Buffalo Barbarian Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Yeah, but if you draft Peterman he comes with an Urban Sombrero. you lost me there? I saw an inconsistent kid that has time to grow. I'll give him that time before I crown him or not, best I can offer you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 If Dennison is intent on bringing the WCO to Buffalo, there's major changes ahead. We've had a number of WCO topics through the years, with a consensus that it would be difficult in Orchard Park late Fall/Winter. Walsh's O had a fine run game which would still feature Shady and they used Rathman as FB a lot. But even with a predominately short passing attack that may work in swirling winds, that ball is hard and cold for what likely would be 30-35 passes per game. So, apocalypse be damned, I agree with Bandit. Whatever offense he decides to install, we'll be looking for that type of passer. Would you say our weather conditions are that much worse than Philly's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Who Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Thanks for the OP. Those who think this is as weak a qb class as 2013 are too pessimistic. Still like Watson the best, but Mahomes is intriguing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuoteTheRaven83 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I agree with what Mayock says and I don't think any of these QBs are worth a first round grade IMO. No thanks to any QB in the 2017 draft. I'd rather go into this season with Taylor and Cardale and deal with a new QB in next years draft. QB isn't the most pressing need IMO if we keep Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I agree with what Mayock says and I don't think any of these QBs are worth a first round grade IMO. Not what he said. He said none of them are worth a top 10 grade. I like Mayock. Lot of respect for his work. But he did say last year he thought Goff and Wentz were "every bit as good and maybe better" than Winston and Mariota. It was crazy talk so as much as I respect him I will always trust my own eyes before deferring to any of the experts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Not what he said. He said none of them are worth a top 10 grade. I like Mayock. Lot of respect for his work. But he did say last year he thought Goff and Wentz were "every bit as good and maybe better" than Winston and Mariota. It was crazy talk so as much as I respect him I will always trust my own eyes before deferring to any of the experts. Goff is a bum, Wentz will be the man, it's pretty clear watching him that he has what it takes to play in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 (edited) Goff is a bum, Wentz will be the man, it's pretty clear watching him that he has what it takes to play in this league. I'm not sure it is. I think the back half of last season he looked really bad. I am not writing him off yet but I certainly don't believe it is pretty clear. If he hadn't had the first 4 games he had the narrative on the two trade ups last year would be "disasters". His last 8 games he was barely a 60% passer throwing 7TDs and 9INTs and averaging less than 6ypa. Simply put he is still and intruiging prospect but he was miles away from convincing last season. I don't think Wentz or Goff has any chance of having a better career than Winston or Mariota. Edited February 10, 2017 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice2145 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I'm not sure it is. I think the back half of last season he looked really bad. I am not writing him off yet but I certainly don't believe it is pretty clear. If he hadn't had the first 4 games he had the narrative on the two trade ups last year would be "disasters". His last 8 games he was barely a 60% passer throwing 7TDs and 9INTs and averaging less than 6ypa. Simply put he is still and intruiging prospect but he was miles away from convincing last season. I don't think Wentz or Goff has any chance of having a better career than Winston or Mariota. IMHO, Wentz and Goff were classic examples of teams reaching for a QB. I don't believe they should have went 1 and 2. This year teams will reach again for the likes of Kizer, Watson, Trubisky, and Mahomes. Question is will it be the Bills? Hope they learned from the EJ debacle. Go get Brain Hoyer or Grapalo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I'm not sure it is. I think the back half of last season he looked really bad. I am not writing him off yet but I certainly don't believe it is pretty clear. If he hadn't had the first 4 games he had the narrative on the two trade ups last year would be "disasters". His last 8 games he was barely a 60% passer throwing 7TDs and 9INTs and averaging less than 6ypa. Simply put he is still and intruiging prospect but he was miles away from convincing last season. I don't think Wentz or Goff has any chance of having a better career than Winston or Mariota. yea when teams started blitzing and getting pressure on Wentz he crumbled...just like the knock on him coming out said. Goff/Wentz are bums. I would take Mahomes/Trubisky over either of them today - knowing they are projects Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice2145 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 yea when teams started blitzing and getting pressure on Wentz he crumbled...just like the knock on him coming out said. Goff/Wentz are bums. I would take Mahomes/Trubisky over either of them today - knowing they are projects I don't think Goff will ever be a franchise QB. Wentz has potential but not likely as well. I am not high on Mahomes or Trubisky. They are worth a shot if taken in third round. However, we all know they will be long gone. IMHO, they are not first round material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 (edited) I don't think Goff will ever be a franchise QB. Wentz has potential but not likely as well. I am not high on Mahomes or Trubisky. They are worth a shot if taken in third round. However, we all know they will be long gone. IMHO, they are not first round material. We will know one way or the other on Goff by the end of next year. McVeigh and Fleur are two of the most creative young offensive minds in the league. If they can't improve him then he is sunk. I still say it is not technique so much as it is mentality that is causing his struggles... he chronically looks short on confidence and I don't know how someone who comes into the league as a 1st overall pick finds himself there. That is a big salvage job in my opinion and I suspect McVeigh signed up for having one go at that but if he isn't showing significant progress by the end of 2017 they will move on. EDIT: There was always the old adage about when QBs go 1 & 2 one is good and the other is bad.... maybe 2015 and 2016 will average out overall.... Winston and Mariota good.... Wentz and Goff bad. Edited February 10, 2017 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I don't think Goff will ever be a franchise QB. Wentz has potential but not likely as well. I am not high on Mahomes or Trubisky. They are worth a shot if taken in third round. However, we all know they will be long gone. IMHO, they are not first round material. My scouting friend told me that Goff reminded him of Kyle Boller... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 My scouting friend told me that Goff reminded him of Kyle Boller... What 'cos he came out of Cal? I don't really remember anything about Boller's game.... just that he wasn't good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ice2145 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 What ever happened to letting the QB sit and develop for a few years? Guess they make too much money for that to happen. Should more teams go back to doing this. We might see more successful long term QB's? I know there are plenty of variables in play. Just thought it might be a good discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 What 'cos he came out of Cal? I don't really remember anything about Boller's game.... just that he wasn't good. Something about Goff being a robot. Didn't like intangibles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Something about Goff being a robot. Didn't like intangibles. Interesting. That is the one thing that I think is really hard for amateurs like me to get a handle on. I can see a bit how he appears to be with his teammates on the field but I can't see how he is in the locker room or in the huddle or in practice. I do think it is his mental makeup and his personal elements that have caused him big problems at the next level so far. The intangibles don't seem to be there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Interesting. That is the one thing that I think is really hard for amateurs like me to get a handle on. I can see a bit how he appears to be with his teammates on the field but I can't see how he is in the locker room or in the huddle or in practice. I do think it is his mental makeup and his personal elements that have caused him big problems at the next level so far. The intangibles don't seem to be there Yes, for amateur scouts it's harder to get the intangibles right. Look at Dak. For the outsider he was a a bad guy from the DUI. From people that knew more he is a workaholic, high character guy that dedicates every game to his mom that died. Dak asked his college coach to change the offense so that he could be more ready for the NFL. That's the sign of a guy that can lead a team, not just be a passenger. Proactive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Yes, for amateur scouts it's harder to get the intangibles right. Look at Dak. For the outsider he was a a bad guy from the DUI. From people that knew more he is a workaholic, high character guy that dedicates every game to his mom that died. Dak asked his college coach to change the offense so that he could be more ready for the NFL. That's the sign of a guy that can lead a team, not just be a passenger. Proactive. I actually always had Dak tabbed as a leader just from what you saw on tape. It was what got him a low 2nd round grade for me in the end, I'd had him as a 3rd rounder most of the way last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I actually always had Dak tabbed as a leader just from what you saw on tape. It was what got him a low 2nd round grade for me in the end, I'd had him as a 3rd rounder most of the way last year. Yes, if only Whaley didn't try to help Rex fix his D last year at the expense of drafting Dak Bills would be in much better shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 yea when teams started blitzing and getting pressure on Wentz he crumbled...just like the knock on him coming out said. Goff/Wentz are bums. I would take Mahomes/Trubisky over either of them today - knowing they are projects That and he has a hitch in his delivery (like bortles)... Oh and you guys complain about TT missing open receivers. Put on a wentz tape and tell me what you see.... but ooooh hes a rookie! so its ok! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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