Rico Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 but a ton of posters here don't face reprecussions from one of the major subjects of their livelihoods. just some guff from the dwindling number of apologists. Once Ralph does pass away, those apologists will rise again & proclaim long & loud what a great owner he was. That is why it is important to see articles like this published... to keep it in your mind & never forget just how horrible he has been. His pathetic legacy needs to be cemented now and forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted November 28, 2012 Author Share Posted November 28, 2012 If you take away the Patriots' last decade, their existence is an abomination. I didn't say that 17 years out of 52 is something to celebrate, I said it is not "staggering futility." yes, but, thankfully for patriot fans, billy sullivan didn't own the team in the last decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 If Ralph is our Crown Jewel, he certainly is the kind of ornament that reflects this franchise. Ralph didn't build anything. You did. You pay a lot of money for anything that has to do with the Bills. The Bills are part Ralph's hobby and mostly his ATM. He has done nothing with altruistic intent. This statement is so egregiously incorrect that I don't know where to begin. The owner builds the business, the consumers (that's you, and me, and all the other fans) support it, or choose not to. Gigantic difference. Ralph should pull an R.S. Hadden and release the following quote: "I am selling a 49% ownership in the Bills to (?), as a last gift to the people of WNY who have given...from who I have TAKEN so much" So Ralph Wilson broke into your house and stole your money & time? I think not. Fandom is a choice. Buying tickets is a choice. Investing time in watching the team is a choice. He's taken nothing from you; he's accepted what you've given him. Way too many people fail to recognize the difference. I will eventually read all the posts when I get home But pardon my french f this **** My grandpa had a farm. He had started it when he was young. Retiring in the 70's only making $4.88/hr he still managed to buy over 100 acres and farm it successfully. When he got in to his 90's he told us he just wants the farm to stay as it is. No more working on whatever he built until he is gone. Then he"didn't give a damn." He passed away at 93 after battling dementia and cancer. Only when he could no longer make decisions in the last 6 months did we have a proxy In place to deal with his finances. It costs us tens of thousand if notable hundred and a lot of work and hard times. But it was his farm. By all accounts Ralph is mentally fit for 94. And if you think just because he is 94 he cannot make decisions yourewrong. Its his team. He can do what he wants I will post more then just that there later. But yes. Ask Kevin. A fully vested player who can now get NFLPA assistance because Wilson paid him for 4 years Bravo. Ralph doesn't know what planet he is on at this point. Expect nothing different. Although you may not believe this, you're wrong about the bolded. Wilson is well aware of what's going on with the team. His deficiency is the same as it's always been: poor allocation of resources, as well as poor decision-making when it comes to who's in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimp Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 bandit - I agree with everything you say. I also agree with all the people that are saying what a terrrible owner he is and how out of touch he is. As fans we are entitled to as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Ralph Wilson is one of the Crown Jewels of WNY.....we are lucky to have had him..... what has bucky ever built ?....NOTHING !!!..... it's so easy to tear someone or something down.....a little harder to build something. Bottomline, it's his team. Easy thing for him to do in the 1st place would have been to leave for someone where else and make a lot more money than he can make in Buffalo. I laugh at the people who think Ralph is jsut trying to get rich off the Bills. He always spends a ton on contracts. IMO, he wants to win but just makes the wrong moves. And if I was the owner of the team, I'd do whatever the hell I wanted too. If you don't like it, don't come and I'll move the team. Ralph has done a lot for this area and our ticket prices are a joke compared to the rest of the league. No one wants to win more than RW. Once Ralph does pass away, those apologists will rise again & proclaim long & loud what a great owner he was. That is why it is important to see articles like this published... to keep it in your mind & never forget just how horrible he has been. His pathetic legacy needs to be cemented now and forever. His pathetic legacy that landed him in the Hall of Fame of his profession. How many posters can say the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 bandit - I agree with everything you say. I also agree with all the people that are saying what a terrrible owner he is and how out of touch he is. As fans we are entitled to as much. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, for certain. The only items I'll ever argue with regard to Wilson are the facts. He hasn't done an adequate job overall with the product on the field, which is by far his biggest flaw as an owner. The filth that people spew beyond that ("he's stolen money", "he's senile and totally unaware", "he's apathetic toward the team's performance") is both clueless and abhorrent, and is what drives me to take exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wagon Circler Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Good well written article that needed to be said. I thought it was a joke when he got elecyed to the hall. Ralph has mostly crapped on the fans, especially in the last 13 years. Also by driving Polian and A>J. Smith out of town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) I would disagree with Bucky on one point: he said that making the playoffs 17 out of 52 times is "a staggering record for futility." That's just about exactly 1/3 of the time. For a good amount of those 52 years, 4 teams in the AFC made it out of 14, which is, of course, less than 1/3 of the teams. Now 6 out of 16 make it, or just more than 1/3. I would say making the playoffs 1/3 of the time is pretty close to average, if not ever-so-slightly below. I'm sure if you look at other teams, there are plenty that have made the playoffs less than 1/3 of the years in their existence including many teams that are good now- Falcons, Saints, etc. That's just a matter of poor journalism and/or a lack of perspective. A far better measure is the period since the merger (1970) - when the Bills inarguably became a major league team. The Bills have made the playoffs 13 times in 43 years including this year (30 percent of the time). What skews this stat is the fact that the teams built by Polian and Butler (both ignominiously fired by Wilson) made the playoffs 10 times in 12 years between 1988 and 1999. Take away that window, and the Bills have made it 3 times in the other 31 years, with only one division title. Edited November 28, 2012 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bananathumb Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 I hope Wilson and his henchmen never get another WNY or Ontario dollar. Fck them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPS Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 (edited) I don't think the Buffalo Bills are a traditional business. Their revenues are in no large way tied to their product. They receive 1/32 of a huge TV deal, huge merchandizing and licensing dollars even if he puts teletubbies on the field. The thirst for the NFL product has absolutely exploded since Wilson bought his franchise and he's just been riding the wave for at least 30 years. If the Bills are worth 800 million, I think it is due to the rising tide of NFL popularity having very little with what RW did to achieve that value. He's one lucky SOB, not a brilliant owner. Edited November 28, 2012 by JPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsDiehard Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Does anyone have a better link? The article can;t be found. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 I know peole will disagree, but I am not impressed with this article. I believe Wilson is not a good football mind, and he has not put this team in a position to be successful for a long time. I also believe that bashing him is too easy. Most people agree that the talent level on this team is good enough to be competitive, possibly even better than average. Most people also believe that the QB, LBs and WRs are perhaps the biggest needs. Most people also believe that the coaching is a huge problem, and this is where I put most of the blame. How is Wilson to know that Gailey and Wannstedt would be so awful at doing their jobs? They both had reasonable resumes (not great, but not terrible), and they said all the right things when they were hired. I know that the big name coaches won't come to Buffalo, and that is largely Wilson's fault. He won't pay top dollar for a coach, the facilities are old and old fashioned, and the status of the team going forward is a big question based on Wilson's health and succession unknowns. But that does not give Gailey and Wannstedt any excuses for having terrible game plans, not adjusting during the games, and not using their best players in a way that puts the team in a position to win. Is Wilson saying not to use CJ very much? Is Wilson saying don't blitz? Is Wilson saying not to kick a FG from farther than 40 yards? Is Wilson saying that Fitz is a great passer? Is Wilson saying long passes on thrid and short, or short passes on third and long are the things to do? I don't think so. To me, it is Gailey and Wannstedt who should be called out for the mess that this team is in, not Wilson. Flame ON! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 but a ton of posters here don't face reprecussions from one of the major subjects of their livelihoods. just some guff from the dwindling number of apologists. What repercussions? Does the weatherman feel repercussions from calling the rain wet? Is Brave Bucky risking being barred form the press booth buffet? Or access from the locker room and its treasure trove of post-game cliched quotes? This statement is so egregiously incorrect that I don't know where to begin. The owner builds the business, the consumers (that's you, and me, and all the other fans) support it, or choose not to. Gigantic difference. He wisely purchased a monopoly--in a business that the public would grow insatiable for. Despite his ineptitude/benign neglect/whateveryouwanncallit, "his" business has grown solely as a result of the shared revenue model his league adapted which is fueled by the popularity of the league over the past 2 decades and which he has done nothing to add to. This model guarantees his ability to cover nearly all of his costs without selling many tickets to actual games. He won't lose a penny this year, despite all of the empty seats in "his" stadium in upcoming games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 Does anyone have a better link? The article can;t be found. Thanks! worked fine this morning. seems the link on the main tbd page doesn't work now either. strange. you can go directly to the buffalo news sports site and that works last i checked. What repercussions? Does the weatherman feel repercussions from calling the rain wet? Is Brave Bucky risking being barred form the press booth buffet? Or access from the locker room and its treasure trove of post-game cliched quotes?. maybe locked out of team events. possibly just a hostile environment or passive aggression in bills facilities i expect his job is somewhat dependent on access not available to the likes of us. have you never been the recipient or possibly the giver of the cold shoulder in a work environment? i've seen people change jobs over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 I know that the big name coaches won't come to Buffalo, and that is largely Wilson's fault. He won't pay top dollar for a coach, the facilities are old and old fashioned, and the status of the team going forward is a big question based on Wilson's health and succession unknowns. But that does not give Gailey and Wannstedt any excuses for having terrible game plans, not adjusting during the games, and not using their best players in a way that puts the team in a position to win. Flame ON! ok. it's wilson's fault that the best coaches he can even interview are 2nd tier or below. how many second tier coaches can you name that have a superbowl ring? whose fault is it that he clearly has a bad reputation for his treatment of coaches and gm's? whose fault is it that no succession plan has been clearly stated (at least one that would help attract top talent)? the only folks that were happy when nix and gailey were named were the few delusional, buffalo fans. did you hear any national sports media figures gushing? was it only wilson that didn't realize (and possibly still doesn't) that they are second rate? and really, i think one either needs to point to at least benign neglect and more likely purposefully trying to be this consistently bad for this long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 ok. it's wilson's fault that the best coaches he can even interview are 2nd tier or below. how many second tier coaches can you name that have a superbowl ring? whose fault is it that he clearly has a bad reputation for his treatment of coaches and gm's? whose fault is it that no succession plan has been clearly stated (at least one that would help attract top talent)? the only folks that were happy when nix and gailey were named were the few delusional, buffalo fans. did you hear any national sports media figures gushing? was it only wilson that didn't realize (and possibly still doesn't) that they are second rate? and really, i think one either needs to point to at least benign neglect and more likely purposefully trying to be this consistently bad for this long. ok. it's wilson's fault that the best coaches he can even interview are 2nd tier or below. how many second tier coaches can you name that have a superbowl ring? whose fault is it that he clearly has a bad reputation for his treatment of coaches and gm's? whose fault is it that no succession plan has been clearly stated (at least one that would help attract top talent)? the only folks that were happy when nix and gailey were named were the few delusional, buffalo fans. did you hear any national sports media figures gushing? was it only wilson that didn't realize (and possibly still doesn't) that they are second rate? and really, i think one either needs to point to at least benign neglect and more likely purposefully trying to be this consistently bad for this long. I agree with what you are saying. My point is that these coaches are so ridiculously awful that it is beyond my ability to comprehend how they got to this level of coaching in the first place. People say that a 13 year old playing Madden could call a better game than these coaches. I'm not going to go that far, but I honestly don't understand how these coaches can be as bad as they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 ...Take away that window, and the Bills have made it 3 times in the other 31 years, with only one division title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Good well written article that needed to be said. I thought it was a joke when he got elecyed to the hall. Ralph has mostly crapped on the fans, especially in the last 13 years. Also by driving Polian and A>J. Smith out of town. If you would just allow a man to call your daughter what Polian supposedly said about Ralph's daughter and not do something about it, I have zero respect for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 He wisely purchased a monopoly--in a business that the public would grow insatiable for. Despite his ineptitude/benign neglect/whateveryouwanncallit, "his" business has grown solely as a result of the shared revenue model his league adapted which is fueled by the popularity of the league over the past 2 decades and which he has done nothing to add to. This model guarantees his ability to cover nearly all of his costs without selling many tickets to actual games. He won't lose a penny this year, despite all of the empty seats in "his" stadium in upcoming games. In what way does this contradict what I said? Just because the business-building model is non-traditional doesn't mean that the owner isn't fully responsible for it. Also, to say that he's done nothing to add to the popularity of the league is patently false. He's the first NFL owner to play regular home games outside of the United States. Regardless of the popularity of his team in that market, there's no question that the NFL is benefitting from that exposure. And you might notice that I was one of the first people in this thread to point out that attendence has zero to do with the team's profitability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 What repercussions? Does the weatherman feel repercussions from calling the rain wet? Is Brave Bucky risking being barred form the press booth buffet? Or access from the locker room and its treasure trove of post-game cliched quotes? He wisely purchased a monopoly--in a business that the public would grow insatiable for. Despite his ineptitude/benign neglect/whateveryouwanncallit, "his" business has grown solely as a result of the shared revenue model his league adapted which is fueled by the popularity of the league over the past 2 decades and which he has done nothing to add to. This model guarantees his ability to cover nearly all of his costs without selling many tickets to actual games. He won't lose a penny this year, despite all of the empty seats in "his" stadium in upcoming games. Didn't Ralph have to lend money to teams so the AFL won't fold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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