ch19079 Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 Didn't all geologists believe the world was flat at one time, too? All I'm saying is that the pope knows more about religion than I do. Therefore, I'm more inclined to believe him than my wife when it comes to religion. There's a higher probability of the pope being right than my wife (Thank God she doesn't read this board). 326791[/snapback] i dont think they were called geologist back then. many scolars theorised the earth was round, but many people were unwilling to risk death to find out for sure. why does he know more? cus he has read more books? knows more dates and time periods and where jesus lived?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 Its crazy how much difference of opinion there is when it comes to a topic like this. I for one believe all of us have to agree to disagree, because there is no such thing as "Right" and "Wrong." Those terminologies are relative to one's situation, culture, etc. I support the idea that people use historical books for guidance such as the bible, koran, etc... However, I don't think people should live and die by their words. I like to look for "God" in my own ways. Thats just my opinion and I'm sure some will think that is "wrong" and others who feel it is "right." Thanks for all the action on this post. One thing is for sure, life is too darn short 326935[/snapback] There is indeed a difference between right and wrong. In recent memory, the blurring of the distinction brought about such things as Imperialist Japan, Nazi Germany, and Stalinist Russia. And today, Al-Queda, Palistinian terrorists, thes ad affairs in Zimbabwe, the Sudan, North Korea, much of South America, China, Iran and so on and on. We live in a generally peaceful society, and can afford the luxury of an abstract morality. Not so across the globe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch19079 Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 And you know this how? I have the most widely read, historically supported ancient text to support my beliefs. You? 326605[/snapback] i think believing aliens came to earth to influence our development, is just as absurd as basing your life on books writen by men thousands of years ago. for me, beign a good person, and helping people when i can, and living by my morals is the best i can do. if thats not good enough, and if god (if there is a god) wants to throw me in to the pits of hell simply for failing to blindly follow the writings of some men the "religious leaders" think are important, than to hell ill go. dont forget that most people feel that their religion is the ONLY religion that will lead to "salvation". so 99% of the worlds population is going to hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkwwjd Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 i think believing aliens came to earth to influence our development, is just as absurd as basing your life on books writen by men thousands of years ago. for me, beign a good person, and helping people when i can, and living by my morals is the best i can do. if thats not good enough, and if god (if there is a god) wants to throw me in to the pits of hell simply for failing to blindly follow the writings of some men the "religious leaders" think are important, than to hell ill go. dont forget that most people feel that their religion is the ONLY religion that will lead to "salvation". so 99% of the worlds population is going to hell. 326981[/snapback] Actually, IIRC, the vast majority of religions believe in at least a couple of chances to accept their message (some sort of post-death opportunity). What you or I think have no impact on reality though. There is a true reality and it will eventually be revealed to everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 Actually, IIRC, the vast majority of religions believe in at least a couple of chances to accept their message (some sort of post-death opportunity). What you or I think have no impact on reality though. There is a true reality and it will eventually be revealed to everyone. 326991[/snapback] I can refine your signature line. Life is fatal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckeyeBill Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 some priest somewhere said, "that doest sound right", and riped out the pages... 326945[/snapback] Um... it's a little more difficult to disrupt cannon. Keep dreaming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffal0 Bill5 Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 I believe in God. I also believe that the Bible is the inspired infallible word of God. I believe that Jesus was born of a virgin. I believe that Jesus is God manifest in the flesh. I believe that Jesus was crucified, died a physical death, was buried and rose from the dead after three days in the grave. I believe in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross is the only thing that can save man from his sins. I believe in a literal heaven for those that believe and a literal hell for those that reject the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross. 325425[/snapback] Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 Even Paul's letters to the Romans? I have an easier time imagining those written in Latin than in Greek...and it was those specifically I had in mind when I mentioned Latin. 325763[/snapback] The Letter of Paul to the Romans was originally written in Greek. As the Roman church gained in power and authority the Bible was translated into Latin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 To say the Bible has been edited is a gross understatement. People need to stop quoting the damn Bible and start researching what has led to the present construction it's in. It's not a pretty history folks. Many early Christian scholars works were erased because their philosophy didn't jive with the prevailing wisdom. 325777[/snapback] The Bible is a collection of separate works written over perhaps 1,500 to 1,600 years. These separate works came into being by different means. Many of the books of the Bible we can only speculate about. Old testament form critics look at texts in some of the first books of the Bible and suggest that they can determine the identity of different groups who made those contributions or changes in the text. They have names for those groups based on the terms those aloleged groups have for God. If the text refers to God as Yahweh, then it must have come from that group called the Yahwists by form critics. This is all speculation, and I'm rather skeptical of it. It is pretty widely accepted that the gospels in the New Testament found their way into written from from 20 to 70 years after the death and resurrection of Jesus. The first three gospels, the "synoptic gospels" probably include material that was part of an "oral tradition;" sayings of Jesus, stories of miraculous healings, etc. Christian believers passed those stories on to each other, from one church to another. Over time, those sayings and stories began to appear in written collections. Textual critics suggest that there was one prominent collection of written sayings and accounts of Jesus' actions. This collection, called "Q" was used as a source form much of the sayings and miracles, etc. that appear in the three synoptic gospels. I think there is probably something to this theory. That does not eliminate the possibility that there was a Luke, a Gentile physician and some time traveling companion of the apostle Paul, who took some of that wwritten material and incorporated it, but also going back and talking with some of those who knew Jesus personally and verifying the truth of what he wrote. Each book has it's own story, and many of the books we'll never know for certain how they came into being. There are many other books that circulated in the church in the second and third centuries AD. There are other gospels, other letters and books that don't fit into any particular category. Maybe you've heard of the Gospel of Thomas or of Barnabus, or the Shepherd of Hermes. In the 4th century AD the church began to get deliberate about collecting in one body all of those literary works deemed worthy of being called scripture. The process was not easy or without controversy. It is for me a matter of faith that with God's guidance the church got it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 I believe in God. I also believe that the Bible is the inspired infallible word of God. I believe that Jesus was born of a virgin. I believe that Jesus is God manifest in the flesh. I believe that Jesus was crucified, died a physical death, was buried and rose from the dead after three days in the grave. I believe in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross is the only thing that can save man from his sins. I believe in a literal heaven for those that believe and a literal hell for those that reject the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross. 327419[/snapback] The pretty much sums up what I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradobillsfan Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 whether you believe in any religion, spirituality, higher order, or just know there's something out there. why does 'it' have to be something 'out there'? couldn't 'it' just as easily be inside every one of us? after all people are made of the same matter as anything else, every atom of which was created in the heart of an exploding star. to me the answer may be as close to the tip of my nose as it is to the other side of the universe. the key, to paraphrase the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy, is to figure out exactly what the question is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 3, 2005 Share Posted May 3, 2005 It is for me a matter of faith that with God's guidance the church got it right. 327419[/snapback] The rapidity of acceptance of Christ's teachings were without precedent. The entire civilized globe was changed. That the failings of men on Earth at times marred and twisted God's message is historical, and still continues. But the good that has been wrought far surpasses that. I also am faithful - without that, I would be one of God's smaller creatures, food and reproduction only. The great gift of sentience and free will is appreciated. Yes, they cause many problems, sometimes horrific and going on for many centuries, but some feel that God should control everything - well, He does, for the ants, the bees, the microbes, etc. We are His children, and chose not to make us creatures of mere instinct. So, how can I not love my Father for His gift of granting me choices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted May 4, 2005 Author Share Posted May 4, 2005 why does 'it' have to be something 'out there'? couldn't 'it' just as easily be inside every one of us? after all people are made of the same matter as anything else, every atom of which was created in the heart of an exploding star. to me the answer may be as close to the tip of my nose as it is to the other side of the universe. the key, to paraphrase the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy, is to figure out exactly what the question is. 327427[/snapback] Very good point... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 Very good point... 327442[/snapback] Until you come to the final questions...where did the universe come from? Where did God come from? Who created either or both? Whatever the answers to those eternal questions may be, our species have never been able to answer them - never. I'm not surprised that you were given an assignment on this subject - despite that minds far greater - throughout recorded history- that that class instructor, you, or me, or millions of others have never been successful in satisfactory resolution. It is, has been, and remains a matter of faith. Methinks the question was posed to you by the instructor because it always has, and profits are realized from the new crop of paying students being tasked to go over well-tilled ground. So the cash register gets stoked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Gant Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 dont forget that most people feel that their religion is the ONLY religion that will lead to "salvation". so 99% of the worlds population is going to hell. 326981[/snapback] Most don't believe this. at least Catholics don't.( well some catholics might, but it isn't chuch teaching) http://www.rc.net/rcchurch/vatican2/nostra.aet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockpile Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 In case anyone was interested, here is a link to an on-line bible (KJV). One thing I like about it is that you can search for references. Whatever you believe, this book is worth a look. Blue Letter Bible Interesting comments from Isaac Newton: On the Bible: "I have a fundamental belief in the Bible as the Word of God, written by men who were inspired. I study the Bible daily." On atheism: "Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system. I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 " On atheism: "Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system. I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." 328213[/snapback] No knock on Newton, but I find it "senseless" to blindly accept religion as "fact". Simply the fact that there are so many They can't all be right.I mean, there are tribes out there that believe in rain gods and gods for just about everything. Are they "wrong" for their beliefs? It makes more sense to accept the fact that we truly do not know exactly how the Earth and life came to be. Atheism is the conclusion that these explanations are not good enough. I voted "no" in this poll as the choices were not good enough. I guess I'd say I believe something created our universe. But probably not the traditional"God" that everyone is talking about. And definitely not in any "heaven and hell" type concept. I think when you're dead, that's probably it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyT Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 "Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system. I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." 328213[/snapback] If you ask me, the Western NY climate disproves the whole "proper amounts of heat and light" thing. Side note: It's interesting to see that the longer this poll remains open, the more atheistic our members appear to get...percentage-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkwwjd Posted May 4, 2005 Share Posted May 4, 2005 " On atheism: "Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system. I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." 328213[/snapback] No knock on Newton, but I find it "senseless" to blindly accept religion as "fact". Simply the fact that there are so many They can't all be right.I mean, there are tribes out there that believe in rain gods and gods for just about everything. Are they "wrong" for their beliefs? It makes more sense to accept the fact that we truly do not know exactly how the Earth and life came to be. Atheism is the conclusion that these explanations are not good enough. I voted "no" in this poll as the choices were not good enough. I guess I'd say I believe something created our universe. But probably not the traditional"God" that everyone is talking about. And definitely not in any "heaven and hell" type concept. I think when you're dead, that's probably it. 328448[/snapback] Seems like a bunch of things just "aren't good enough" for you. Sorry about the attitude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted May 4, 2005 Author Share Posted May 4, 2005 I would have to say that I assumed about 90-95% of people would be believers. Seeing the results of this poll has me kind of shocked. I would bet that most of the undecided in rough times would be swayed to becoming believers. One point that many of the critics of "religion" forget (Keep in mind i do not follow any organized religion myself) is that at the foundation most religions are exactly the same. I'll use a football analogy... All 32 NFL teams have different strategies. For example, The buffalo bills were supposed to be a smash mouth, running team. The Colts were All out passing, etc etc.... In the end all of the teams have the ultimate goal of moving the football and reaching the endzone. The endzone to me is what we call "life after death" All religions acknowledge the life after death aspect. However their approaches to getting there are all different, hence are you a running team, a passing team, or a defensive 3-4/4-3 team. All are different in their own respect, but all have the same ultimate goal and philosophy. Just my take on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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