeanors he would be charged with and that remains to be seen.

 

And in this instance, being drunk was the main reason for the crash.  Was Carter responsible for her being drunk and getting behind the wheel?  Speeding likely played a role but did Carter force her to speed?  What if she's the one who said "let's race" and/or others in her car implored her to race him?

 

Again being charged with just 2 misdemeanors after 7 weeks with video and witnesses says to me no further charges are coming.   But as above, that remains to be seen.

 

Not sure why you keep bringing that question up.  It's "2".

 

It really doesn't matter who or what prompted Carter to race his drunk friend.  Only that he did---in obvious disregard for the safety of everyone in both cars.   His choice was decline and/or drive away...or accept the challenge and race this person who was unfit to drive at any speed. 

He chose the latter. 

[Doc]

5 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Not sure why you keep bringing that question up.  It's "2".

 

It really doesn't matter who or what prompted Carter to race his drunk friend.  Only that he did---in obvious disregard for the safety of everyone in both cars.   His choice was decline and/or drive away...or accept the challenge and race this person who was unfit to drive at any speed. 

He chose the latter. 

 

I mean what he'll ultimately get.  I say 1, you say 2.  We'll see.

 

Three other people got into the car with Lecroy, meaning they didn't think she was too unfit to drive and risk their lives.  And just because Carter was speeding doesn't mean she had to follow suit.  It's on her and her alone.

[Mr. WEO]

5 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I mean what he'll ultimately get.  I say 1, you say 2.  We'll see.

 

Three other people got into the car with Lecroy, meaning they didn't think she was too unfit to drive and risk their lives.  And just because Carter was speeding doesn't mean she had to follow suit.  It's on her and her alone.

why was Carter “speeding”, as you call it…and weaving across traffic and into the opposite direction lane?  He wasn’t racing?

 

since he chose to race a drunk who was driving a car full of his friends, he bears zero responsibility?  The other driver should have simply used better judgement than a sober Carter—even though she was more than double the legal limit intoxicated?  

 

that’s your new argument? 

[Doc]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

why was Carter “speeding”, as you call it…and weaving across traffic and into the opposite direction lane?  He wasn’t racing?

 

since he chose to race a drunk who was driving a car full of his friends, he bears zero responsibility?  The other driver should have simply used better judgement than a sober Carter—even though she was more than double the legal limit intoxicated?  

 

that’s your new argument? 

 

Why stop at drag racing?  Why didn't he take her keys from her before she got into the SUV?  Why didn't he prevent her from drinking to excess in the first place?

 

He has no legal responsibility (that's on the bar).  Moral maybe, if he knew she was too drunk to drive.  But again as I said, the 3 people who got into the SUV with her didn't think she was and they had far more to lose than Carter did.

[Mr. WEO]

4 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Why stop at drag racing?  Why didn't he take her keys from her before she got into the SUV?  Why didn't he prevent her from drinking to excess in the first place?

 

He has no legal responsibility (that's on the bar).  Moral maybe, if he knew she was too drunk to drive.  But again as I said, the 3 people who got into the SUV with her didn't think she was and they had far more to lose than Carter did.

he had no obligation to take her keys.  But his reckless driving and racing with the drunk driver clearly contributed to the fatal crash.  he had a legal responsibility not to break those  laws. So Your response makes no sense. Was he also too drunk to make sound decisions? 

3 drunk kids get into a car with a drunk driver.  Stop me if you’ve heard this one before.  

 

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

he had no obligation to take her keys.  But his reckless driving and racing with the drunk driver clearly contributed to the fatal crash.  he had a legal responsibility not to break those  laws. So Your response makes no sense. Was he also too drunk to make sound decisions? 

3 drunk kids get into a car with a drunk driver.  Stop me if you’ve heard this one before. 

 

Yes because what makes sense is that neither Carter nor her passengers had any idea she was drunk when she got into the SUV...but he should have realized it after they started driving and thus never should have been drag racing with her.  Good one.  And despite acting recklessly by drag racing, he didn't kill himself or anyone in his car.  You think that was just luck? 

[Mr. WEO]

6 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yes because what makes sense is that neither Carter nor her passengers had any idea she was drunk when she got into the SUV...but he should have realized it after they started driving and thus never should have been drag racing with her.  Good one.  And despite acting recklessly by drag racing, he didn't kill himself or anyone in his car.  You think that was just luck? 

so, again, you’re position is that being drunk should not have clouded any person in the crashed  car’s judgement.  
 

And, also, his decision to break the law driving as he did (racing) with a drunk person in the other car, thus contributing to the crash…is the (moral? or something?) equivalent of not taking her keys  away?

 

solid doc!

[Doc]

4 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

so, again, you’re position is that being drunk should not have clouded any person in the crashed  car’s judgement.  
 

And, also, his decision to break the law driving as he did (racing) with a drunk person in the other car, thus contributing to the crash…is the (moral? or something?) equivalent of not taking her keys  away?

 

solid doc!

 

Nothing's as solid as thinking that Carter only realized she was drunk after she started driving, not before getting behind the wheel, when it would have been most appropriate to intervene.  Much less thinking that drag racing is the only way to have a fatal crash while drunk driving.

 

Anyway, keep waiting for more charges.  It always works out well for you when you do...

[Mr. WEO]

12 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Nothing's as solid as thinking that Carter only realized she was drunk after she started driving, not before getting behind the wheel, when it would have been most appropriate to intervene.  Much less thinking that drag racing is the only way to have a fatal crash while drunk driving.

 

Anyway, keep waiting for more charges.  It always works out well for you when you do...

 

You keep getting it backwards.  I've argued the opposite.  He knew before the race began. How did you miss that? 

 

I haven't stated anywhere he will get more charges.  Over and over, I said he has 2 charges, based on video evidence.

 

Also, I haven't stated that the only way to crash while driving drunk is by racing.

 

You made all that up.   You're arguing with yourself as this point.

 

You really aren't making sense here, doc.  

[Beck Water]

On 3/3/2023 at 12:09 PM, Mr. WEO said:

Who had he spoken to?

Press, at the combine

[Mr. WEO]

14 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

Press, at the combine

 

He was scheduled to speak, then canceled and announced he wouldn't be speaking at the combine. His lawyers released some statements in the first person on his behalf.

[Doc]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

You keep getting it backwards.  I've argued the opposite.  He knew before the race began. How did you miss that? 

 

I haven't stated anywhere he will get more charges.  Over and over, I said he has 2 charges, based on video evidence.

 

Also, I haven't stated that the only way to crash while driving drunk is by racing.

 

You made all that up.   You're arguing with yourself as this point.

 

You really aren't making sense here, doc.  

 

He did?  From where did you get that?  No, you made that part up.  You don't even know who initiated the drag race.  And you're using that to make the claim that the 2 misdemeanors have nochoice but to stick. 

 

Typically a DA will charge someone with everything they can and then usually will reduce it to 1 charge in a plea deal.  The same should happen here because the DA knows that Lecroy was at fault for driving drunk and wants to get the part with Carter out of the way.  And I would hazard a guess that he has evidence she initiated the drag race.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Doc

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

He did?  From where did you get that?  No, you made that part up.  You don't even know who initiated the drag race.  And you're using that to make the claim that the 2 misdemeanors have to choice but to stick. 

 

Typically a DA will charge someone with everything they can and then usually will reduce it to 1 charge in a plea deal.  The same should happen here because the DA knows that Lecroy was at fault for driving drunk, and I would hazard a guess that he has evidence she initiated the drag race.

 

I'm pretty certain the video demonstrating his reckless driving (charge 1) and street racing (charge 2) is what the cops arrested him on and the DA charged him on, doc, not "who initiated the drag race".  I'm pretty sure "incitement to drag race" is not a crime, lol.  

 

Anyway, you are still struggling unnecessarily.  The incident was hours after the Bulldogs victory parade. There are images of both cars stopped before the race and a person going from one car to the other. There is video of them both a stoplight, from which they commenced the race.  

 

The likelihood that all of these teammates and football staff were not together partying at the championship parade in the hours before the crash is far less than they just happened to, by chance, encounter one another at a red light in town and decided to "hey, I hope we're all sober---cuz it's time to race!!"

 

That's what you're left pushing now?

 

Also, this punk is a repeat offender.  Earlier in the season, he was pulled over for doing 89 in a 45.  Here's how that went:

 

'Your break is you're not going to jail. Because that would make all kinds of news, right?' the officer says.

'I don't know if y'all need to send out a text or something to your teammates, slow down,' the officer continues. 'We wouldn't be talking if you were going the speed limit. I could care less about tint violation. But that was reckless. When you are around your teammates, just tell them to slow down. It's so easy to slow down.'

The officer proceeds to explain the separate citations and information for Carter's traffic court date. 

He finally once again repeats his plea to slow down. 'Slow down, OK? That's all I ask.'

 

The jock sniffing cop let him go with a few citations. 

 

So you're saying that a guy who has been citing and warned by law enforcement about reckless driving is going to get off of a reckless driving misdemeanor in a racing incident that resulted in the death of 2 people?

[Doc]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

I'm pretty certain the video demonstrating his reckless driving (charge 1) and street racing (charge 2) is what the cops arrested him on and the DA charged him on, doc, not "who initiated the drag race".  I'm pretty sure "incitement to drag race" is not a crime, lol.  

 

Anyway, you are still struggling unnecessarily.  The incident was hours after the Bulldogs victory parade. There are images of both cars stopped before the race and a person going from one car to the other. There is video of them both a stoplight, from which they commenced the race.  

 

The likelihood that all of these teammates and football staff were not together partying at the championship parade in the hours before the crash is far less than they just happened to, by chance, encounter one another at a red light in town and decided to "hey, I hope we're all sober---cuz it's time to race!!"

 

That's what you're left pushing now?

 

Also, this punk is a repeat offender.  Earlier in the season, he was pulled over for doing 89 in a 45.  Here's how that went:

 

'Your break is you're not going to jail. Because that would make all kinds of news, right?' the officer says.

'I don't know if y'all need to send out a text or something to your teammates, slow down,' the officer continues. 'We wouldn't be talking if you were going the speed limit. I could care less about tint violation. But that was reckless. When you are around your teammates, just tell them to slow down. It's so easy to slow down.'

The officer proceeds to explain the separate citations and information for Carter's traffic court date. 

He finally once again repeats his plea to slow down. 'Slow down, OK? That's all I ask.'

 

The jock sniffing cop let him go with a few citations. 

 

So you're saying that a guy who has been citing and warned by law enforcement about reckless driving is going to get off of a reckless driving misdemeanor in a racing incident that resulted in the death of 2 people?

 

A young guy speeding.  That's the smoking gun!  LOL!

 

Interesting that he attended the same parade and didn't get drunk, or at least drunk enough to crash his car.  Or that no one could determine she was drunk before she got behind the wheel, much less the person going from one car to the next.  It was all on Carter to determine at the stoplight that she was drunk.  Good one!

 

You've got no point here as it relates to Carter's responsibility for Lecroy's terrible decisions that night.  If absolving people of their responsibility for getting drunk and doing stupid stuff were a thing, no one would ever get charged. 

 

The DA has bigger problems to worry about given the legal mess she left behind and he'll want to get Carter's part out of the way by offering a plea deal for 1 misdemeanor, now that he knows Carter will fight.  So again, we'll see who is right.

[Mr. WEO]

23 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

A young guy speeding.  That's the smoking gun!  LOL!

 

Interesting that he attended the same parade and didn't get drunk, or at least drunk enough to crash his car.  Or that no one could determine she was drunk before she got behind the wheel, much less the person going from one car to the next.  It was all on Carter to determine at the stoplight that she was drunk.  Good one!

 

You've got no point here as it relates to Carter's responsibility for Lecroy's terrible decisions that night.  If absolving people of their responsibility for getting drunk and doing stupid stuff were a thing, no one would ever get charged. 

 

The DA has bigger problems to worry about given the legal mess she left behind and he'll want to get Carter's part out of the way by offering a plea deal for 1 misdemeanor, now that he knows Carter will fight.  So again, we'll see who is right.

smoking gun?  He has a prior for speeding where the world just saw the cop tell him he was reckless—and that he was going to give him a break,  if he just agrees to stop driving recklessly.  How did that turn out?
 

Lol “he didn’t get drunk” .  What else? He couldn’t see his buddies were drunk?  He can’t recognize drunk college students?  It’s all too inscrutable to ever discern? 
 

anyway, he made one terrible decision: to race that young woman, drunk or sober.  
 

what legal mess has she left behind that is a problem for the DA?  She’s dead.  He’s the only one facing charges?  What are you talking about now?  Your argument keeps lurching all over the place 

[Doc]

9 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

smoking gun?  He has a prior for speeding where the world just saw the cop tell him he was reckless—and that he was going to give him a break,  if he just agrees to stop driving recklessly.  How did that turn out?
 

Lol “he didn’t get drunk” .  What else? He couldn’t see his buddies were drunk?  He can’t recognize drunk college students?  It’s all too inscrutable to ever discern? 
 

anyway, he made one terrible decision: to race that young woman, drunk or sober.  
 

what legal mess has she left behind that is a problem for the DA?  She’s dead.  He’s the only one facing charges?  What are you talking about now?  Your argument keeps lurching all over the place 

 

Did he crash his car?  Or do only drunk women crash their cars while drag racing?  And why do you think he'd have allowed her to even drive the car if he knew she was drunk?  Because...he likes to speed?  He's a football player?  Something else?  No wait, he only realized it at the stoplight.  LOL! 

 

As for telling someone to stop doing something, given your career, you know how absurd that thought process is.  But it turned out that he got charged with 2 misdemeanors, as he should have, which will likely be reduced to 1 when the DA agrees to a plea deal because he has more important matters to attend to, not only with that case but in general.  But nothing he gets charged with will make him legally responsible for her or his teammate's death.

[4merper4mer]

36 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Did he crash his car?  Or do only drunk women crash their cars while drag racing?  And why do you think he'd have allowed her to even drive the car if he knew she was drunk?  Because...he likes to speed?  He's a football player?  Something else?  No wait, he only realized it at the stoplight.  LOL! 

 

As for telling someone to stop doing something, given your career, you know how absurd that thought process is.  But it turned out that he got charged with 2 misdemeanors, as he should have, which will likely be reduced to 1 when the DA agrees to a plea deal because he has more important matters to attend to, not only with that case but in general.  But nothing he gets charged with will make him legally responsible for her or his teammate's death.

I’m with WEO on this one.  The dude left the scene and lied to cops about it.  Nice “friend”.  I wouldn’t draft him.  Legally responsible?  Only if something new comes to light like he crowded her while racing and she swerved.  He certainly contributed to the situation.  If he didn’t engage in the race, there is likely a different result.

[Doc]

14 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

I’m with WEO on this one.  The dude left the scene and lied to cops about it.  Nice “friend”.  I wouldn’t draft him.  Legally responsible?  Only if something new comes to light like he crowded her while racing and she swerved.  He certainly contributed to the situation.  If he didn’t engage in the race, there is likely a different result.

 

The Bills have no shot at him.  And leaving the scene might disqualify him character-wise for the Bills.

 

As for leaving the scene, it's not a good look (it's interesting that he wasn't charged for it) but it doesn't make him responsible for the accident.  Nor does racing her as there are other ways to die when you drive drunk. 

 

If he or anyone else knew she was drunk, she should never have been allowed behind the wheel, period.  WEO just has to go with his "he should have known before they started racing" so as to place the blame solely on him, when prior to that about a dozen people could be held responsible for letting her get behind the wheel.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Doc

[4merper4mer]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

 

The Bills have no shot at him.  And leaving the scene might disqualify him character-wise for the Bills.

 

As for leaving the scene, it's not a good look (it's interesting that he wasn't charged for it) but it doesn't make him responsible for the accident.  Nor does racing her as there are other ways to die when you drive drunk. 

 

If he or anyone else knew she was drunk, she should never have been allowed behind the wheel, period.  WEO just has to go with his "he should have known before they started racing" so as to place the blame solely on him, when prior to that about a dozen people could be held responsible for letting her get behind the wheel.

If they were racing and he made a little swerve at her causing her to overreact I could see holding him partially responsible.  I’m not saying it happened but it is certainly plausible.  Lots of things could have prevented it, including some things Carter could have done.  It is far from “just on Carter” but he was part of this and bears some responsibility.  He also had subsequent chances to be truthful and demurred.

 

I have not seen WEO solely put the blame on anyone and in case you haven’t noticed, I’m not exactly in lock step with him on most topics.

[FireChans]

3 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

If they were racing and he made a little swerve at her causing her to overreact I could see holding him partially responsible.  I’m not saying it happened but it is certainly plausible.  Lots of things could have prevented it, including some things Carter could have done.  It is far from “just on Carter” but he was part of this and bears some responsibility.  He also had subsequent chances to be truthful and demurred.

 

I have not seen WEO solely put the blame on anyone and in case you haven’t noticed, I’m not exactly in lock step with him on most topics.

Or you’re really WEO’s alt and he’s been saving you for this perfect time to beat Doc 

[Doc]

3 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

If they were racing and he made a little swerve at her causing her to overreact I could see holding him partially responsible.  I’m not saying it happened but it is certainly plausible.  Lots of things could have prevented it, including some things Carter could have done.  It is far from “just on Carter” but he was part of this and bears some responsibility.  He also had subsequent chances to be truthful and demurred.

 

I have not seen WEO solely put the blame on anyone and in case you haven’t noticed, I’m not exactly in lock step with him on most topics.

 

They have video of the crash and if he swerved at/hit her, he would have been charged with more than just drag racing.  And again this assumes that Carter knew she was drunk, which would mean he tried to lead her to her/her passengers' deaths.  They've had time to investigate and if he did, again he wouldn't have been charged with just drag racing.

 

3 hours ago, FireChans said:

Or you’re really WEO’s alt and he’s been saving you for this perfect time to beat Doc 

 

More like continue to lose...

Edited March 6, 2023 by Doc

[Mr. WEO]

16 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Did he crash his car?  Or do only drunk women crash their cars while drag racing?  And why do you think he'd have allowed her to even drive the car if he knew she was drunk?  Because...he likes to speed?  He's a football player?  Something else?  No wait, he only realized it at the stoplight.  LOL! 

 

As for telling someone to stop doing something, given your career, you know how absurd that thought process is.  But it turned out that he got charged with 2 misdemeanors, as he should have, which will likely be reduced to 1 when the DA agrees to a plea deal because he has more important matters to attend to, not only with that case but in general.  But nothing he gets charged with will make him legally responsible for her or his teammate's death.

 

15 hours ago, Doc said:

 

The Bills have no shot at him.  And leaving the scene might disqualify him character-wise for the Bills.

 

As for leaving the scene, it's not a good look (it's interesting that he wasn't charged for it) but it doesn't make him responsible for the accident.  Nor does racing her as there are other ways to die when you drive drunk. 

 

If he or anyone else knew she was drunk, she should never have been allowed behind the wheel, period.  WEO just has to go with his "he should have known before they started racing" so as to place the blame solely on him, when prior to that about a dozen people could be held responsible for letting her get behind the wheel.

 

9 hours ago, Doc said:

 

They have video of the crash and if he swerved at/hit her, he would have been charged with more than just drag racing.  And again this assumes that Carter knew she was drunk, which would mean he tried to lead her to her/her passengers' deaths.  They've had time to investigate and if he did, again he wouldn't have been charged with just drag racing.

 

 

More like continue to lose...

 

Yes!  The DA is very busy!  Dropping 1 of 2 misdemeanors on 1 defendant (serial "reckless driver", no less) where both crimes are caught on the same video will absolutely release that office from it's massive daily burden!  That's a great point.

 

It's well understood that alcohol affects reaction time and the more the BAL and the higher the speed, the longer distance to avoid an obstacle.  Even you know this.

 

"If he or anyone else knew she was drunk, she should never have been allowed behind the wheel, period."  This may be the single most absurd thing you have ever posted.  You've just solved the scourge of drunk driving!  Anyone who knows someone is intoxicated should simply take away their keys--especially a bunch of college kids....just like it is done....nowhere.  So, since no one took her keys, then no one could possibly know she was drunk!  Maybe at the parade and parties he didn't see his friends----nay,  ANYONE, drinking!  lol.  The Defense rests!  

 

"Tried to lead them to their deaths"??  No--just made a stupid mistake.  Even if no one was drunk, the reckless driving and racing had the high risk of one or both cars crashing. 

 

 

The very simple question has now been brought up by 2 posters.  Did HIS decision to race contribute in any way to the outcome for those in the other car?  The obvious answer is of course it did.  You know this but, as usual, you have painted yourself into another corner by countless unforced errors. 

 

But hey--keep "winning"!

 

 

[Doc]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

Yes!  The DA is very busy!  Dropping 1 of 2 misdemeanors on 1 defendant (serial "reckless driver", no less) where both crimes are caught on the same video will absolutely release that office from it's massive daily burden!  That's a great point.

 

It's well understood that alcohol affects reaction time and the more the BAL and the higher the speed, the longer distance to avoid an obstacle.  Even you know this.

 

"If he or anyone else knew she was drunk, she should never have been allowed behind the wheel, period."  This may be the single most absurd thing you have ever posted.  You've just solved the scourge of drunk driving!  Anyone who knows someone is intoxicated should simply take away their keys--especially a bunch of college kids....just like it is done....nowhere.  So, since no one took her keys, then no one could possibly know she was drunk!  Maybe at the parade and parties he didn't see his friends----nay,  ANYONE, drinking!  lol.  The Defense rests!  

 

"Tried to lead them to their deaths"??  No--just made a stupid mistake.  Even if no one was drunk, the reckless driving and racing had the high risk of one or both cars crashing. 

 

 

The very simple question has now been brought up by 2 posters.  Did HIS decision to race contribute in any way to the outcome for those in the other car?  The obvious answer is of course it did.  You know this but, as usual, you have painted yourself into another corner by countless unforced errors. 

 

But hey--keep "winning"!

 

"I'm pretty sure "incitement to drag race" is not a crime, lol."  Guess who said that?

 

Keep losing.  It's what you do.  

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

"I'm pretty sure "incitement to drag race" is not a crime, lol."  Guess who said that?

 

Keep losing.  It's what you do.  

 

It's not a crime, no.

 

But you may answer the question.  I made it extra simple for you.

[Doc]

14 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

It's not a crime, no.

 

But you may answer the question.  I made it extra simple for you.

 

The answer is and always has been no, she didn't have to race him.  It's so obvious an answer even you know it. 

[Mr. WEO]

Did the racing between the 2 cars (high speeds/reckless driving) affect the outcome of the passengers in her car--more so than if there was no racing?

 

Do drunk people make more sound decisions than sober people?  You assume he was the sober one.  

[Doc]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

Did the racing between the 2 cars (high speeds/reckless driving) affect the outcome of the passengers in her car--more so than if there was no racing?

 

Do drunk people make more sound decisions than sober people?  You assume he was the sober one.  

 

I think I've made it abundantly clear over the years that being drunk doesn't absolve people of the consequences when things go wrong.  Just because he started drag racing, it doesn't mean she had to do it.  And in the absence of drag racing, who knows what other bad decisions she would have made that could also have led to her death after she got drunk and behind the wheel?  

 

And maybe I'm not as jaded as you, but I don't default to thinking that Carter knew she was drunk and thus led her to her demise.  And again if there had been any evidence, he would have been charged with far more than drag racing, which, even if convicted of both misdemeanors, don't make him legally responsible for her death.  

[Mr. WEO]

2 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I think I've made it abundantly clear over the years that being drunk doesn't absolve people of the consequences when things go wrong.  Just because he started drag racing, it doesn't mean she had to do it.  And in the absence of drag racing, who knows what other bad decisions she would have made that could also have led to her death after she got drunk and behind the wheel?  

 

And maybe I'm not as jaded as you, but I don't default to thinking that Carter knew she was drunk and thus led her to her demise.  And again if there had been any evidence, he would have been charged with far more than drag racing, which, even if convicted of both misdemeanors, don't make him legally responsible for her death.  

 

No one here is absolving her of her choices, doc.  Why bring that up?

 

Since we've already established that there is no charge for inciting racing, there's no charge for him re: "knowing she was drunk".  I guess you could go after the survivors for letting her drive drunk, no?  Put them on the hook--even if they were loaded too!!  Severe inebriation does NOT affect critical decision making!

 

Drunk or not, his decision to race makes him equally as responsible for the outcome of the race--the outcome could have been the same if neither was drunk.  No doubt a series of civil cases will claim this as well.  "Hey, I was just an innocent reckless driver in this one--she was drunk" defense will be novel.

 

 

[Doc]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

No one here is absolving her of her choices, doc.  Why bring that up?

 

Since we've already established that there is no charge for inciting racing, there's no charge for him re: "knowing she was drunk".  I guess you could go after the survivors for letting her drive drunk, no?  Put them on the hook--even if they were loaded too!!  Severe inebriation does NOT affect critical decision making!

 

Drunk or not, his decision to race makes him equally as responsible for the outcome of the race--the outcome could have been the same if neither was drunk.  No doubt a series of civil cases will claim this as well.  "Hey, I was just an innocent reckless driver in this one--she was drunk" defense will be novel.

 

Why go after anyone other than the person solely responsible for his/her terrible decisions?  Why does it always have to be someone else's fault and/or that you can't blame the victim?      

[Mr. WEO]

40 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Why go after anyone other than the person solely responsible for his/her terrible decisions?  Why does it always have to be someone else's fault and/or that you can't blame the victim?      

You’re right.  They should go after her.  Charge her posthumously.

 

This poor guy should be allowed to continue driving recklessly at his leisure.  Anyone else who is harmed by his behavior…well that’s really their own fault when you really think about it. 

[Doc]

35 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

You’re right.  They should go after her.  Charge her posthumously.

 

This poor guy should be allowed to continue driving recklessly at his leisure.  Anyone else who is harmed by his behavior…well that’s really their own fault when you really think about it. 

 

Oh, they will.  At least her estate, whatever she has of one.

 

As for Carter, it's a learning moment.  What he does with it is up to him.  

[Mr. WEO]

19 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Oh, they will.  At least her estate, whatever she has of one.

 

As for Carter, it's a learning moment.  What he does with it is up to him.  

 

His learning moment was not when the cop let him off in September for "reckless" driving? 

 

"her estate"...lol

Edited March 6, 2023 by Mr. WEO

[Doc]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

His learning moment was not when the cop let him off in September for "reckless" driving? 

 

"her estate"...lol

 

Again, how many patients have you told to lose weight because the excess weight was harming them, and they didn't?

 

Yes her estate, since she's dead.  And probably UGA because it was a car they rented for her and she was an employee.