FreakPop Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 there are no charlie batch lovers, just saying batch and fitz are in the same group. Really dude! You are just over the top with your Fitz hate. Do you do it on purpose to stir the pot? If not you are truly clueless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Really dude! You are just over the top with your Fitz hate. Do you do it on purpose to stir the pot? If not you are truly clueless. so what has fitz done to make him better than charlie batch? please do explain.........lay off with clueless talk Jack. lets be civil here what intangible skill does fitz have that batch does not? explain without attacking my charecter please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 so what has fitz done to make him better than charlie batch? please do explain.........lay off with clueless talk Jack. lets be civil here what intangible skill does fitz have that batch does not? explain without attacking my charecter please. Alright here we go: Batch's career completion % - 56.6 Fitz - 59.5% Batch's highest yard passing 2489 Fitz - 3832 Batch most tds in a season 13 Fitz 24 Batch Yds/game 135.2!!!!!!!!!! Fitz 191.5 would you really take a qb who throws for about 135 yards a game and less than 1 td a game? Can we put this to bed now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronc24 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I would NOT take the following teams starters over Fitz. Jets Browns - Weeden, given two years, will be better than Fitz. Dolphins-maybe as Tannyhill is just a rookie It's Tannehill. Titans Jaguars Chiefs Raiders-maybe, inconsistancy issues, kinda what we have now with Fitz I'd actually take Fitz here. Chargers-maybe, see Raiders Not even close Rivers is a much better QB than Fitz could ever hope to be. Eagles-maybe I like Foles Way better arm than Fitz. Vikings Bucs Seriously? You'd take Fitz over Josh Freeman? That explains a lot. Panthers-maybe Cam would need to show me alot more maturity as I think he is headed down the V Young path, headcase I wouldn't want any part of. What evidence do you have to back this absurd statement up? Fitz doesn't touch Cam as a QB. Cardinals 49ers-maybe Capaernick I'll take, Smith no Kaepernick and Smith are both much better than Fitz. Rams-maybe, I actually like Bradford, but he hasn't taken that next step as a #1 should have by now. Definitely would take Bradford over Fitz. Seahawks-not sold on Wilson Yeah, because engineering 4th quarter victories, to Fitz lovers, is a foreign concept you cannot quite grasp. So to me Fitz is middle of the road, not the best and not the worst. All this bellyaching about how horrible Fitz is, is hogwash at best. Wanting to stand pat with a QB who does not have the skill set to consistently win in the NFL is hogwash. He can't throw deep, he makes questionable decisions and, frankly, he just isn't that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerNapalm Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Why would "Elite" even be an option? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 (edited) Alright here we go: Batch's career completion % - 56.6 Fitz - 59.5% Batch's highest yard passing 2489 Fitz - 3832 Batch most tds in a season 13 Fitz 24 Batch Yds/game 135.2!!!!!!!!!! Fitz 191.5 would you really take a qb who throws for about 135 yards a game and less than 1 td a game? Can we put this to bed now? im gonna need a more detailed analysis.....how many of these games did batch relieve another qb?.......how many boneheaded INT's will i get with my 135.2 yards passing? Will our running game flourish? has fitz ever been .500? Batch has...........bottom of barrell for both.........if we can end this Batch/Fitz talk I will concede defeat like Romney. they are all in the "noone cares about these lackluster qb grouping" very far under "the middle of the pack" Edited December 4, 2012 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 so what has fitz done to make him better than charlie batch? please do explain.........lay off with clueless talk Jack. lets be civil here what intangible skill does fitz have that batch does not? explain without attacking my charecter please. as section122 has shown you, you kinda do fit the clueless talk, Jack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 (edited) Alright here we go: Batch's career completion % - 56.6 Fitz - 59.5% Batch's highest yard passing 2489 Fitz - 3832 Batch most tds in a season 13 Fitz 24 Batch Yds/game 135.2!!!!!!!!!! Fitz 191.5 would you really take a qb who throws for about 135 yards a game and less than 1 td a game? Can we put this to bed now? You are looking at the wrong stats. Completion percentage can be inflated by throwing a lot of short, high percentage passes. Is Fitz's completion percentage inflated due to this? Absolutely! Passing yardage can be inflated by a pass happy coach. Does Gailey fall into the "pass happy coach" category? The correct stat to look at is . . . yards per attempt. Charlie Batch has a career yards per attempt of 6.9. Fitzpatrick has never even averaged 6.9 yards per attempt in a single season, let alone over the course of his career. His best season was 2010, when he averaged 6.8 yards per attempt. This season he's averaging 6.6 yards per attempt. Fitz gets intercepted on 3.8% of his pass attempts. Batch gets intercepted on 3.2% of his attempts. Statistically, Charlie Batch is at least a step above Fitzpatrick. Edited December 4, 2012 by Edwards' Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 as section122 has shown you, you kinda do fit the clueless talk, Jack! great post o man of no words. oh i am clueless now you got me, don't let section speak for you. cat got your tongue? namecalling is frowned upon in this establishment. read the post below yours and recant at once fitzpop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Does anyone here play SongPop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I'm goning to go with, if you have to prove that our starting QB is better than 3rd string Charlie Batch, should he really be are starting QB? To me that is a resounding no. To be honest his stats are not much better. I compare fitz to Derek Anderson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 You are looking at the wrong stats. Completion percentage can be inflated by throwing a lot of short, high percentage passes. Is Fitz's completion percentage inflated due to this? Absolutely! Passing yardage can be inflated by a pass happy coach. Does Gailey fall into the "pass happy coach" category? The correct stat to look at is . . . yards per attempt. Charlie Batch has a career yards per attempt of 6.9. Fitzpatrick has never even averaged 6.9 yards per attempt in a single season, let alone over the course of his career. His best season was 2010, when he averaged 6.8 yards per attempt. This season he's averaging 6.6 yards per attempt. Fitz gets intercepted on 3.8% of his pass attempts. Batch gets intercepted on 3.2% of his attempts. Statistically, Charlie Batch is at least a step above Fitzpatrick. lol..that's silly. TD passes are the "wrong stat" now? Fitz is on pace for 27TD passes this season and the "correct stat" is 6.6yds per attempt? I'm goning to go with, if you have to prove that our starting QB is better than 3rd string Charlie Batch, should he really be are starting QB? To me that is a resounding no. To be honest his stats are not much better. I compare fitz to Derek Anderson. this entire conversation says more about the posters on here than it does anything else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 lol..that's silly. TD passes are the "wrong stat" now? Fitz is on pace for 27TD passes this season and the "correct stat" is 6.6yds per attempt? this entire conversation says more about the posters on here than it does anything else So you thing fitz blows batch away also ? Its really not that far fetched of a comparison same w derek anderson .......You and freak are noted fitz enthusiasts, which is fine everyone's entitled to an opinion. But he seems to be on par with backups, 3rd stringers etc. It is just not a pretty scene, no huge positives to having fitz in lineup IMO. Counts post about proving he's better than batch nails it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 im gonna need a more detailed analysis.....how many of these games did batch relieve another qb?.......how many boneheaded INT's will i get with my 135.2 yards passing? Will our running game flourish? has fitz ever been .500? Batch has...........bottom of barrell for both.........if we can end this Batch/Fitz talk I will concede defeat like Romney. they are all in the "noone cares about these lackluster qb grouping" very far under "the middle of the pack" You're the one making statements that Batch is better - you go do the ground work and prove your statement instead of telling others you'll need more details. People are beyond rational with this Fitz hate but it's to be expected. The mob has their pitchforks and they need to string somebody up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orton's Arm Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 (edited) lol..that's silly. TD passes are the "wrong stat" now? Fitz is on pace for 27TD passes this season and the "correct stat" is 6.6yds per attempt? this entire conversation says more about the posters on here than it does anything else > TD passes are the "wrong stat" now? Yes. For reasons which should be obvious, once you stop and think about it. 1) Some offensive coordinators tend to run the ball inside the 10. Others are more likely to emphasize the pass. 2) If one QB has twice as many pass attempts as another QB, the first QB is likely to have about twice as many TD passes. That doesn't mean that the first one is twice as good as the second--just that the first one was on the field more. Over the course of their respective careers, 3.8% of Batch's pass attempts have resulted in touchdowns, versus 4.2% of Fitz's passes. Yes, there's a difference. But you have to take that difference with a grain of salt, especially because of 1) from the list above. A few years back, the New York Times did a statistical analysis which found that six factors explained 80% of the difference in teams' winning percentages. Those six factors are yards per pass attempt, interception percentage, yards per rushing attempt, and the defensive analogs thereof. The QB controls or greatly influences two of those six factors. Charlie Batch is better than Fitz at both. This means that if Batch was capable of producing exactly the same stats for the Bills that he's produced for other teams, the Bills would be statistically more likely to win games with him under center than with Fitz. Edited December 4, 2012 by Edwards' Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 (edited) You're the one making statements that Batch is better - you go do the ground work and prove your statement instead of telling others you'll need more details. People are beyond rational with this Fitz hate but it's to be expected. The mob has their pitchforks and they need to string somebody up. It's not that deep mdh I don't need blood samples from fitz and batch.....I didn't realize the lifetime batch/fitz stats were possibly coming out..And definetly don't wish to discuss them ...they are both subpar qb's not worth discussing batch moreso due to age..........just simply saying from a w-l perspective batch or fitz last 2 years....results prob not that much different. Some are acting like fitz has actually been doing something positive lately. I'm gonna retire from this thread. And hopefully this subject soon. Apologies to any fitz lovers I rubbed the wrong way .........my take on him is he is terrible. We can agree to disagree for now Edited December 4, 2012 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I have his value rated right in the middle of a bag of footballs and a box of water bottles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 People are beyond rational with this Fitz hate but it's to be expected. The mob has their pitchforks and they need to string somebody up. And who better to string up than an average QB who is leading us nowhere... And I would like to add that I'm happy to see so many Fitz backers take great solace in the fact that Fitz is a better QB than Charlie Batch...Which he is by the way...Talk about shooting for the stars!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Well, you got that one wrong. What teams would be interested in Fitz as a starter? Asked another way what team would you not take the starter from? jests, AZ are sure things. Jacksonville? That's all I got so I'd rank him 27ish figuring Quinn and Palmer are pushes. This is EXACTLY correct...I was thinking about this earlier... Granted you have the Gabbert/Henne situation in J-Ville...Cassel/Quinn in KC...Sanchise/Tebow in NY...Kolb/Skelton in AZ...Then what? I think Palmer would be better in this Bills Offense than Fitz is, even though I'm not the biggest Carson Palmer Fan in the world...We'll call that one a push...The rest of the Teams either have established Vets that are better than Fitz, young Franchise QB's that are already better than Fitz, or young guys with bigger upside and bigger arms than Fitz...So basically Fitz could probably start for 4, maybe 5 other NFL Teams...That's it...And that is exactly how to determine his actual worth...Sure he's worth more to The Bills now...Seeing as though they paid him and he knows the Offense...But when you can say with a bit of confidence that he could not go to say Tennessee and win a Starting job...You know what the guys true value is...And it's NOT high...At all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutmost Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 we can go round and round with this discussion....ppl can name teams with starters that nobody would want....Those same teams woul not even consider fitz because all those kids have UPSIDE that those teams think they can coach out of them with time and experience....comparing fitz to these young kids is ridiculous...they may play terribly but they have every single skill set that is needed athletically to succeed in this league..matter of fact as ****ty as kolb.ponder.locker.weeden.gabbert.tannehill.newton.bradford.sanchez...they have ALL came from behind and made plays to WIN THE GAME...the nfl parity is ridiculous...and teams that have ball last WIN....FITZ DOES NOT POSSESS THAT INTANGIBLE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshawn's 20 bucks Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Average to below average. Definitely worse (regardless of stage of career): Sanchez/Tebow, Gabbert, Locker, Weeden, Palmer, Quinn/Cassel, Foles, Skelton/Lindley/unhealthy Kolb Probably comparable (depending on the day, most of these guys are pretty inconsistent...just like Fitz): Hasselbeck, Henne, Tannehill, Dalton, Vick (2012 version), Ponder, Newton, Bradford, Wilson, healthy Kolb Great analysis. Spot on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalftimeAdjustment Posted December 5, 2012 Share Posted December 5, 2012 I rank Fitzpatrick just below J.P.Losman but one Step ahead of Trent Edwards. Probably about equal to Kelly Holcomb Losman is available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts