A very public about-face

[B-Man]

The best coach in college history (IMO) had over a month to gameplan for the ND defense and their best player. The gameplan worked. Sure, Te'o played a poor game, but the oppositions game plan had something to do with it. He was a stud before the Alabama game and he's a stud now. Is he worth the 8th pick? Idk, but I believe he's going to be a very solid pro and any team that drafts him will have a productive LB starting for as long as he suits up every Sunday.

 

 

Yes, you're exaggerating. As are most here who don't want him. To me, his only negative is this whole fake gf issue. I don't know what to make of it. I'm not going to pretend I do. The people here who don't want him, you're entitled to not wanting him, but if you're going to make assumptions, you should at least do some research (ie watching the video that was posted so you can actually make a real comment about him. As opposed to saying "And as far as reading the QB is concerned. I Didnt watch the video but I'm thinking a young college QB that is far from pro level is hard to read where he's going with the ball. (As sarcastic as I can say it)". That just sound ignorant IMO;

 

 

Well put sir.

[Bud Adams]

Te"O is an All-American, a starter for three years and has improved each year.

 

This is the crux of your argument? Would you like me to start a list of all of the All-American, three-year college starters who "improved each year" -- only to become busts in the NFL?

 

BA

[NewEra]

 

 

This is the crux of your argument? Would you like me to start a list of all of the All-American, three-year college starters who "improved each year" -- only to become busts in the NFL?

 

BA

 

I would.

 

The crux of his argument is that you can't judge a player by one game.

Edited January 21, 2013 by NewEra

[1billsfan]

Love that kid. I'd have no issue taking any of the pass rusher that might be available (j jones, Werner, mingo, Jordan). Would you be upset of we took any of the other guys, other than Jordan?

 

This is a league hugely based on offense and I'd lean more to drafting a top WR like Patterson. I'd of course be happy drafting any of those defensive players as long as there's a very good chance they'll have a serious impact on defense and the game. The reason I like Jordan so much is the guy seems like a freak of nature type of player who would have a big impact in all phases of defense.

[B-Man]

This is the crux of your argument? Would you like me to start a list of all of the All-American, three-year college starters who "improved each year" -- only to become busts in the NFL?

 

BA

 

LOL................what a weak counter-argument

 

No list needed, since it would not really prove anything. Many All-Americans succeed, some fail.

 

 

Funny, no one wants to debate with the "professional NFL scouts all put him in the top 15 picks" argument.

 

They must be blinded by "hype"..................lol

 

 

 

.

[Johnny Hammersticks]

Alec Ogletree vs Alabama

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZy_y0on4u8

[NewEra]

 

 

This is a league hugely based on offense and I'd lean more to drafting a top WR like Patterson. I'd of course be happy drafting any of those defensive players as long as there's a very good chance they'll have a serious impact on defense and the game. The reason I like Jordan so much is the guy seems like a freak of nature type of player who would have a big impact in all phases of defense.

 

Considering that Baltimore and SF beat 2 teams with inferior defenses and superior offenses, I think your opening statement is meh. The league is hugely based on being well coached, having a good QB and filling in the blanks.

[#34fan]

This is the crux of your argument? Would you like me to start a list of all of the All-American, three-year college starters who "improved each year" -- only to become busts in the NFL?

 

BA

 

If you're sayin "NO" for Teo @8, What's your major hangup with him? -Just not good enough? Do you agree that he's still young, and should be allowed to grow as a player and a person?

[NewEra]

Alec Ogletree vs Alabama

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZy_y0on4u8

 

I like ogletree. I think he'll be an awesome pro. Saban didn't have 5 weeks to game plan for this game. His record in games where he has that much time speaks for itself. I take it into consideration.

[1billsfan]

Considering that Baltimore and SF beat 2 teams with inferior defenses and superior offenses, I think your opening statement is meh. The league is hugely based on being well coached, having a good QB and filling in the blanks.

 

There's a lot of players I like at #8 and it's early on in the draft season so I'm still very open to who we pick there. But I've got to confess, if it comes down to having to pick between an evenly graded stud ILB or stud WR, I'm going stud WR...LOL I'm putting my "big money" there and not at the LB position.

[Hammertown]

this.

 

And as far as reading the QB is concerned. I Didnt watch the video but I'm thinking a young college QB that is far from pro level is hard to read where he's going with the ball. (As sarcastic as I can say it)

 

I watched him in the national championship game which was as close to a pro football team as he's gonna face until he gets there and he looked horrible. He was run over, around and through. He was more out of place than Chris Kelsey on more than half of his plays. He was slower to react and get into the play than Pozlusny and he was was happy to jump into piles after the play was over and boast about it like Aaron Maybin.

 

Maybe I'm a little exagerrative here but I saw it enough to not want this guy anywhere near the Buffalo Bills unless he comes here to play against us and get jukes out of his shoes by CJ on every other play.

I certainly hope these people saying things like this also don't want Jarvis Jones. Alabama did the same thing to Jones in the SEC championship game as they did to Manti Te'o in the BCS game.

[NoSaint]

 

 

If you're sayin "NO" for Teo @8, What's your major hangup with him? -Just not good enough? Do you agree that he's still young, and should be allowed to grow as a player and a person?

 

I'm saying no because I think he's the 20-30th best prospect and might be a 2 down player.

 

I think he's the type that could be a very good contributor and counted on to be productive but I don't think he's in my top 8 prospects.

[CSBill]

I'd been making fun of poor Man'ti Teo for weeks before his public "catfish" scandal. I've called him things like Man'-purse, Man'-boobs, -The Lyin' Hawaiian... All said with good-natured fun in mind.

 

However, I have publicly questioned his speed, drive, and tackling ability as a MLB... I now believe that this was extremely pre-mature on my part... Admittedly, I was considering just a tiny part of the "big picture" with a kid like Mant'i Teo.

 

No, Mant'i isn't as fast as I'd prefer, nor do I see the relentlessness in pursuit of a Luke Kuechly, but he does some other important things very well..

 

For example, the kid reads a QB as good as any LB out there, as seen at 2:34, 3:50, and 3:17 of this video. -He's very instinctive in his pursuit. His tackling may not fly at the pro level, but hey, -he isn't a pro. That can be taught as long as he's willing to learn.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCPuKJyoSvE

 

Then there's the Michigan game... (youtube.com/watch?v=wa7E9X-1nN0) At 1:40, and 2:26 you can see that the kid has hands, and very good ball skills. He covers space, and closes gaps well... and again, his instinctiveness compensates fo him not being very fleet-of-foot.

 

I wasn't allowed to post media of the Stanford game either (youtube.com/watch?v=tEmgY4f9g8E) but if you go there, you'll see examples of great penetration and recognition. I watched this game live, and saw Mant'i take a few plays off, but overall, I thought he did well against a very good Stanford rushing attack.

 

Then there's this:

 

Bills new defensive coordinator Mike Pettine was asked in a 1-on-1 interview with Buffalobills.com if he’s married to the 3-4 base defense coming to Buffalo. Here was his response.

“I’m not. Again it’s a situation where I think people try to compartmentalize too much and just broad stroke it 3-4, 4-3, what are you? And my answer to that question is yes to all of the above,” Pettine told Buffalobills.com. ”We are a multiple front, attacking, pressure-style defense. We’re going to play man coverage, we’re going to play zone coverage. What we’re going to do defensively is take advantage of what our players do well."

 

I've come to realize that the question isn't so much what Mant'i Teo is now, but rather what a DC like Pettine can turn this kid into, which given everything I know about both, could be a FEARSOME run-stopper, pass-rusher, and multi-use tackling drone.

 

Then I get to thinking what could happen if we take a good "later-round" 4-3 OLB prospect like Devonte Holloman: youtube.com/watch?v=Teqxo_K2kOc[/media] in addition to Te'o...

 

Add to that an outstanding FS prospect like Florida's Matt Elam: youtube.com/watch?v=rREjDTpTedE

 

Mmm.... I can smell the sacks already!

 

Do I have character concerns about Mant'i? -You betcha. As well as questions regarding his overall mental fitness, and leadership skills, but the bottom line is that nobody's perfect... certainly not in the NFL... If Mant'i can learn from his mistakes, and re-gain control of his personal life, this could end up being really good for Bills nation. Much better, IMHO, than wasting a high-pick on a local QB who makes very few next-level throws, and who put together just two decent seasons in a four year collegiate career!

 

No thanks, there are better athletes, even if he is available

 

The best coach in college history (IMO) had over a month to gameplan for the ND defense and their best player. The gameplan worked. Sure, Te'o played a poor game, but the oppositions game plan had something to do with it. He was a stud before the Alabama game and he's a stud now. Is he worth the 8th pick? Idk, but I believe he's going to be a very solid pro and any team that drafts him will have a productive LB starting for as long as he suits up every Sunday.

 

 

Yes, you're exaggerating. As are most here who don't want him. To me, his only negative is this whole fake gf issue. I don't know what to make of it. I'm not going to pretend I do. The people here who don't want him, you're entitled to not wanting him, but if you're going to make assumptions, you should at least do some research (ie watching the video that was posted so you can actually make a real comment about him. As opposed to saying "And as far as reading the QB is concerned. I Didnt watch the video but I'm thinking a young college QB that is far from pro level is hard to read where he's going with the ball. (As sarcastic as I can say it)". That just sound ignorant IMO;

 

Two things:

 

1 - So what you're saying is the ND coaches suck, they had the same time and sure didn't come up with much

 

2 - Not that I wouldn't like to have him, but not as a number 8 pick, need better at the spot

[truth on hold]

 

I certainly hope these people saying things like this also don't want Jarvis Jones. Alabama did the same thing to Jones in the SEC championship game as they did to Manti Te'o in the BCS game.

That's a really good point. Bama was able to move the ball in that game as well. Didn't score quite as many points but that can be attributed to Georgia's offense having a lot more success against bama's D than ND's.

[mrags]

 

 

The best coach in college history (IMO) had over a month to gameplan for the ND defense and their best player. The gameplan worked. Sure, Te'o played a poor game, but the oppositions game plan had something to do with it. He was a stud before the Alabama game and he's a stud now. Is he worth the 8th pick? Idk, but I believe he's going to be a very solid pro and any team that drafts him will have a productive LB starting for as long as he suits up every Sunday.

 

 

Yes, you're exaggerating. As are most here who don't want him. To me, his only negative is this whole fake gf issue. I don't know what to make of it. I'm not going to pretend I do. The people here who don't want him, you're entitled to not wanting him, but if you're going to make assumptions, you should at least do some research (ie watching the video that was posted so you can actually make a real comment about him. As opposed to saying "And as far as reading the QB is concerned. I Didnt watch the video but I'm thinking a young college QB that is far from pro level is hard to read where he's going with the ball. (As sarcastic as I can say it)". That just sound ignorant IMO;

just like my original reply, I respect your opinion of him hit I don't see it.

 

As far as the video that I didn't watch, and how ignorant I sound. Isn't it kind of ignorant for you to say the same?

 

I stated that I watched every play of an entire game. Saw every good play (there weren't many) and every bad play (there was a ton) and I've come to my conclusion. I get your point that you can't judge a player solely on one performance but if that's the case, why bother watching a video that's nothing but highlight clips of said player? seems like a waste of time to me. I could find a video like that of Ryan Fitzpatrick and say he's as good as Tom Brady. Or a video of Aaron Maybins 6 sacks a few years ago with the Jets and come to the same conclusion.

 

I based my opinion off of an entire game against the best players he's faced in his entire career on colleges biggest stage and he looked horrible. It proved everything I needed to know. I don't need to see highlight films of him, especially against college QBs that are nothing compared to NFL QBs and how they look off defenders routinely.

 

Fwiw, that video is 14+ minutes and I don't have the patience to sit through it right and that's why I didn't watch it. I saw the first minute or so and saw an out of place Teo in the first play, an over pursuit on another play which he came back to make the play for no gain when it should have been a loss and another where he got jukes out of his shoes on the way to a QB run for a TD. And that's about the length of that video that I wanna see right now and have people try and defend his play.

 

Again, I respect your opinion but I disagree with it. I don't think he's a good football player, I feel he's over rated and I feel that people like him in a similar way that they like Kyle Williams for being a big white blue collar lunchbox to work type of player. With that said, he made the pro bowl this year because people backed out, not because he deserved it and because he is IMO over rated just like Manti Teo.

 

Ill shut up now. Enjoy your night.

[3rdand12]

There's a lot of players I like at #8 and it's early on in the draft season so I'm still very open to who we pick there. But I've got to confess, if it comes down to having to pick between an evenly graded stud ILB or stud WR, I'm going stud WR...LOL I'm putting my "big money" there and not at the LB position.

Early is correct.

i dont think there is wide rec at #8 worthwhile but defensive 7 yes a couple of them . And more later in the draft.

 

34 i have done the exact opposite. i was on the bandwagon for M T. After digging deeper and a closer look.

He is not for me.

[NoSaint]

 

 

No thanks, there are better athletes, even if he is available

 

 

 

Two things:

 

1 - So what you're saying is the ND coaches suck, they had the same time and sure didn't come up with much

 

2 - Not that I wouldn't like to have him, but not as a number 8 pick, need better at the spot

 

Ill generally say yes to all 3 points. Maybe not suck, but they were going up against the best in the business. A 6 week gap between games, not to mention some behind the scenes distractions.... Saban too them to the woodshed. Just like he did lsu last year. There's a difference between sucking and getting beaten by the best and that's what saban and Alabama are right now.

[mrags]

 

 

I would.

 

The crux of his argument is that you can't judge a player by one game.

already answered this in my long thread. If you can't judge based on one game, then why bother to watch the video where it proves he's good. Or any other highlight video for that matter.

 

Just saying.

[NoSaint]

already answered this in my long thread. If you can't judge based on one game, then why bother to watch the video where it proves he's good. Or any other highlight video for that matter.

 

Just saying.

 

You can't based on a YouTube clip either. You need to take a composite of a lot of things.

 

Teo more often then not falls on the very good side. Well he had his worst day on his biggest stage, he had fantastic days on pretty big stages.

 

The problem is he's not a "rare enough" guy to go top ten. He's a bit more poz, or maualuga than a game changer. I love getting a solid reliable player but at 8 you want the type of athlete that you can't get at the top of the second or in free agency.

 

Teo would immediately make us a better team, but he wouldn't be the best available player at 8. If he slides a bit I'd love him in the second

[#34fan]

No thanks, there are better athletes, even if he is available

 

Better athletes, perhaps... But are better athletes necessarily difference makers?

 

My point is this; -as much as I'd like to believe differently, ND doesn't go undefeated in the regular season without Mant'i Teo... Louis Nix was huge all year as well, but Teo clearly elevated that defensive backfield when he played.

 

All season ND's QB situation was a question mark at best... You can't say Teo didn't do his part to keep the Irish from getting scored on.

Edited January 22, 2013 by #34fan