Pokebball Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 3 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: I practiced in a rural, very red area with some of the worst infection and death rates. No coincidence that compliance with public health measures and vax rates were awful. There was an excellent study done by Vanderbilt comparing morbidity and mortality in affluent, well educated and more compliant Nashville to red hillbilly areas. Guess which place did much better. I live in a very rural state. Access to masks, gloves, and hospitals was lacking. We did the best we could given the limited access to healthcare we had. Availability of the vaccine was limited. Family members got covid and the family was the primary care. The area of my state hit the worse was uneducated democrats. It wasn't party affiliation. It wasn't education. It was location / geographic (the further you were from access to healthcare, the worse it was). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 6 minutes ago, Pokebball said: I live in a very rural state. Access to masks, gloves, and hospitals was lacking. We did the best we could given the limited access to healthcare we had. Availability of the vaccine was limited. Family members got covid and the family was the primary care. The area of my state hit the worse was uneducated democrats. It wasn't party affiliation. It wasn't education. It was location / geographic (the further you were from access to healthcare, the worse it was). by mid pandemic, there was plenty of vaccine. The statistics that Billsy linked are fact. Red states did worse than blue ones... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokebball Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 7 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: by mid pandemic, there was plenty of vaccine. The statistics that Billsy linked are fact. Red states did worse than blue ones... my fact is also correct, rural states did worse than urban states. Painfully obvious that the reason is limitations to access. 38 minutes ago, BillStime said: You didn’t like the answer cuz it’s true. You talk about freedoms and liberties of Americans while simultaneously undermining individual rights. You can’t square it and your hypocrisy is noted. My argument is very easy to square. You're the one that doesn't want to give liberty to a life. I'm most consistent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 1 minute ago, Pokebball said: my fact is also correct, rural states did worse than urban states. Painfully obvious that the reason is limitations to access. Not obvious at all. Early on there was no treatment which was also true even after the introduction of the vax which was widely available. As Billsy has linked, vax rates were the most important variable. Mask use was also a significant variable in many studies. Masks were widely available when the vax came out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokebball Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: Not obvious at all. Early on there was no treatment which was also true even after the introduction of the vax which was widely available. As Billsy has linked, vax rates were the most important variable. Mask use was also a significant variable in many studies. Masks were widely available when the vax came out. Very obvious. Vax rates were most important, when access to adequate health care existed. Access becomes obviously more important when you aren't ventilated. You claim to understand rural healthcare, but you obviously don't. Edited April 10 by Pokebball 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 20 minutes ago, Pokebball said: Very obvious. Vax rates were most important, when access to adequate health care existed. Access becomes obviously more important when you aren't ventilated. You claim to understand rural healthcare, but you obviously don't. Bs. I understand ignorance in vax rates very well. Access wasn’t very important when there was no effective treatment. Please link an article illustrating that vax was most important when access was adequate. The vast majority oh the ICU pts and dying patients were unvaxed. The unvaxedused the most resources while dying more frequently. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 52 minutes ago, Pokebball said: The area of my state hit the worse was uneducated democrats Everyone has a story to tell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 5 minutes ago, BillStime said: Everyone has a story to tell They love their anecdotes. Real science is harder to understand 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7707213/ In this community-based, randomized controlled trial conducted in a setting where mask wearing was uncommon and was not among other recommended public health measures related to COVID-19, a recommendation to wear a surgical mask when outside the home among others did not reduce, at conventional levels of statistical significance, incident SARS-CoV-2 infection compared with no mask recommendation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 24 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7707213/ In this community-based, randomized controlled trial conducted in a setting where mask wearing was uncommon and was not among other recommended public health measures related to COVID-19, a recommendation to wear a surgical mask when outside the home among others did not reduce, at conventional levels of statistical significance, incident SARS-CoV-2 infection compared with no mask recommendation. I still laugh at these freaks arguing over the effectiveness of masks... If they were effective and kept people safe - great. If not, better to be safe than sorry. BFD. Idiots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unforgiven Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 The mask thing was a cult thing....like muslim women being forced to cover their faces. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 3 hours ago, BillStime said: I do as long as you and @Doc attribute the blame for those who die refusing a vaccine that could potentially save their life. Ironically, the only party that appears to disregard freedom and liberty for all Americans is yours. Your party is infringing on the civil rights of women, the LGBTQ+ community, their families, voting rights, and reproductive freedom, among others. As I said in another thread, there was no vaccine under Trump to refuse. Or treatments. And Kamala Harris said she wouldn't trust the vaccine. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 Just now, Doc said: As I said in another thread, there was no vaccine under Trump to refuse. Or treatments. And Kamala Harris said she wouldn't trust the vaccine. Do you have an issue with your hippocampus? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 (edited) 2 hours ago, BillsFanNC said: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7707213/ In this community-based, randomized controlled trial conducted in a setting where mask wearing was uncommon and was not among other recommended public health measures related to COVID-19, a recommendation to wear a surgical mask when outside the home among others did not reduce, at conventional levels of statistical significance, incident SARS-CoV-2 infection compared with no mask recommendation. I appreciate you taking up the challenge but one must look at multiple studies especially when they are observational. The strong preponderance of evidence points to this conclusion among most Infectious Disease folks: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8499874/ "all studies we analysed that did not find surgical masks to be effective were under-powered to such an extent that even if masks were 100% effective, the studies in question would still have been unlikely to find a statistically significant effect" A more recent review from JAMA: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2811136 "Available evidence strongly suggests that masking in the community can reduce the spread of SARS-CoV-2 and that masking with the highest-quality masks that can be made widely available should play an important role in controlling whatever pandemic caused by a respiratory pathogen awaits us." Edited April 10 by Joe Ferguson forever 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 (edited) 18 hours ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: I am a doctor. It never goes away. Still boarded and licensed just retired. Masks are always single use. No one ever recommended otherwise except when there was a ridiculous shortage of N95's and cleaning methods were recommended. Whose fault was the shortage? Why do MAGAs hate science so? Oh right, cuz it doesn't fit with your narrative. Neither does truth. LOL, tell that to the ones still wearing the same one over and over again like a badge of honor. Or the countless mob and media narratives that never included any logistics or direction on Disposal. as none were ever created. and the mask were in parking lots, on the streets and stacking up on people's shifters and passenger seats, still are. Edited April 11 by Tommy Callahan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Ferguson forever Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 hour ago, Tommy Callahan said: LOL, tell that to the ones still wearing the same one over and over again like a badge of honor. you can't fix stupid. it's been proven on this forum repeatedly. There will always be the intellectually deficient. I need to do some looking but last I knew fomites (look it up) were not a significant source of Covid spread. Aerosolized droplets accounted for nearly all infections. Then it becomes a risk/benefit analysis which appears to be clearly on the side of masks as evidenced by the conclusion of the JAMA review I linked.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 hour ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: you can't fix stupid. it's been proven on this forum repeatedly. There will always be the intellectually deficient. I need to do some looking but last I knew fomites (look it up) were not a significant source of Covid spread. Aerosolized droplets accounted for nearly all infections. Then it becomes a risk/benefit analysis which appears to be clearly on the side of masks as evidenced by the conclusion of the JAMA review I linked.... Employers of healthcare workers are responsible for following applicable OSHA requirements, including OSHA's Bloodborne Pathogens (29 CFR 1910.1030), Personal Protective Equipment (29 CFR 1910.132), and Respiratory Protection (29 CFR 1910.134) standards. without those processes, the PPE becomes the vector. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillStime Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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