whatdrought Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, DCOrange said: I mean, they did win a Super Bowl the year after firing Dungy. Perhaps they win it even with him; it's hard to say. But Gruden was able to take that amazing defense Dungy and co. had built and give it a pretty good offense that Dungy was unable to provide. It's been pretty bad for them since that Super Bowl, but I think they're trending in the right direction now. It'll be interesting to see how they do this upcoming year; their GM has done a nice job of adding talent to the team, but he may believe to a fault in the young O-Line they've built. They have a couple really talented blockers, but it's never come together for them, and yet it appears that they're satisfied with what they have. If they can add a good pass rusher off the edge and get one of the talented RBs in this year's draft, they should be a good team next year. Maybe he turns it around with his next team, but that dude was beyond terrible last season. Seemed like a classic case of getting paid and no longer caring. I guess when I see the exchange that happened there it was an ascending team that had made the playoffs two years in a row, followed by a Superbowl win and then a very drastic fall off. Say what you will about Gruden, but it still seems like he mostly rode what Dungy had built. Not to say that they would have gotten there with Dungy, but it certainly seemed like they were going in the right direction. As for now, I don't know if I see it that way... I see a team holding onto a coach who seems inept, a QB who was overrated from day one, and a bunch of pieced in place that they can't get to function. I don't expect them to be very good this year, but I could definitely be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 2 hours ago, whatdrought said: True story. At least being a bills fan for the past 20 years there were changes made. Granted, we made poor changes, but nontheless, they were made. How does it feel to be a Bucs fan, or a Bengals fan and see them shovel the same crap every year. At least we have been treated to a diversity of crap. The Bucs are very poorly run by the Glazers. I maintain that firing Tony Dungy (right as he had constructed a great team and was about to turn the corner) was a completely imbecilic move. What the actual !@#$ are you rambling on about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, joesixpack said: What the actual !@#$ are you rambling on about? I actually thought that I communicated my points efficiently. Perhaps I'm mistaken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I actually thought that I communicated my points efficiently. Perhaps I'm mistaken. On reread, it's a BIT clearer. I'm assuming you're talking about the past, and not this most recent season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 6 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I guess when I see the exchange that happened there it was an ascending team that had made the playoffs two years in a row, followed by a Superbowl win and then a very drastic fall off. Say what you will about Gruden, but it still seems like he mostly rode what Dungy had built. Not to say that they would have gotten there with Dungy, but it certainly seemed like they were going in the right direction. As for now, I don't know if I see it that way... I see a team holding onto a coach who seems inept, a QB who was overrated from day one, and a bunch of pieced in place that they can't get to function. I don't expect them to be very good this year, but I could definitely be wrong. I guess it depends on your opinion of Jameis. I think he's roughly an average starting QB right now who, when the O-Line protects him, showed he could be a great QB in the NFL. They have one of the best WRs in the NFL along with a very talented rookie WR, DeSean Jackson, Cameron Brate, and OJ Howard. It's not hard to imagine them turning into one of the best offenses in the league very soon. Defensively, they have as good a linebacking corps as there is in the NFL and one of the best DTs in the NFL. They still have a lot of holes to address on that end though. They have what seems to be some decent pieces in the secondary, but it's still pretty early to determine for sure there and their pass rush off the edges was abysmal last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 1 minute ago, joesixpack said: On reread, it's a BIT clearer. I'm assuming you're talking about the past, and not this most recent season If you mean with regards to what I said about the bills, then yes. 2 minutes ago, DCOrange said: I guess it depends on your opinion of Jameis. I think he's roughly an average starting QB right now who, when the O-Line protects him, showed he could be a great QB in the NFL. They have one of the best WRs in the NFL along with a very talented rookie WR, DeSean Jackson, Cameron Brate, and OJ Howard. It's not hard to imagine them turning into one of the best offenses in the league very soon. Defensively, they have as good a linebacking corps as there is in the NFL and one of the best DTs in the NFL. They still have a lot of holes to address on that end though. They have what seems to be some decent pieces in the secondary, but it's still pretty early to determine for sure there and their pass rush off the edges was abysmal last season. I can see what you're saying. To be honest, I did expect them to be competitive this year so the potential could be there, but we'll have to see. I do think that bringing Koetter back was questionable given how much talent he had to work with and how little he managed to do. I still say they definitely overpaid for Gruden and could have been better off overall if they had stayed with Dungy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, whatdrought said: If you mean with regards to what I said about the bills, then yes. I can see what you're saying. To be honest, I did expect them to be competitive this year so the potential could be there, but we'll have to see. I do think that bringing Koetter back was questionable given how much talent he had to work with and how little he managed to do. I still say they definitely overpaid for Gruden and could have been better off overall if they had stayed with Dungy. Yeah, Koetter wasn't very impressive in his first season as the head coach. The struggles in the red zone in particular were concerning, but so was the fact that Tampa so rarely used DeSean's speed on short drag/quick slant type routes rather than just using him as a vertical threat. Jameis struggled all year to hit him deep, and the few times they had DeSean run routes underneath, he created a lot of separation, but for some reason, they didn't use that very often. I also think they should have played Chris Godwin more; he was great this season but played a very limited role. And the Gruden/Dungy debate will rage on. Hard for Bucs fans to complain considering they got their Super Bowl but obviously things didn't end on a high note with Gruden. Edited February 20, 2018 by DCOrange Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 1 minute ago, DCOrange said: Yeah, Koetter wasn't very impressive in his first season as the head coach. The struggles in the red zone in particular were concerning, but so was the fact that Tampa so rarely used DeSean's speed on short drag/quick slant type routes rather than just using him as a vertical threat. Jameis struggled all year to hit him deep, and the few times they had DeSean run routes underneath, he created a lot of separation, but for some reason, they didn't use that very often. I also think they should have played Chris Godwin more; he was great this season but played a very limited role. And the Gruden/Dungy debate will rage on. Hard for Bucs fans to complain considering they got their Super Bowl but obviously things didn't end on a high note with Gruden. Koetter just wrapped his second season, didnt he? Yeah.. I don't know if there is for sure a right or wrong answer. I just know where I come down on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 4 hours ago, Dopey said: Am I the first to say " Let's kick the tires" ?? Can it be?!? Let's kick the tires, couldn't hurt. ...better hope they're run flats.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 3 hours ago, whatdrought said: True story. At least being a bills fan for the past 20 years there were changes made. Granted, we made poor changes, but nontheless, they were made. How does it feel to be a Bucs fan, or a Bengals fan and see them shovel the same crap every year. At least we have been treated to a diversity of crap. The Bucs are very poorly run by the Glazers. I maintain that firing Tony Dungy (right as he had constructed a great team and was about to turn the corner) was a completely imbecilic move. It's hard to argue with a Lombardi trophy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, Rob's House said: It's hard to argue with a Lombardi trophy. True enough. But at the end of the day, Gruden and Dungy have the same number of Lombardi trophies. After winning his Gruden didn't do much with a team that had 4 borderline HOFers (Dunn, Brooks, Lynch, Sapp). I'm not dying on this hill whatsoever, it just seems to me like it was a mistake to do what they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 17 minutes ago, whatdrought said: Koetter just wrapped his second season, didnt he? Yeah.. I don't know if there is for sure a right or wrong answer. I just know where I come down on it. That's right, it was his second season. I guess I've lost track of time haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 So McD is going to drop one cannabis abuser in Dareus to pick up another in Martin? Not likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 ALL TOAST TEAM NFC CAPTAIN: Doug Martin AFC CAPTAIN: Mike Tolbert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted March 9, 2018 Author Share Posted March 9, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Should update your title... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted March 9, 2018 Author Share Posted March 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said: Should update your title... Got it covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Would prefer Martin over Ivory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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