John from Riverside Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I am quite sure I heard him say that somewhere.... Then I see Takeo Spikes and Sam Adams on TV at the Pro Bowl saying "please get big Pat signed" What needs to happen here in someone who Pat respects like Takeo or Sam needs to get on the phone with Pat and tell him we are trying to biuld something here and cut that friggen money grabbing agent of his...... Come on Pat.....climb back on board and come in for the big win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Irked for seeing what the market bears? I'm sure he'll come back to Buffalo with the offers he has in hand to see if Buffalo can come close. I am quite sure I heard him say that somewhere.... Then I see Takeo Spikes and Sam Adams on TV at the Pro Bowl saying "please get big Pat signed" What needs to happen here in someone who Pat respects like Takeo or Sam needs to get on the phone with Pat and tell him we are trying to biuld something here and cut that friggen money grabbing agent of his...... Come on Pat.....climb back on board and come in for the big win 259041[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajzepp Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Would be nice to keep him.....no doubt. Though as much as I'd LOVE to be offered the money TD reportedly offered him, I have to say that if someone offered to double it I would have a hard time turning it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Caught between a rock and a hard place. The FA market for DTs is thin (if you can consider anything about DTs thin) so Phat is sure to command big bucks. I hope he at least gives the Bills a right of first refusal, but I'm not holding my breath. I'm afeared he's gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribo Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I'm sure he'll come back to Buffalo with the offers he has in hand to see if Buffalo can come close. 259045[/snapback] I am really hoping that that is PW's plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 At least he isn't 27 years old and has a number of decent years left. Someone will overpay and probably Jennings as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udonkey Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Where there is one fat man capable of stuffing the run, there will be plenty more. This is the NFL...where stars are born. We've got some young guys. Perhaps Pat leaving will open the door to someone stepping up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Where there is one fat man capable of stuffing the run, there will be plenty more. This is the NFL...where stars are born. We've got some young guys. Perhaps Pat leaving will open the door to someone stepping up. 259073[/snapback] Buy you know what though - would you want to deal with Donahoe after the way he's dealt with some of our FAs. I mean honestly - TD likes to flex his muscle in the offseason. Unless you're one of his "boys", he doesn't IMHO treat these guys with respect. I love the Bills but give me a break, I wouldn't want him as my boss...I had the impression guys would run thru walls for Butler - yeah, yeah, salary cap blah, blah, blah - but Butler and Polian had the guys' trust and respect. Can't say that for Donahoe. Charles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCBoston Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Don't sweat PW. Yeah, he'll be missed, but the dropoff won't be significant enough to doom our defense. I'm more worried about the LT spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven in MD Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Where there is one fat man capable of stuffing the run, there will be plenty more. This is the NFL...where stars are born. We've got some young guys. Perhaps Pat leaving will open the door to someone stepping up. 259073[/snapback] Except that when Mount Washington left the Bills we had a gap in the DL, and had to sign Adams to fill it. You cannot just find big and effective DTs. There are only a few in the league who are run stoppers and can stay in on passing downs too. Maybe the plan is to go to a 3-4 with Adams at NT...who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Buy you know what though - would you want to deal with Donahoe after the way he's dealt with some of our FAs. I mean honestly - TD likes to flex his muscle in the offseason. Unless you're one of his "boys", he doesn't IMHO treat these guys with respect. I love the Bills but give me a break, I wouldn't want him as my boss...I had the impression guys would run thru walls for Butler - yeah, yeah, salary cap blah, blah, blah - but Butler and Polian had the guys' trust and respect. Can't say that for Donahoe. Charles 259116[/snapback] Then why exactly is it that high class marquee players like Takeo Spikes jump at TD's team and offer, and arguably the most respected man in the NFL, Troy Vincent, decides to come play for TD for less money than other teams offered, publicly lauding the Bills organization? Why does Modrak decide to be TD's underling while turning down GM offers? I repeat, name one single player than TD let go in free agency that was an obvious mistake at the time or even in retrospect? Ted Washington is the only one that comes to mind and myself as well as most Bills fans think there was no way for TD to resign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Then why exactly is it that high class marquee players like Takeo Spikes jump at TD's team and offer, and arguably the most respected man in the NFL, Troy Vincent, decides to come play for TD for less money than other teams offered, publicly lauding the Bills organization? Why does Modrak decide to be TD's underling while turning down GM offers? I repeat, name one single player than TD let go in free agency that was an obvious mistake at the time or even in retrospect? Ted Washington is the only one that comes to mind and myself as well as most Bills fans think there was no way for TD to resign him. 259156[/snapback] That's enough of that. You don't want the rollercoaster to fly off the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I stopped trusting players with that "hometown discount" or "I'll give them a chance to match" crap after Biscuit bolted to Atlanta. IIRC, he promised the Bills they would have a chance to match any offer if they'd let him test the waters, so they gave him the opportunity. Next time they heard from him, he was under contract to the Falcons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theesir Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Both Pat and Jonas have BOTH said that they never even received a call from the Bills. What is Pat supposed to do, call TD and offer to play for x amount. The team has to at least make an offer before we can harrass the player for not taking the Hometown Discount Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tornado681 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Then why exactly is it that high class marquee players like Takeo Spikes jump at TD's team and offer, and arguably the most respected man in the NFL, Troy Vincent, decides to come play for TD for less money than other teams offered, publicly lauding the Bills organization? Why does Modrak decide to be TD's underling while turning down GM offers? I repeat, name one single player than TD let go in free agency that was an obvious mistake at the time or even in retrospect? Ted Washington is the only one that comes to mind and myself as well as most Bills fans think there was no way for TD to resign him. 259156[/snapback] Winfield? One of my favorite Bills...not sure if we could have signed him though based on our cap sit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Winfield? One of my favorite Bills...not sure if we could have signed him though based on our cap sit. 259205[/snapback] How exactly was it a mistake? Would the defense have been significantly better had he stayed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Winfield? One of my favorite Bills...not sure if we could have signed him though based on our cap sit. 259205[/snapback] I loved Winfield, too, but I doubt 1 in 100 Bills fans, myself included, would say at the time, or in retrospect, that TD should have signed AW for 36 million or whatever he got from the Vikings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTW_BillsFan Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Buy you know what though - would you want to deal with Donahoe after the way he's dealt with some of our FAs. I mean honestly - TD likes to flex his muscle in the offseason. Unless you're one of his "boys", he doesn't IMHO treat these guys with respect. I love the Bills but give me a break, I wouldn't want him as my boss...I had the impression guys would run thru walls for Butler - yeah, yeah, salary cap blah, blah, blah - but Butler and Polian had the guys' trust and respect. Can't say that for Donahoe. Charles 259116[/snapback] Yea, but Butler put us in cap jail and look at where Polian is at in Indy. It won't be long before Indy is in/already in cap jail. TD has to flex his muscles and keep us fiscally sound or we will be in big trouble. I don't think they necessarily have the respect of the players. Butler just gave them what they wanted. Wouldn't you be happy and back that person up if you got tons of money from them or would you say 'damn you Butler for overpaying me'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper13 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Antoine Winfield made $12.4 million dollars last year, that was the highest in the NFL last season. He is good but not that good. That would have killed the Bills cap. Signing Williams at what he wants would also kill the cap. It's obvious he just wants the most money he can get- just like every other player in the NFL. Why is anyone surprised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Antoine Winfield made $12.4 million dollars last year, that was the highest in the NFL last season. He is good but not that good. That would have killed the Bills cap. Signing Williams at what he wants would also kill the cap. It's obvious he just wants the most money he can get- just like every other player in the NFL. Why is anyone surprised? 259268[/snapback] No, that is not obvious whatsoever. It is possible. What is much more likely, IMO, is that he wants the most money that he can get out of the Bills, and testing FA is the only way to do it. If they are only willing to give him half of what other teams are willing to, do you really think he should just sign here because it's his duty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark VI Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Then why exactly is it that high class marquee players like Takeo Spikes jump at TD's team and offer, and arguably the most respected man in the NFL, Troy Vincent, decides to come play for TD for less money than other teams offered, publicly lauding the Bills organization? Why does Modrak decide to be TD's underling while turning down GM offers? I repeat, name one single player than TD let go in free agency that was an obvious mistake at the time or even in retrospect? Ted Washington is the only one that comes to mind and myself as well as most Bills fans think there was no way for TD to resign him. 259156[/snapback] I'm playing the Talking Heads " Stop Making Sense " in your honor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I'm playing the Talking Heads " Stop Making Sense " in your honor. 259283[/snapback] I am playing "Have a Cigar" in yours. Have a cigar you're gonna go far you'll fly high you're never gonna die they're gonna love you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarthur31 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Irked for seeing what the market bears? I'm sure he'll come back to Buffalo with the offers he has in hand to see if Buffalo can come close. 259045[/snapback] I don't know if you've been following the news lately but there is a demand for DT right now cuz there is a shortage of them in free agency. He'll hit it big somewhere desperate enough for line help (i.e., Denver). Would love to see Pat back again but he'll command top dollar and I think we should be reasonable and pay up. I want to forget about losing Ted Washington when he still had years left to give. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Maybe the plan is to go to a 3-4 with Adams at NT...who knows. 259148[/snapback] God I hope not. I'm not a big fan of the 3-4. I don't think we have the LBs to run a 3-4 as our base defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark VI Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I am playing "Have a Cigar" in yours. Have a cigar you're gonna go far you'll fly high you're never gonna die they're gonna love you. 259287[/snapback] I'm holding my burning lighter over my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tornado681 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 God I hope not. I'm not a big fan of the 3-4. I don't think we have the LBs to run a 3-4 as our base offense. 259293[/snapback] How about we just go back to B. Tit's (=B word breasts=Greggggg williams) '46' D...that worked out for us pretty well in 2001... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 How about we just go back to B. Tit's (=B word breasts=Greggggg williams) '46' D...that worked out for us pretty well in 2001... 259312[/snapback] What does that have to do with anything? We have a great defense right now. There is only one piece of the puzzle that might be missing from it and people are already talking about switching to a 3-4. The 46 was a stupid idea for a talent depleted roster like the Bills had in 2001, but do you mind telling me what that has to dow with what we're talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I'm playing the Talking Heads " Stop Making Sense " in your honor. 259283[/snapback] Now, now stop making me spit my chai on the keyboard... I love KTFBD but man, you know the market is what the market is - I don't want to mortgage our future either - but the strength of our team is that run defense. PW is a big part of that - God, knows we ain't got no pass rush. The only way this all makes sense is if TD is going after somebody like a Kevin Carter for less $$$. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven in MD Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Yea, but Butler put us in cap jail and look at where Polian is at in Indy. It won't be long before Indy is in/already in cap jail. TD has to flex his muscles and keep us fiscally sound or we will be in big trouble. I don't think they necessarily have the respect of the players. Butler just gave them what they wanted. Wouldn't you be happy and back that person up if you got tons of money from them or would you say 'damn you Butler for overpaying me'. 259224[/snapback] Shoot the flames....but is it better to make the playoffs like Indy knowing you will have a few down years of cap hell, or is it better to stay out of cap hell and never make the playoffs? Not all teams will be in cap hell the same year, so it seems like the great teams (except for the Pats who got lucky with Brady being a cheap QB, but that will change), have a 2-3 yr run then have 2-3 yrs of cap hell, just to reload and do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTW_BillsFan Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Shoot the flames....but is it better to make the playoffs like Indy knowing you will have a few down years of cap hell, or is it better to stay out of cap hell and never make the playoffs? Not all teams will be in cap hell the same year, so it seems like the great teams (except for the Pats who got lucky with Brady being a cheap QB, but that will change), have a 2-3 yr run then have 2-3 yrs of cap hell, just to reload and do it again. 259338[/snapback] Interesting concept. I guess that would work, but I'm not sure the fans would like the ups and downs so much. If you win a SB then ok, Indy isn't going to win a SB. Their defense isn't good enough and the teams that are well balanced can stop Indy. And just because you spend alot (Tennessee) doesn't mean you will win. I would think what is best for the franchise would be to manage the cap as best as possible and stay flexible (under the cap). I really like what Philly has done by creating cap room (clumps Philly article reference). Someone needs to tell TD about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I'm holding my burning lighter over my head. 259304[/snapback] Don't singe your hair. Didn't your mother tell you never to play with fire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I had the impression guys would run thru walls for Butler - yeah, yeah, salary cap blah, blah, blah - but Butler and Polian had the guys' trust and respect. Can't say that for Donahoe. 259116[/snapback] I'm more than happy to pass onto TKO, London, Lawyer and Troy Vincent how bad a boss TD is. Darn good thing that Mularkey (and not TD) is the coach, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eventualchamps Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 I thought Ron Edwards looked pretty darn good last year. If I had my druthers I would go with Edwards but then try to pick up a stud DE. Because as someone mentioned before, our pass rush stinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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