Gary M Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 9 minutes ago, HappyDays said: You believe that this human rights abuse is okay because of the possibility that some of them are criminals? They are all criminals, they are entering my country illegally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Zevon Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, Gary M said: They are all criminals, they are entering my country illegally. No, they're not all criminals. It's not your country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This is not a principle that should ever be employed in America. "Ah we don't know for sure that this person isn't a human trafficker. Best to rip the crying child away from them and sort it out in a couple months." People coming here illegally are criminals. We have every right, and more, responsibility to detain them. Because of the nature of the circumstance, and the nature of the evil being combated, this is the best and most humane way to vet the situation. Do the research, Happy. Learn how vast the problem is in scope. Understand how the trafficking rings work. Then present me with a solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This is not a principle that should ever be employed in America. "Ah we don't know for sure that this person isn't a human trafficker. Best to rip the crying child away from them and sort it out in a couple months." See Tom's quote above. You're arguing that because some real families will be temporarily separated, we shouldn't save the kids being trafficked by separating them from the adults pretending to be their parents. Talk about savage. That's horrendous logic, and EXACTLY why they want you mindlessly pushing this political (not compassion based) attack. They think you're stupid, Gary. Don't prove them right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 1 minute ago, ALF said: I honestly had no idea , I do trust you as a good source of information. I really am sad to hear this. Three things I know about DR, knowing him outside of this board. 1) He's nuts. Benignly so ..but still... 2) He does have real and good sources. 3) He can't explain turbulence. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albwan Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 1 minute ago, peace out said: No, they're not all criminals. It's not your country. Its not theirs, either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 3 minutes ago, ALF said: I honestly had no idea , I do trust you as a good source of information. I really am sad to hear this. I didn't either. I thought it was bull **** like Gary and Happy. Then I went out and saw it myself. I talked to the victims. I talked to the traffickers. I talked to the LEOs who make these raids every night in SoCal. The worst part is the systemic nature of this. It's everywhere. Not just in SoCal. And it's everywhere because many institutions which are supposed to protect children are horribly compromised by those who prey on children. There's a national conversation about this coming, it won't be pretty and it won't be easy for anyone. But it has to happen because there are children today who we could help if we only were aware of their plight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Deranged Rhino said: See Tom's quote above. You're arguing that because some real families will be temporarily separated, we shouldn't save the kids being trafficked by separating them from the adults pretending to be their parents. Talk about savage. That's horrendous logic, and EXACTLY why they want you mindlessly pushing this political (not compassion based) attack. They think you're stupid, Gary. Don't prove them right. That wasn't my point. My point was simply that he's making an argument that's !@#$ed sideways. "We must endanger the children to protect the children!" That's not even an argument. It's ignorant, lazy, emotional manipulation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This is not a principle that should ever be employed in America. "Ah we don't know for sure that this person isn't a human trafficker. Best to rip the crying child away from them and sort it out in a couple months." You keep throwing around "months"...I wonder what the true average time is. And the age of the kids there for months. And of the kids there for months, the status of the people they were apprehended with. These things matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 3 minutes ago, DC Tom said: Three things I know about DR, knowing him outside of this board. 1) He's nuts. Benignly so ..but still... 2) He does have real and good sources. 3) He can't explain turbulence. Can confirm. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, peace out said: No, they're not all criminals. It's not your country. They're here illegally. They're criminals BY DEFINITION. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 1 minute ago, DC Tom said: That wasn't my point. My point was simply that he's making an argument that's !@#$ed sideways. "We must endanger the children to protect the children!" That's not even an argument. It's ignorant, lazy, emotional manipulation. There was supposed to be a line break - stupid Siri. Meant it as an aside, not as a tie in to my thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, OJ Tom said: You keep throwing around "months"...I wonder what the true average time is. And the age of the kids there for months. And of the kids there for months, the status of the people they were apprehended with. These things matter. About 45 days, from what I've heard. But I'm starting to think that's a lie, and it's probably less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albwan Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, Deranged Rhino said: I didn't either. I thought it was bull **** like Gary and Happy. Then I went out and saw it myself. I talked to the victims. I talked to the traffickers. I talked to the LEOs who make these raids every night in SoCal. The worst part is the systemic nature of this. It's everywhere. Not just in SoCal. And it's everywhere because many institutions which are supposed to protect children are horribly compromised by those who prey on children. There's a national conversation about this coming, it won't be pretty and it won't be easy for anyone. But it has to happen because there are children today who we could help if we only were aware of their plight. too logical and true, cmon, most of us know this whole thing is a back door for trump hate, and nothing more. There would be zero outrage if this was during the obama administration in which case no one would even know about it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 26 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Those children are screaming because they were ripped from the arms of their sex traffickers, dont you know? Everyone in this thread should listen to the Pro Publica audio. It's really bad. There is no excuse for this. lol shaun king, NOPE. may as well ring up Chairman Mao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, DC Tom said: They're here illegally. They're criminals BY DEFINITION. Yeah, a few guys are apprehended with a group of children, sneaking across an international border, and the immigration officers are supposed to take their word! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said: I know people involved in these raids personally. Have spent time with them. Seen the evidence they collected in the aftermath of several raids. Guess what they discovered about how a lot of these kids got into the country? https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-announces-results-of-operation-cross-country-xi http://abc7.com/hundreds-arrested-in-human-trafficking-crackdown-in-ca/3007899/ http://fox5sandiego.com/2018/01/31/29-men-arrested-in-sex-trafficking-sting/ 20 minutes ago, HappyDays said: You're literally making this all up 21 minutes ago, peace out said: It's pathetic and not worth responding to. Just saving the resident lefties some time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Albwan said: too logical and true, cmon, most of us know this whole thing is a back door for trump hate, and nothing more. There would be zero outrage if this was during the obama administration in which case no one would even know about it. The proof of that is that this is the second time they've tried to push this "Trump abuses children" spin on this story. The first time didn't gain traction because they used footage from the Obama administration. This is the most blatantly obvious manipulation I've ever seen. 3 minutes ago, LABillzFan said: Just saving the resident lefties some time. You forgot gatorman: "Paint chips are only a sometimes food!" Edited June 18, 2018 by DC Tom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, Albwan said: too logical and true, cmon, most of us know this whole thing is a back door for trump hate, and nothing more. There would be zero outrage if this was during the obama administration in which case no one would even know about it. That nails it. All the people upset and worried about the children have their hearts in the right place. They're just unaware of the larger context and real issue because they're being led by partisans rather than people who actually care about the issue. And yes - there is partisan rhetoric on both (all) sides on this issue, it's not just the left. Part of me thinks the reason this is being made into an issue by the administration (and they are making this an issue by enforcing the law, no doubt about it) IS to draw attention to this larger topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 18 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This is not a principle that should ever be employed in America. "Ah we don't know for sure that this person isn't a human trafficker. Best to rip the crying child away from them and sort it out in a couple months." Best solution? TURN EVERYONE AT THE BORDER AWAY. That way no one has to be separated from their parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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