Allen at #12?

[LABILLBACKER]

On 3/20/2018 at 7:27 AM, Jay_Fixit said:

We should all hope the Jets take Allen at 3. 

Please God not Allen or Jackson. These 2 have bust written all over them. Give me Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield or Rudolph in that order. Or Tanner Lee?

[Seventeen]

53 minutes ago, NewEraBills said:

 

I won't say that yet, but the comparison is there.  If you are a GM and coach you just cannot ignore the accuracy and completion percentage.

 

The things I like about Allen though are:

1)  Played in a complete Pro-style offense (so should be familiar with EP, WC, AC offensive concepts so if he reaches his potential he can shine in any offense)

2)  Crazy arm talent

3)  I like his ability to move, particularly behind a Bills OL that's not all that great at pass pro

4)  Throws the routes on the perimeter on a damn rope

5)  Hard worker and competitor

6)  Lots of tools to work with

7)  Seems like a great locker room guy

8)  Ran offense at the line of scrimmage making checks and protection calls - didn't need to look to the sideline for the change of play by a coach (Baker).

 

Things I am very concerned with:

1)  Accuracy and completion percentage - Again, Boller even shined at his pro day and he had bad WR's too, but nothing changed in the NFL for him.

2)  Hasn't matured in knowing when to take some heat off of passes (contributes to #1)

3)  Majority of his passes are/were down the field.  Not much in the quick game.  Can he make those throws accurately on a consistent basis (given 2 and 1)?

4)  Who is he when the lights are on?  He looks fantastic in shorts.  But in game situations, you ask who the hell is this guy?

5)  Does have a tendency to get stuck on reads when bullets are firing and relies on his arm strength to force passes into windows that are not open.  He did get better this year though but it's a trait that lingers.

6)  Did not shine vs Power teams.  

7)  Needs great assistant and position coaches around him to make sure he gets the lessons he needs.  Probably needs to sit an entire season or more. 

 

Good analysis on both sides ... 

 

As for your concerns, I am not worried about the completion percentage due to point #3 and his lack of quality receivers. And IMO, he can handle the quick game. He has been said to be good on the whiteboard, so his football IQ is up there. He did look very good in the Senior Bowl. 

 

And I'm ok with him sitting 2 seasons if necessary - I don't think any of these QBs are ready for prime time and I certainly wouldn't throw him behind a sub-par Bills o-line. 

 

But as I've said before, I don't see him lasting past Denver @ #5. Wouldn't be surprised to see him end up there and being able to pick Elway's brain is a big win. I know, I know ... Payton Lynch, Trevor Siemian, Brock Osweiler. But I think Allen is a better prospect than any of those guys. 

Edited March 30, 2018 by Looper

[Pirate Angel]

5 hours ago, NewEraBills said:

 

I won't say that yet, but the comparison is there.  If you are a GM and coach you just cannot ignore the accuracy and completion percentage.

 

The things I like about Allen though are:

1)  Played in a complete Pro-style offense (so should be familiar with EP, WC, AC offensive concepts so if he reaches his potential he can shine in any offense)

2)  Crazy arm talent

3)  I like his ability to move, particularly behind a Bills OL that's not all that great at pass pro

4)  Throws the routes on the perimeter on a damn rope

5)  Hard worker and competitor

6)  Lots of tools to work with

7)  Seems like a great locker room guy

8)  Ran offense at the line of scrimmage making checks and protection calls - didn't need to look to the sideline for the change of play by a coach (Baker).

 

Things I am very concerned with:

1)  Accuracy and completion percentage - Again, Boller even shined at his pro day and he had bad WR's too, but nothing changed in the NFL for him.

2)  Hasn't matured in knowing when to take some heat off of passes (contributes to #1)

3)  Majority of his passes are/were down the field.  Not much in the quick game.  Can he make those throws accurately on a consistent basis (given 2 and 1)?

4)  Who is he when the lights are on?  He looks fantastic in shorts.  But in game situations, you ask who the hell is this guy?

5)  Does have a tendency to get stuck on reads when bullets are firing and relies on his arm strength to force passes into windows that are not open.  He did get better this year though but it's a trait that lingers.

6)  Did not shine vs Power teams.  

7)  Needs great assistant and position coaches around him to make sure he gets the lessons he needs.  Probably needs to sit an entire season or more. 

Another concern is that he seems to lock on to one receiver and use his athleticism to get that one receiver open. 

[Bills Freak]

11 hours ago, Scorp83 said:

88 posts on here.... doesn't count towards my 5,000+ post on BB Msg board 

What does no of posts have to do w/ opinion &/or football knowledge?

[Scorp83]

4 hours ago, Bills Freak said:

What does no of posts have to do w/ opinion &/or football knowledge?

Because that poster try to make it seem that my 88 posts on here isn't justified me having an opinion. So I had to let him know I'm not new to forums... just this site. Doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about because on new on this page

[Manther]

On 2018-03-20 at 9:36 AM, Flip Johnson said:

Are we entirely sure Josh Allen won't be available at #12?

 

Let's say we can't or don't get up to #2 and QBs go 1,2,3 - Darnold/Browns, Rosen/Giants, Mayfield/Jets.

 

Who would pick a QB next?

 

#4 - Browns - would have just picked a QB

#5 - Broncos - already have Keenum, think they are a contender now.

#6 - Colts - have Luck

#7 - Bucs - have Winston

#8 - Bears - have Trubisky

#9 - SF - have Garropolo

#10 - Oakland - have Carr

#11 - Miami - maybe Miami would consider a QB

 

Obviously other teams are in the mix and could leapfrog into that position. But it is possible that a) the Giants don't take a QB and b) no QBs are drafted between 4 and 11. 

 

If the Bills are set on Josh Rosen, none of that helps. But I suspect that they may be interested in both Allen and Rosen. Beane has the liberty to go slow and continue to evaluate because he has the ammo to get up into the top 5, but the possibility exists that a guy they like falls to him.

 

Everyone seems to want Beane to give away the farm to get to #2. He may do that, but this is a case where patience could be rewarded. The Bears last year gave away a fortune to move up from #3 to #2 to get a player they could have stayed put for. The Jets may have just done the same thing if the guy they want is Mayfield. Beane may get his guy by staying put or making a smaller draft day trade and still keep all or most of the war chest.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000922017/article/bucky-brooks-mock-draft-30-new-york-jets-land-josh-rosen

 

 

One of three things are going to happen at the draft with Allen.

 

1.  He is highly thought of and goes in the top 5.  I am staring to feel Cleveland and the Jets value him.

 

2.  He gets past the Broncos and is available for us to trade up for between 6 and 10.

 

3.  He slides and everyone has questions on him and he goes in the 20’s

 

JMO, but, he is intriguing especially if he is there at 12

[Bills Freak]

10 hours ago, Scorp83 said:

Because that poster try to make it seem that my 88 posts on here isn't justified me having an opinion. So I had to let him know I'm not new to forums... just this site. Doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about because on new on this page

I know, I agree w/ you. I probably should've replied to him as well. I read A LOT. I follow multiple forums also but do not respond much because its pointless. My fewer posts would make me seem uninformed to the poster & many others. I'm not & neither are you. Just because one re-posts their opinion repeatedly does mean they are any more knowledgeable or deserving of praise. 

[KRT88]

Allen is my least favorite of the six, however if he fell to 12 and Bills have to make the pick. Plenty of upside but we’d better hope AJ can go two years and he’s a good teacher. 

Edited March 31, 2018 by KRT88

[Paul Costa]

Getting Allen at 12 would be the start of one of the best Bills drafts of all time. He’s second on my list after Darnold. Won’t be surprised if he’s gone by the third pick. I wouldn’t trade up to 4 for anyone but Darnold or Allen. If Mayfield or Rosen are still there at 9 or 10 and Bills want to use # 65 to move up ok. I’d be fine with that.

[Dr. Who]

19 minutes ago, Paul Costa said:

Getting Allen at 12 would be the start of one of the best Bills drafts of all time. He’s second on my list after Darnold. Won’t be surprised if he’s gone by the third pick. I wouldn’t trade up to 4 for anyone but Darnold or Allen. If Mayfield or Rosen are still there at 9 or 10 and Bills want to use # 65 to move up ok. I’d be fine with that.

I like Allen.  I think he will go early.  If Darnold, Allen, and one of Rosen or Mayfield go in the top five and we still don't have a qb, you better move up to six or seven to secure the last of the top four.  Unless you're okay taking Jackson or Rudolph later, I don't think you can wait till 9 or 10 and gamble a team like the Cards won't jump up ahead of you.

[Scorp83]

7 hours ago, Bills Freak said:

I know, I agree w/ you. I probably should've replied to him as well. I read A LOT. I follow multiple forums also but do not respond much because its pointless. My fewer posts would make me seem uninformed to the poster & many others. I'm not & neither are you. Just because one re-posts their opinion repeatedly does mean they are any more knowledgeable or deserving of praise. 

Exactly!