DC Tom Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 So if it is good, the previous Adminstration is welcome to enter the conversation and the current President gets zero credit for extending such policies..... If it is bad, no one can mention the previous Adminstration and the current President sucks at everything...... That's pretty much the discourse for every administration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 No one ever said Obama didn't inherit a bad economy retard. So did Bush. And Reagan. Difference is those guys addressed problems instead of exacerbating them. I'd be interested to know exactly what would have been different had McCain elected. Frankly, I liked McCain, even though Sarah Palin basically turned any moderate off. I sometimes wonder what exactly McCain would have done to be different than the current admin... 1. Stimulus- maybe 2. Healthcare- that would never have gotten done, and I understand why that could be considered a good/ bad thing- 3. Spending Cuts- Would he have reformed tradtional programs like Medicare and SS in a time when Americans were depnedent on them most? Would he have cut defense outlays in the middle of two wars? Let's be honest, wihtout changes to the Big 3, all cuts are nice but unsunstantial 4. Cut Taxes? Probably, but he would have to borrow unless he had the ability to do anyting about #3... so more debt would habe been piled on in either case. 5. Expand Credit/ Lower Interest Rates? That shipped sailed for just under a decade, the cheap money option was exhausted. The tone is often Obama has done nothing and is a complete and utter failure... While I think some of his policies were weak and I liked the PPACA reform bill (not that it had to be 2K pages) would it be that much better with another President? That's pretty much the discourse for every administration. Wisdom, you have sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 But, I do seem to remember a bunch of you leftists blaming Bush for the high prices of 08 and without even knowing you then , I'm pretty damn sure that you were one of those strawmen proponents back then that attempted to link the oil prices of 08 to his oil buddies in Texas No, the link was to his buddies at Goldman Sachs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) So if it is good, the previous Adminstration is welcome to enter the conversation and the current President gets zero credit for extending such policies..... If it is bad, no one can mention the previous Adminstration and the current President sucks at everything...... Certainly it must be one extreme or the other Edited January 25, 2012 by Rob's House Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 So if it is good, the previous Adminstration is welcome to enter the conversation and the current President gets zero credit for extending such policies..... If it is bad, no one can mention the previous Adminstration and the current President sucks at everything...... I heard this am on the Neal Boortz radio show that oil production on Federal land is down 40% from what it was in 2009. The increase in oil production is all on privately owned land. I've tried to get the latest oil figures (production, consumption) but the best I could find is actual figures up to 2009 and an estimate for 2010. So what has Obama done to make us more oil independent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 No, the link was to his buddies at Goldman Sachs. Both. But there were the cries of foul that somehow, Bush was funneling these high priced barrels in which they inferred he was responsible for, were for the benefit of his oil buddies in Texas, and it wasn't just a few morons, there were many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juror#8 Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I can tell you this, when it comes to oil, there isn't a politician in the U.S that knows about oil as much as I do. Talk to Mike Smith and then make that claim. He used to be around the Hill a lot doing advisory visits. Not so much anymore. Had the privilege to speak with him a few years back. He is an energy encyclopedia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I heard this am on the Neal Boortz radio show that oil production on Federal land is down 40% from what it was in 2009. The increase in oil production is all on privately owned land. I've tried to get the latest oil figures (production, consumption) but the best I could find is actual figures up to 2009 and an estimate for 2010. So what has Obama done to make us more oil independent? While I think "Energy Independent" sounds so good coming off a Beauracrat's lips, the reality of energy policy in this country should be one of diversified sources, as well as consideration that we will always be dependent of foriegn oil sources due to our consumption. This is a global economy, we have to be a top user of energy in the world so to think we are going to independent aka self reliant, isolated from having to deal with other nations is a pipe dream. Of the top of my head, after the moratorium of deep seal drilling on the Gulf, Obama lifted the ban and drilling resumed and permits to explore and drill.... I seem to remember compaines like Chevron and BP reporting new discoveries and were optimistic about drilling 100 miles off shore in 5K feet of water would be approved, considering the risks. I will be the first to call BS when Obama talks Oil Independence.... we don't have enough efforts into energy production, ie Nuclear Power to keep up with Americans needs (espcailly now that we are incentizing electric vehicles.... it buring coal more efficient and cleaner that Nuclear? and as for wind farms and solar panels, it is not sunny nor wnidy every day) , especially given our sensativity to environmental policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I'd be interested to know exactly what would have been different had McCain elected. Frankly, I liked McCain, even though Sarah Palin basically turned any moderate off. I sometimes wonder what exactly McCain would have done to be different than the current admin... 1. Stimulus- maybe 2. Healthcare- that would never have gotten done, and I understand why that could be considered a good/ bad thing- 3. Spending Cuts- Would he have reformed tradtional programs like Medicare and SS in a time when Americans were depnedent on them most? Would he have cut defense outlays in the middle of two wars? Let's be honest, wihtout changes to the Big 3, all cuts are nice but unsunstantial 4. Cut Taxes? Probably, but he would have to borrow unless he had the ability to do anyting about #3... so more debt would habe been piled on in either case. 5. Expand Credit/ Lower Interest Rates? That shipped sailed for just under a decade, the cheap money option was exhausted. The tone is often Obama has done nothing and is a complete and utter failure... While I think some of his policies were weak and I liked the PPACA reform bill (not that it had to be 2K pages) would it be that much better with another President? Wisdom, you have sir. McCain would have watched The Deer Hunter again and then would have tried to launch an offensive into West Pennsylvania. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Of the top of my head, after the moratorium of deep seal drilling on the Gulf, Obama lifted the ban and drilling resumed and permits to explore and drill.... I seem to remember compaines like Chevron and BP reporting new discoveries and were optimistic about drilling 100 miles off shore in 5K feet of water would be approved, considering the risks. No, it wasn't as simple as that, not only was their lost production during that time period, but there is a residual loss that continues. You see, many of those rigs aren't owned by the oil companies, they lease them, and when they were sitting idle, some of the rig owners moved shop and other oil companies leased them in different deep sea locations. Rig leasing is in extremely high demand, companies pay top dollar for them, specially deep sea rigs, so when the moratoria hit, some of them dipped. Edited January 25, 2012 by Magox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_In_Norfolk Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 No, it wasn't as simple as that, not only was their lost production during that time period, but there is a residual loss that continues. You see, many of those rigs aren't owned by the oil companies, they lease them, and when they were sitting idle, some of the rig owners moved shop and other oil companies leased them in different deep sea locations. Rig leasing is in extremely high demand, companies pay top dollar for them, specially deep sea rigs, so when the moratoria hit, some of them dipped. National Oilwell Varco! NOV, one of my top investments, doing real good! I'd be interested to know exactly what would have been different had McCain elected. Frankly, I liked McCain, even though Sarah Palin basically turned any moderate off. I sometimes wonder what exactly McCain would have done to be different than the current admin... 1. Stimulus- maybe 2. Healthcare- that would never have gotten done, and I understand why that could be considered a good/ bad thing- 3. Spending Cuts- Would he have reformed tradtional programs like Medicare and SS in a time when Americans were depnedent on them most? Would he have cut defense outlays in the middle of two wars? Let's be honest, wihtout changes to the Big 3, all cuts are nice but unsunstantial 4. Cut Taxes? Probably, but he would have to borrow unless he had the ability to do anyting about #3... so more debt would habe been piled on in either case. 5. Expand Credit/ Lower Interest Rates? That shipped sailed for just under a decade, the cheap money option was exhausted. The tone is often Obama has done nothing and is a complete and utter failure... While I think some of his policies were weak and I liked the PPACA reform bill (not that it had to be 2K pages) would it be that much better with another President? Wisdom, you have sir. anyone?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) While I think "Energy Independent" sounds so good coming off a Beauracrat's lips, the reality of energy policy in this country should be one of diversified sources, as well as consideration that we will always be dependent of foriegn oil sources due to our consumption. This is a global economy, we have to be a top user of energy in the world so to think we are going to independent aka self reliant, isolated from having to deal with other nations is a pipe dream. Of the top of my head, after the moratorium of deep seal drilling on the Gulf, Obama lifted the ban and drilling resumed and permits to explore and drill.... I seem to remember compaines like Chevron and BP reporting new discoveries and were optimistic about drilling 100 miles off shore in 5K feet of water would be approved, considering the risks. I will be the first to call BS when Obama talks Oil Independence.... we don't have enough efforts into energy production, ie Nuclear Power to keep up with Americans needs (espcailly now that we are incentizing electric vehicles.... it buring coal more efficient and cleaner that Nuclear? and as for wind farms and solar panels, it is not sunny nor wnidy every day) , especially given our sensativity to environmental policy. Not if we let them drill MMS estimates that the OCS areas of the Beaufort Sea, Chukchi Sea, and the North Aleutian Basin have undiscovered technically recoverable resources (UTRR) ranging from 2.8 to 65.8 billion barrels of oil (BBO) and 11.4 to 305 trillion cubic feet (TCF) of natural gas, depending on the likelihood of occurrence. MMS also estimates that the three OCS areas have undiscovered economically recoverable resources (UERR) ranging from 1 to 46 billion barrels of oil and 3.8 to 175.1 TCF of gas. Economically recoverable resources represent the portion of the undiscovered technically recoverable resources that can be explored, developed and commercially produced at given costs and price considerations. MMS assumed market prices of $60 per barrel of oil and $9.07 per thousand cubic feet of gas (in 2006$) for the UERR estimates of the three Alaska OCS areas. Edited January 25, 2012 by Jim in Anchorage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 National Oilwell Varco! NOV, one of my top investments, doing real good! anyone?????? I hope someone reponds to that.... it would be interesting entertaining the thought of what would McCain would have done, albeit a Democratic Majority in Congress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hope someone reponds to that.... it would be interesting entertaining the thought of what would McCain would have done, albeit a Democratic Majority in Congress. McCain would have done whatever he thought would make him popular with the press just short of getting ousted by his own party in the primary. If I have time I'll address what a decent President would have done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 all of this may be true but it's also true that right wing sky is falling rhetoric over obama's energy policies was proved wrong. and conservation programs certainly had some effect. exactly how much will be argued over by those much more knowledgable than any of us. You obviously don't hang out on the PPP very often! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hope someone reponds to that.... it would be interesting entertaining the thought of what would McCain would have done, albeit a Democratic Majority in Congress. Do NOT encourage anyone to respond to Dave. He is rapidly dragging this place down and people are fighting over the bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Do NOT encourage anyone to respond to Dave. He is rapidly dragging this place down and people are fighting over the bait. Who would be the super liberal punching bag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Who would be the super liberal punching bag? Fatty, lyrbob, Pasta Joe, tube guy with Booster and Buftex filling in. BTW, did pBrain get banned, or is he still smarting from all the ass whippings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hope someone reponds to that.... it would be interesting entertaining the thought of what would McCain would have done, albeit a Democratic Majority in Congress. It's impossible to determine what McCain would have done, because if you're willing to speculate based on something that didn't happen, then you have to consider other things that didn't happen. If McCain wins, did the House and Senate still go to the Dems? Did one go Dems and one go GOP? Which one went where? At what margin? Too many intangibles for anyone with a lick of sense to really answer honestly. On the other hand, when the country is run by a man who insists his stimulus plan worked based on what may or may not have happened, I can understand why you'd ask the question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Fatty, lyrbob, Pasta Joe, tube guy with Booster and Buftex filling in. BTW, did pBrain get banned, or is he still smarting from all the ass whippings? I think you just upset Joe-the-6pack by omission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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