San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 It's not a mistake when Fitz under throws or flares a deep pass. He just shouldn't be attempting most deep balls because he obviously doesn't have the arm for it. He's shown this time and again. If he plays within his abilities, and the coaches encourage this with their play calling, Fitz is fine and we're probably fine as well (on the offensive side of the ball). Not sure what you're saying, Allan. The ball was on the 27 yard line so this wasn't a deep pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 It's not a mistake when Fitz under throws or flares a deep pass. He just shouldn't be attempting most deep balls because he obviously doesn't have the arm for it. He's shown this time and again. If he plays within his abilities, and the coaches encourage this with their play calling, Fitz is fine and we're probably fine as well (on the offensive side of the ball). Where are you getting this from? These were not deep balls for god's sake. They were 25 yd passes that he should have put more air under or thrown sooner. Simple as that. It has nothing to do with arm strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nostradamus Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Well covered what game were you watching? Stevie had two steps on the guy it was a horrible throw!!!!!! On a slightly different note, Johnson does seem to have great footwork. After 6 weeks, if I'm looking to extend either Fitzy or Johnson, it's Johnson and it's not even close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max997 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Aside from FJax 80 yard run, he had 15 carries for 41 yards. That's 2.7 ypc. How can people so confidently say that we could have easily ran the ball and run out the clock? And how much clock do you expect to burn being just outside the red zone? Especially since the Giants still had 2 time outs remaining. You run the ball in a tie game when u are in FG range with under 5 mins left to at worst run some clock Gailey just doesn't like to run the ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Questionable call, and a bad throw. I'm not ready to fire Chan or bench Fitzpatrick over it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Or just throw a relatively easy pass down the sideline ahead of your WR... It's easy to go all "what if" but the bottom line is, Gailey was going for the win. I can live w/ that and especially knowing that the play wasn't a bad read by Fitzy, it was just a poorly thrown ball. We'll get that one next time. I understand going for the win when you have the ball outside of field goal range and your down by a couple and there is like .30 secs to go. But right there you run clock kick the FG and give the Giants as little time to work with as possible. It really is that easy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eme123 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I haven't read any other posts today... just letting out some frustration. RUN THE BALL WHEN YOU ARE IN SCORING POSITION WITH 4 MINUTES LEFT. : I will take a coach who will try to score TD's and score as many points as possible every time. We had one on one coverage against Stevie on a route where he had already beaten his man earlier in the game. It was a great play call. Sure enough Stevie beat his man again. Fitz just under threw it. We could have ran the ball 3 times and kicked a field goal. In my opinion with our secondary that's giving the Giants a perfect opportunity to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just in Atlanta Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 And if we made the throw, he'd be a genius. We can't run and screen all the time. We took a shot. It didn't work. We lost a close game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRW Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I understand going for the win when you have the ball outside of field goal range and your down by a couple and there is like .30 secs to go. But right there you run clock kick the FG and give the Giants as little time to work with as possible. It really is that easy! That is complete, 100%, Dick Jauron football. If you don't see the problems with it I'm not sure what to tell you. No, with 4 minutes left you don't run clock and settle for a 45 yard field goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 That is complete, 100%, Dick Jauron football. If you don't see the problems with it I'm not sure what to tell you. No, with 4 minutes left you don't run clock and settle for a 45 yard field goal. You mean field goal attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I understand going for the win when you have the ball outside of field goal range and your down by a couple and there is like .30 secs to go. But right there you run clock kick the FG and give the Giants as little time to work with as possible. It really is that easy! And what would be the argument when the Giants have 1min 45sec and 2 timeouts left and win the game? I understand this is all revisionist BS at this point, but kicking a 40+ yd FG isn't easy either. We'd all be crying about the fact that "Chan didn't get aggressive enough and he should have known our defense couldn't stop them if they got the ball back" if they ended up scoring a TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 And if we made the throw, he'd be a genius. We can't run and screen all the time. We took a shot. It didn't work. We lost a close game. Nope! As soon as Fitz didn't hand it off to Fred I screamed WTF! Then he threw it and then I really went WTF! So no I didn't think that. Had he run time, kicked a FG, and escaped NY with a W, would have impressed me more than "gambling and losing". It would have shown me he can make the right calls at crunch time on the road in a tie game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 That is complete, 100%, Dick Jauron football. If you don't see the problems with it I'm not sure what to tell you. No, with 4 minutes left you don't run clock and settle for a 45 yard field goal. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qdawg in philly Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 You run the ball in a tie game when u are in FG range with under 5 mins left to at worst run some clock Gailey just doesn't like to run the ball EXACTLY!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 And as I'm saying, I had to watch 4 years of Jauron Ball and if we'd have gone conservative and lost as a result, Gailey would have been roasted. I prefer (at least right now) to see my team go down firing all bullets. I think the conservative approach is defeatist and after Jauron, I've had enough of watching the Bills play that way. Dude...The Jauron days are WAY long gone...Who gives a crap about what Dead Dick did?...He was a brutal Coach...it's over (thank God)...And The Bills are trying to become a Playoff Team...It's different now...There was no reason to go down firing with all bullets...There was no reason to lose this game at all really... Gailey is clearly a good HC...I'm not frying the guy overall...I really like Gailey...But a HC is going to be judged by decisions like this and Game Management...And look...I'm not calling for 3 runs up the middle or anything like that whatsoever...If Gailey wants to throw 3 times there fine...But play to Fitz's strengths...That's all I'm saying...And that throw is CLEARLY not Fitz's strength...Everybody knows it...And for me that's why that Call, at that time, was way too much risk...Gailey just showed too much confidence in Fitz's arm and it cost The Bills the Game...Believe me he's not going to do it again no matter what he says...There's no reason to do it again...The Bills have already proven beyond a shadow of a doubt they can move the Ball in other, FAR safer ways... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRW Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 You mean field goal attempt. Thanks, that is actually a very important correction that I think everyone arguing against the call should take into consideration. So many arguments seem to treat the scenario like it was first and goal inside the 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qdawg in philly Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Nope! As soon as Fitz didn't hand it off to Fred I screamed WTF! Then he threw it and then I really went WTF! So no I didn't think that. Had he run time, kicked a FG, and escaped NY with a W, would have impressed me more than "gambling and losing". It would have shown me he can make the right calls at crunch time on the road in a tie game. LMAO!! I said the same thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 (edited) You run the ball in a tie game when u are in FG range with under 5 mins left to at worst run some clock Gailey just doesn't like to run the ball 30 pass attempts, 23 rushes. Pretty balanced. And last week, 35 rushes 27 passes. Gailey likes to run the ball just fine. Edited October 16, 2011 by stony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBD Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I haven't read any other posts today... just letting out some frustration. RUN THE BALL WHEN YOU ARE IN SCORING POSITION WITH 4 MINUTES LEFT. Why is that Gailey's fault? Don't teams typically break the huddle with a run/pass option? Fitz read the defense and called the play, he even could have audibled to a run if he felt the pass wouldn't work. The same ballsy stuff that fans say they love when it works can come back and bite you at some point. Maybe that's one of them. Also, Fitz threw a bad pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Like with Simon, KOKBILLS, we'll agree to disagree. I've stated my position on the call in three different threads with about a dozen or so responses. Maybe it's time to start a poll… but (I think) I've said all I'm gonna say about the call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SelmonSmith6378 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 He had a lot of trust in Fitzpatrick, perhaps too much. I still don;t think he;s an awful coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Why is that Gailey's fault? Don't teams typically break the huddle with a run/pass option? Fitz read the defense and called the play, he even could have audibled to a run if he felt the pass wouldn't work. The same ballsy stuff that fans say they love when it works can come back and bite you at some point. Maybe that's one of them. Also, Fitz threw a bad pass. Agreed. Live by the sword, die by it. Fitz could just as easily lost the KC and Raiders games by making similar "throw it into coverage and see if the receiver can make a play" throws, but then the second guessing rarely makes an appearence after wins... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I respect his play calling skills and pedal-down approach but not at the expense of smart game coaching. We messed up twice today forcing passes when we didn't need to. Cost us the game. Exactly...100% agree... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Agreed. Live by the sword, die by it. Fitz could just as easily lost the KC and Raiders games by making similar "throw it into coverage and see if the receiver can make a play" throws, but then the second guessing rarely makes an appearence after wins... Yes. A successful play is almost never second guessed. An unsuccessful play is often second guessed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Dude...The Jauron days are WAY long gone...Who gives a crap about what Dead Dick did?...He was a brutal Coach...it's over (thank God)...And The Bills are trying to become a Playoff Team...It's different now...There was no reason to go down firing with all bullets...There was no reason to lose this game at all really... Gailey is clearly a good HC...I'm not frying the guy overall...I really like Gailey...But a HC is going to be judged by decisions like this and Game Management...And look...I'm not calling for 3 runs up the middle or anything like that whatsoever...If Gailey wants to throw 3 times there fine...But play to Fitz's strengths...That's all I'm saying...And that throw is CLEARLY not Fitz's strength...Everybody knows it...And for me that's why that Call, at that time, was way too much risk...Gailey just showed too much confidence in Fitz's arm and it cost The Bills the Game...Believe me he's not going to do it again no matter what he says...There's no reason to do it again...The Bills have already proven beyond a shadow of a doubt they can move the Ball in other, FAR safer ways... I fall on this side of the argument. The call was risky simply because of Fitz's high likelihood of making such mistakes. If Gailey had, say a Matt Ryan or BenR, he will make that call everytime (I exaggerate ofcourse). But, he trusted Fitz at the wrong time and Fitz came up short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SelmonSmith6378 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Agreed. Live by the sword, die by it. Fitz could just as easily lost the KC and Raiders games by making similar "throw it into coverage and see if the receiver can make a play" throws, but then the second guessing rarely makes an appearence after wins... I agree too. Gailey took a gamble, and sometimes is works, sometimes it doesn;t If Fitz had thrown a completion, that would lead to a touchdown, we would be celebrating Gailey, not cursing him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Listen to your QB: http://www.buffalobills.com/media-center/videos/Ryan-Fitzpatrick-Postgame-Press-Conference/e3c14e4d-d455-45f9-838a-2c298b454571 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 I agree too. Gailey took a gamble, and sometimes is works, sometimes it doesn;t If Fitz had thrown a completion, that would lead to a touchdown, we would be celebrating Gailey, not cursing him. No we wouldn't have. Had that been completed for a TD the Giants still would have had 4 minutes, 2 time outs and the 2 minute warning to score a TD and tie the game. I dunno, what's the smarter move? Run clock and kick a FG or score a TD with 4 minutes left. I'm thinking most coaches are running the clock and kicking the FG, and escaping NY with a W on a day when the team didn't play really well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SelmonSmith6378 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 No we wouldn't have. Had that been completed for a TD the Giants still would have had 4 minutes, 2 time outs and the 2 minute warning to score a TD and tie the game. I dunno, what's the smarter move? Run clock and kick a FG or score a TD with 4 minutes left. I'm thinking most coaches are running the clock and kicking the FG, and escaping NY with a W on a day when the team didn't play really well. So your completely dismissing the notion that had we passed,we might have had a great chance to win? Talk about pessimistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 So your completely dismissing the notion that had we passed,we might have had a great chance to win? Talk about pessimistic. Nope not at all. Had it worked, great. Still would have given the Giants 4 minutes to score. I don't like the Bills chances asking the defense to win a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 (edited) Nope! As soon as Fitz didn't hand it off to Fred I screamed WTF! Then he threw it and then I really went WTF! So no I didn't think that. Had he run time, kicked a FG, and escaped NY with a W, would have impressed me more than "gambling and losing". It would have shown me he can make the right calls at crunch time on the road in a tie game. Frankly you can't take passes out of the playbook there. It boggles my mind that the two most heated points on this board currently are arguments that fitz is the answer but shouldn't be allowed to throw that pass..... Edited October 16, 2011 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Frankly you can't take passes out of the playbook there. It boggles my mind that the two most heated points on this board currently are arguments that fitz is the answer but shouldn't be allowed to throw with 4 mins or less left..... Get a clue!, You don't throw it right there. What is so hard to comprehend about that. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Giants what do you do? Still throw? The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Bills what do you do? Still throw? Since the defense can't ever stop anything is it really a smart move to try and trust the defense to win a game? I don't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Get a clue!, You don't throw it right there. What is so hard to comprehend about that. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Giants what do you do? Still throw? The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Bills what do you do? Still throw? Since the defense can't ever stop anything is it really a smart move to try and trust the defense to win a game? I don't! Fitz disagrees with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreakPop Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Fitz disagrees with you. He can, but where did that get him today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRW Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Get a clue!, You don't throw it right there. What is so hard to comprehend about that. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Giants what do you do? Still throw? Yes. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Bills what do you do? Still throw? Yes. Since the defense can't ever stop anything is it really a smart move to try and trust the defense to win a game? I don't! I'd rather trust the D with a 7 point lead and 4 minutes than a 3 point lead and 2 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 He can, but where did that get him today? Sorry that he !@#$ed up on 2 great play calls and it cost him and his team the win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Get a clue!, You don't throw it right there. What is so hard to comprehend about that. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Giants what do you do? Still throw? The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Bills what do you do? Still throw? Since the defense can't ever stop anything is it really a smart move to try and trust the defense to win a game? I don't! Yea- keep the defense honest. You get the td there and the worst the d can do is give a tie. You concede that it's 3 runs and you are almost always going to be stopped and kicking a fg. You must be able to make that call. Not everytime, but sometimes. Getting a fg shot with 2 mins left isn't better than a td with 4. Fitz threw an awful ball. It happens. You must be able to make that call sometimes if you want to win consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 Get a clue!, You don't throw it right there. What is so hard to comprehend about that. The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Giants what do you do? Still throw? The same exact scenario except the score is 24-21 Bills what do you do? Still throw? Since the defense can't ever stop anything is it really a smart move to try and trust the defense to win a game? I don't! You may be right, I was thinking at the time we should give the ball to Freddo . . . BUT . . . I have had a bellyfull of conservative playcalling that wins us just enough games to get 7-9 year after year, with no hope of the playoffs . . . I like a little overaggressiveness and am willing to live with the occasional interception or blown up play. I see no sense in bemoaning 4-2 going into the buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 It's always our QBs that make mistakes. No other QB in the league makes a mistake. Ugh. We have all the bad luck right? Actually, quite the opposite. This is the first game where we had no luck. And, this is what the Bills look like with the absence of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PO'14 Posted October 16, 2011 Share Posted October 16, 2011 You run the ball once. Maybe it get nothing, maybe it gets you a few yards and the play book opens up some more with TICK TOCK moving along! What do I know...I called the run before the pass, so I will stay with my gut instinct...it was a bad call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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