Deranged Rhino Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 5-4 is not "good" it's barely above average. We make too many dumb mistakes to be considered "good". I didn't realize the season ended after nine games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 A summation of Chandler's career in Buffalo to date. I know I harp on it a lot......but I cannot overstate what a top 5 TE would do for this team....... There are some teams that have TWO OR THREE TE's that are better then what we have - We need a TE that doesnt get rag dolled by pass rushers on their way to the QB.....want a cleaner pocket? Sure we need better OL play....but a TE to help on the more dominant pass rushers in the league is NEEDED - Chandler does catch the ball.....and then he doesnt have the athleticism to do anything with it......a TE who is actually a threat that you have to account for would do wonders for this team We need to score more points We have beaten the bears and lions both on the road......both considered to be good teams We went into the jets stadium and beat them for the first time in years We do in fact have a winning record Our defense is super bowl caliber This is in fact a "good" team....the problem is there appears to be several "good" teams this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) Well of course you're not buying it because you're changing the question. You asked what was different between this year's team and last year's team. It was answered, and then you changed the subject to something else. Makes it tough to have an honest conversation with you. I guess I'm not following you. Did I "change the question" by comparing this team to Cleveland? Was that dishonest in your view? If so, how? I don't understand your reasoning and I don't understand why you've chosen to make this personal. Perhaps it stems from your view, expressed in response to a post by Bills Vet in this thread, that any "objective" viewer would conclude that this team is much improved--as if anyone who disagrees is failing to be objective. Edited November 10, 2014 by mannc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 I didn't realize the season ended after nine games. It doesn't. For all I know we could be "good" by the end of the year. But as of right now, at 5-4, and as many dumb mistakes we make, I can't qualify this team as good. Over the next 7 games, this team could change to "good", or "terrible", based on how they evolve as a team... or they could stay pat at "around average". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Truth Posted November 10, 2014 Author Share Posted November 10, 2014 You could have said this in 2002, 2006, 2008, 2011, and this season. Doesn't matter how much talent you've got if the coaches can't use it effectively. Who on this team isn't living up to their potential statistically? Our team's talent has been used effectively. Other than Spiller, maybe. On another note, Marrone gets no credit for the defense but all the blame for the offense. Marrone hired two very good coordinators. Does that not count for something? He should get credit for the defense. And, it's not like he has no say in the defense even after hiring those coordinators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 mannc has honest conversations? Thanks for your contribution to the thread. What did I do to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 I guess I'm not following you. Did I "change the question" by comparing this team to Cleveland? Yes. You did change the question. Your original question was: Please explain how any of this is different from last year's KC game. In 2013, didn't we dominate KC in time of possession, yardage, etc. and still manage to lose? Couldn't you have said the exact same thing after last years game at RWS? And aren't we still in the same situation, on the outside of the playoffs looking in? How is this year any different? No mention of Cleveland or anything else, you asked a question which was answered: This year's team is better. Last year's team was playing a 3rd string, undrafted free agent rookie at QB, two injured RBs, a WR corps without a true #1 WR and a defense that couldn't stop a runny nose. You didn't like the answer (because it doesn't allow you to bash the Bills which is what you're looking to do), so you changed it to: Sorry, I'm not buying it. This team has lost three of four games at home, including two blowouts, and appears to be headed for 7-9. Although we lament games like yesterday that were there for the taking, this team could just as easily be 3-6. I can't help comparing this team to Cleveland, which after hiring a quality head coach, appears to be headed for the playoffs and is about to add the best WR in football to its roster. Oh, and they have two number 1 picks next spring. "Not buying it", even though the response was factual and not a matter of opinion. The Bills last season lost to the Chiefs with a third string QB and a far less talented roster. That's why the loss was different. Was that dishonest in your view? If so, how? If not dishonest, it was poorly argued as I just demonstrated. Look, if you want to have an honest conversation about the state of the team, I'm your guy. If you want to troll or bash the Bills just because you feel like being disingenuous, there are plenty of ways to do it without being ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjjr Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 This is the best, most talented team we've seen since the near playoff team in 2004 and probably more like 1999. The defense is there....The offense has got to find some consistency, especially in the red zone or will not be able to win enough games to make the playoffs. This is a must win against the Dolphins. Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Yes. You did change the question. Your original question was: No mention of Cleveland or anything else, you asked a question which was answered: You didn't like the answer (because it doesn't allow you to bash the Bills which is what you're looking to do), so you changed it to: "Not buying it", even though the response was factual and not a matter of opinion. The Bills last season lost to the Chiefs with a third string QB and a far less talented roster. That's why the loss was different. If not dishonest, it was poorly argued as I just demonstrated. Look, if you want to have an honest conversation about the state of the team, I'm your guy. If you want to troll or bash the Bills just because you feel like being disingenuous, there are plenty of ways to do it without being ridiculous. Your response pointed out ways in which you believe the 2013 team was inferior to this one. I would agree that we are stronger in some areas this year, most notably at QB. We also appear to be better at WR. The defense is very good this year, but I believe it was good last year, too; it just got worn down by the offense's repeated inability to avoid going three and out. My point was that, despite the improvement in certain areas this year, I don't really see evidence on the field that this team is significantly better. The evidence of improvement cited by the OP--that this team statistically dominated a very good KC team yesterday--was equally true last year and therefore does not by itself prove very much. How was anything I said "trolling" or "ridiculous"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 5-4 is not "good" it's barely above average. We make too many dumb mistakes to be considered "good". and don't forget, if Detroit had a kicker we are 4-5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 and don't forget, if Detroit had a kicker we are 4-5 Thats why they play the games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Your response pointed out ways in which you believe the 2013 team was inferior to this one. No, I answered the question you asked. Before you changed your question. I would agree that we are stronger in some areas this year, most notably at QB. We also appear to be better at WR. The defense is very good this year, but I believe it was good last year, too; it just got worn down by the offense's repeated inability to avoid going three and out. The defense this year is better, statistically and talent wise. It's demonstrable and evident if you watch the game. This year's loss was not because the offense kept going three and out, it was the culmination of self inflicted wounds that cost them this time. Last year they were thoroughly outmatched by the Chiefs and playing a UDFA at QB -- it was a game they were hoping to win and couldn't do it. Yesterday was a game the Bills dominated in every element but for the only one that matters -- the final score. Any argument to the contrary is false and can be proven so by looking at the stats and game film. My point was that, despite the improvement in certain areas this year, I don't really see evidence on the field that this team is significantly better. That's easy to do if you ignore the statistical improvements this team has made as well as the overall level of play each Sunday, which you are continuing to do. Outside of losing Kiko to injury, this team is better and deeper at nearly every position. The defense is better statistically and the team was 3-7 headed into week 11 compared to 5-4 now. So, there is plenty of evidence this team is not only better, but significantly better than last year. But you don't want to talk about those things it seems. The evidence of improvement cited by the OP--that this team statistically dominated a very good KC team yesterday--was equally true last year and therefore does not by itself prove very much. How was anything I said "trolling" or "ridiculous"? Pretty much everything you've said has been ridiculous or trolling. Or, poorly thought out. One of the three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog69 Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 This is the best, most talented team we've seen since the near playoff team in 2004 and probably more like 1999. The defense is there....The offense has got to find some consistency, especially in the red zone or will not be able to win enough games to make the playoffs. This is a must win against the Dolphins. Go Bills! Isn't it sad that this is what the Bills have forced us into over the last decade and a half. Picking through a pile of crap to find the piece of poop that stinks the least? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 On paper we are a good team. Talent on the field, we are a good team. But we are an inconsistent team. The offense needs to be better, no one can deny that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 On paper we are a good team. Talent on the field, we are a good team. But we are an inconsistent team. The offense needs to be better, no one can deny that. You're right. Consistency has to be learned. And it's impossible to learn it if you're constantly blowing up the foundation and rebuilding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flmike Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Perhaps it's more true that the Bills are a "better" team than in past years. They have a very good and mostly well-coached defense that still needs a replacement for McKelvin and more of a killer instinct on 3rd downs. There is something really wrong offensively, considering the talent there. The OL is not pro-bowl quality, but I feel they are being misused by the staff. Now, some teams do get into the playoffs with strength on just one side of the ball, but when that's defense, the offense has to be able to control the ball better. Let's hope. I will enjoy watching what happens but I do hope for some significant changes in the coaching staff next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) Few things crack me up more than fans who find it necessary to piss on any optimism with the whole 'moral victories' nonsense. Yes, once again the ball bounced the wrong way and a game the Bills should have won was lost. Again. We get it. But outside of playing NE*, this defense will keep us in every game this year, and the more the OL gets together, the better they'll play. So perhaps the OP should change the title to say "We're Much Better" instead of "We're Good," because this team IS much better than it's been in a long time, and if you are unable to see and appreciate that, then you're just being unrealistic. Hell, all you have to do is go back to the day you heard Kiko was out for the year. Did any of you back then think you'd see this insane level of D play? Of course not. Look. I get it. Some of you just need to complain about something. But don't let your obsessive need to complain blind you to the progress being made. Edited November 10, 2014 by LABillzFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 You're right. Consistency has to be learned. And it's impossible to learn it if you're constantly blowing up the foundation and rebuilding. thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Few things crack me up more than fans who find it necessary to piss on any optimism with the whole 'moral victories' nonsense. Yes, once again the ball bounced the wrong way and a game the Bills should have won was lost. Again. We get it. But outside of playing NE*, this defense will keep us in every game this year, and the more the OL gets together, the better they'll play. So perhaps the OP should change the title to say "We're Much Better" instead of "We're Good," because this team IS much better than it's been in a long time, and if you are unable to see and appreciate that, then you're just being unrealistic. Hell, all you have to do is go back to the day you heard Kiko was out for the year. Did any of you back then think you'd see this insane level of D play? Of course not. Look. I get it. Some of you just need to complain about something. But don't let your obsessive need to complain blind you to the progress being made. There has been progress. I will not deny that but thats why yesterday was so frustrating. Everyone is sick of being the lovable losers and coming close. I am one of the most optimistic Bills fan, but just like the San Diego and NE games, they wilted against a good opponent in a game they should be able to win. Watching yesterday from the stands, you could just see it happening. The Bills slowly went from playoff contender to paper tiger. They have to find a way to stop this culture of losing. Frankly, I just don't see a playoff team here. They need to learn to win and make it a habit instead of coming close, again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Malooga Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 "Good" teams win games like that, rather than finding a way to blow it. They are a decent team...lots of talent...but nowhere near ready to compete against the best in the playoffs. We will see exactly how good this team is on December 7th, 14th, and 28th...when they actually play "good" teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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