LabattBlue Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Andrew Luck, Landry Jones, & Matt Barkley.. IF they decide to come out early.. Jones and Barkley have a LOT to prove before I put them in the same group(franchise grade QB's) as Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garchat80 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Jones and Barkley have a LOT to prove before I put them in the same group(franchise grade QB's) as Luck. Compared to the Newtons, Gabberts, & Ponders of this yrs draft... I'll wait for 2012.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealityCheck Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I do believe Nix and Gailey NEED to get a QB. They are picking #3 and basically have the opportunity to pick any QB they want. A 2nd year HC and GM need to identify and find their franchise QB. That's normally how you rebuild. Not sure how long their contracts are or how long Ralph will wait for a QB ... after he said multiple times last season they need to find a QB. So are you saying that if we grab a QB @3 that we now have a franchise QB because we picked him @3, or is there a particular guy that you would bet your job on. If they chose the wrong guy then I say Nix and Gailey are fired in a few years, as they should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Compared to the Newtons, Gabberts, & Ponders of this yrs draft... I'll wait for 2012.. Right because it will be easy to get Luck...Or Landry and Barkley IF they come out... I can promise you there is no such thing as an NFL GM or HC who think that way at all...They're not worried about next years Draft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hplarrm Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I completely disagree with that statement...It's really ridiculous seeing as though everyone and their Mother knows there is only one, and can be only one, Peyton Manning...Anyone who compares a College QB coming out to Manning is pretty dumb...Secondly it's the Ryan Leaf's and Jamarcus Russell's of the world that keep Teams like the Bills hoping a QB with career 12-23 record as a Starter and 73 Career QB Rating can be something more than servicable so they don't HAVE to take a kid like Gabbert who has every single box checked when your looking purely (and admittedly) at potential for the QB position in the NFL...If it were not for the Leaf's, Russell's, Harringtons, etc I can promise you 100% that Gabbert would be the pick tonight...Everyone knows the bust rate is great...It's not about conventional wisdom or wishful thinking...It's about the fact that every Team knows it's a QB's league and if you find the right one to build around you're going to be good for a long time...There is no question about that fact, and THAT is why Teams continue to reach...The risk may be great, but if you get it right, the reward is FAR greater... I think that there is a conventional wisdom about the draft which gets reflected in several ideas such as the absolute key to getting a franchise QB is to draft him. Recent experience simply demonstrates that is not the case. Yes Peyton Manning and RoboQB are two recent examples of QBs who led the team which drafted them to SB victories. However, a look at the record simply shows that the last QB to lead the team which drafted him to SB victory was the Dallas selection of Aikman way back at the end of the 80s. I am not making this up, them is simply the actual occurrences. You are right that Manning should not be used as a comparison, but this is because the draft is clearly not the only way to acquire a franchise QB but in fact it is often not the way to acquire them. Rodgers was a first round choice who led the Packers to the promise land so it is the case that drafting the right guy in the first can do it for you. I am not saying it cannot be done. However, one need only go back to the year before that to find that franchise QB Drew Brees was an FA acquisition. In the end, the key remains pick the right guy. For this year's draft it does not boil down to whether one should pursue a draft a QB, draft am OL, or draft a defensive star approach. What it comes down to is pick the right guy. As far as QB goes the question is whether there is a QB likely to go in the 1st or 2nd who is the right guy? As I am not a professional and even for the professionals the answer is ultimately who knows for sure, I am comfortable in saying that even though Newton or Gabbert may one day turn out to be a franchise guy, pretty much all signs indicate this is pretty doubtful. It is doubtful as no credible info source is mistaking either Gabbert or Newton for a Peyton Manning or Dan Marino who can play credibly right off the back. In fact, though I think it is possible for one of these two QBs to eventually be franchise guys, both show all the signs of being two year projects before anyone should reasonably expect them to contribute to the team which drafts them. Gabbert looks like a very talented athlete but is simply not a reasonable risk the #3 pick. He only has two years of starting experience and this is not enough to base a #3 pick on. Further, the #s he racked up are impressive but it was against inferior competition with his league opponents. It does not mean he could not produce against NFL quality players it just means he has not done so yet and will need to watch the game and practice a bit simply to get used to NFL speed and power. In addition, even against lower talented players there are real questions about his completion rate particularly since a lot of the gains came from dump-offs in the spread offense he ran well. He will likely need a couple of years before he is ready to contribute to the Bills (or do you want to claim he is better than Tom Brady who needed a full year before he was thrust into the starting role by an unusual injury to Bledsoe. Think hard before you want to set an expectation of Gabbert that he is going to outpace Brady in development time. Add on to that the Brady risk was a 6th rounder and you are proposing we take a #3 risk. Do you really think that WGR, Sully, and a small but vocal group are not going to stand on some alleged wisdom that a 1st round choice cannot be declared a bust until 3 years, but claim the reasonable expectation for a #3 pick is he should at least contribute and really should start his first year. I think this is the conventional wisdom. However, with some more intensive analysis of a couple of draft classes the actual # is only a hair above 50% of first round choices are 1st on the team depth chart after one season. My sense is that ironically, I think Newton will actually contribute to his team significantly faster than Gabbert. However, this is because I think he can become a prototye contributor as the snap catcher in the Wildcat offense right away, However, I have enough doubts about whether Newton, given the fast and loose manner which he and his parents have handled his stardom to date will be able to apply himself with the discipline needed to achieve franchise success in sport. Again ironically it may actually be early success he experiences in a Wildcat which will make him difficult to teach to subordinate and change his game to become an effective leader rather than an effective free-lancer. Overall, one can figure at least two years for him to become an effective pro QB. Unfortunately with a streak over a decade in not making the playoffs, I doubt the time can be taken to develop a rookie QB into a franchise guy. The good news for the Bills is that there are multiple other ways teams have found of winning the SB or even finding a franchise guy other than drafting him, There us a rich history of HOF QBs like Steve Young, soon to be HOF like Brett Favre, FA from Wal-Mart Kurt Warner, FA from SD Drew Brees, FA from whereever Trent Dilfer and even two-time cuttee Brad Johnson but not a franchise guy who led a team to an SB win that simply are facts that one need not draft a player to find a franchise guy. You do recognize there are other ways to do this. Particularly given that as best as I can tell all the success Gailey has produced has not been with rookies but with vets (even vets viewed as failures elsewhere) like Fiedler, Bulger, Kordell and even Fitzy. If there is a franchise guy out there I can see taking him but there does not appear to be a franchise guy who likely will be taken in the 1st two rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 What it comes down to is pick the right guy. Agreed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I am ok with Fitzgerald starting this year, and signing a veteran QB to back him up (plenty of them out there). Next year is where I would draft my QB of the future. What good is drafting a QB if the line is shot and the defense is amongst the worst in the NFL? Give the QB a chance to be successful Amen. We don't want another David Carr on our hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 It must be nice to live in a world where you can pick and choose as to when exactly you want to draft your franchise QB, and you also know a year in advance that a franchise QB will be available for you to select at your draft spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garchat80 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 It must be nice to live in a world where you can pick and choose as to when exactly you want to draft your franchise QB, and you also know a year in advance that a franchise QB will be available for you to select at your draft spot. Repeat... There are no Franchise Quarterbacks in this draft. So why draft one? Why not get the Best Defensive Player in the draft? Dareus/Miller and continue to build the D with your other picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 We are so accustomed to mediocrity that people are happy enough to have a serviceable QB to get us into the playoffs. Sorry I want to win the damn superbowl. Fitz is a good bridge the gap QB and that is it, we have so many holes we are looking at a couple more drafts and FA periods to get back to fielding a team that might barely be able to squeak into the first round of the playoffs; let alone win a playoof game. Last year it was let's wait till this draft to grab a QB - Locker will be coming out, Mallett looks great keep an eye on him...Now we are here and it is don't draft a QB next year's class will be sooooo much better...And next year at this time we will find that Luck has all sorts of warts and is projecting into the second round etc...Just think Brian Brohm... To have the best and mutliple shots at winning a top flight QB is a necessary. While I do not want us to reach for a QB, I don't want us to pass on one just because Fitz is serviceable. We have the third pick in the entire draft. Carolina will not be better than us next year...they will most likely end up with the first pick again. We might be back around 6 or 8 and then to get the qb we will have to trade the draft away...We are here now and have a shot at all except Newton...we best take a shot now if Nix and company billieve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garchat80 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 We are so accustomed to mediocrity that people are happy enough to have a serviceable QB to get us into the playoffs. Sorry I want to win the damn superbowl. Fitz is a good bridge the gap QB and that is it, we have so many holes we are looking at a couple more drafts and FA periods to get back to fielding a team that might barely be able to squeak into the first round of the playoffs; let alone win a playoof game. Last year it was let's wait till this draft to grab a QB - Locker will be coming out, Mallett looks great keep an eye on him...Now we are here and it is don't draft a QB next year's class will be sooooo much better...And next year at this time we will find that Luck has all sorts of warts and is projecting into the second round etc...Just think Brian Brohm... To have the best and mutliple shots at winning a top flight QB is a necessary. While I do not want us to reach for a QB, I don't want us to pass on one just because Fitz is serviceable. We have the third pick in the entire draft. Carolina will not be better than us next year...they will most likely end up with the first pick again. We might be back around 6 or 8 and then to get the qb we will have to trade the draft away...We are here now and have a shot at all except Newton...we best take a shot now if Nix and company billieve. Who would you like the Bills to draft @ QB this yr? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Who would you like the Bills to draft @ QB this yr? Just want to add... Like everyone has said they all have issues, even if there was a clearcut #1, Carolina would take him. If there were 2, Elway would take the other. We can't hope for a non-first round QB gem...those don't happen often at all. All I seem to read on all sorts of posts is that people feel we can win with Fitz, while I like him, he does not have the talent of a top flight qb...He is a Trent Dilfer type qb...Sorry I want a Jim Kelly, Elway, Manning etc...that is how you win consistently in the NFL...If the Bills feel this is the year to take a first round QB, we should be behind it. It has nothing to do with Fitz, but you can't guarentee where we will be drafting next year and the needs of the teams ahead of us. This year we have a chance to get the second best qb in the draft, if they feel he can be the real deal...let's cheer them on!! To answer your question...I would run away from Newton...I question if he lives football and the will to be the best...Gabbert, lately reminds me of Trent and dinks and dunk. I admit I haven't studied him too much and have a hard time assessing his weaknesses with the team he was on...I do like Kaepernick or Mallet, but not at 3. Mallet is a first round talent,Kaepernick is what Chan would love, but he might be a secound round steal.... ...Ponder, Dalton I worry about arm strength in the winter at home I would get behind whoever Nix and Gailey decide. Remember Ralph sent Nix all over to scout QBs this past season and Nix is a scout at heart... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 However, a look at the record simply shows that the last QB to lead the team which drafted him to SB victory was the Dallas selection of Aikman way back at the end of the 80s. I am not making this up, them is simply the actual occurrences. Actually, you are very much making **** up. Rodgers was drafted by the Packers. Peyton Manning was drafted by the Colts. Roethlisberger was drafted by the Steelers. Brady was drafted by the Patriots. McNair, McNabb, and Grossman all took the team that drafted them to the Super Bowl in the last decade as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Blizzard Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Why do we need to draft a QB this year? Will Ponder or Mallett or any other 2nd/3rd round draft choice be as good or better than Fitzy? Lets use all of our picks on the D and the Offensive Line. Sign Volek or Thigpen as our backup and look to next yrs 2012 draft for the QB of the future. Can we trade up for Luck next yr, when all the teams needing QB's drafted one in this years draft? Teams needing QB's: Buffalo, Carolina, Cincy, Arz, Tenn, Minny, SF, WASH, Miami, Denver At least 7 teams will take their Qb's this yr... The 2011 season summary will be "We suck again", and then we'll take Andrew Luck (Remember him??) in the first round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garchat80 Posted April 29, 2011 Author Share Posted April 29, 2011 Just want to add... Like everyone has said they all have issues, even if there was a clearcut #1, Carolina would take him. If there were 2, Elway would take the other. We can't hope for a non-first round QB gem...those don't happen often at all. All I seem to read on all sorts of posts is that people feel we can win with Fitz, while I like him, he does not have the talent of a top flight qb...He is a Trent Dilfer type qb...Sorry I want a Jim Kelly, Elway, Manning etc...that is how you win consistently in the NFL...If the Bills feel this is the year to take a first round QB, we should be behind it. It has nothing to do with Fitz, but you can't guarentee where we will be drafting next year and the needs of the teams ahead of us. This year we have a chance to get the second best qb in the draft, if they feel he can be the real deal...let's cheer them on!! To answer your question...I would run away from Newton...I question if he lives football and the will to be the best...Gabbert, lately reminds me of Trent and dinks and dunk. I admit I haven't studied him too much and have a hard time assessing his weaknesses with the team he was on...I do like Kaepernick or Mallet, but not at 3. Mallet is a first round talent,Kaepernick is what Chan would love, but he might be a secound round steal.... ...Ponder, Dalton I worry about arm strength in the winter at home I would get behind whoever Nix and Gailey decide. Remember Ralph sent Nix all over to scout QBs this past season and Nix is a scout at heart... Stay with the D or OLINE. Please no Mallet, Dalton or Kapernick.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonbrigade Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 1983 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 round 2....lots of good choices..... #1- Ryan Mallet #2- Marvin Austin #3- Kyle Rudolph #4- DaQuan Bowers #5- Akeem Ayers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hplarrm Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 Actually, you are very much making **** up. Rodgers was drafted by the Packers. Peyton Manning was drafted by the Colts. Roethlisberger was drafted by the Steelers. Brady was drafted by the Patriots. McNair, McNabb, and Grossman all took the team that drafted them to the Super Bowl in the last decade as well. Actually its a combo of mistakes. I was inarticulate in saying what I was talking about was not whether a team drafted a player but whether they wasted a first rounder on him. Brady is actually an outrider example that though no one should expect to get the best player in football in the 6th round, clearly one need not be a slave to drafting a QB in the 1st or second round to get a good QB. The other is a misread by you. The note asks folks to look prior to the drafting of RoboQB and Manning and thats where you find a long lapse in picking a QB in the first who takes the team which drafted him to the SB and that was Dallas choosing Aikman in 89 but no other 1st rounder scores an SB win until Manning finally broke the drought deep in the 2000s. If one MUST draft a QB in the 1st or second to get a franchise QB then any drought would be surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 people are so funny We just got Marcel friggen Darius....and they are worried about whether or not the number 2 pick will not be someone they want as if it would turn their A draft into an F Nix is doing just fine. I cant wait to see Darius setting the edge on defense and teams trying to run away from him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garchat80 Posted April 30, 2011 Author Share Posted April 30, 2011 people are so funny We just got Marcel friggen Darius....and they are worried about whether or not the number 2 pick will not be someone they want as if it would turn their A draft into an F Nix is doing just fine. I cant wait to see Darius setting the edge on defense and teams trying to run away from him Thank you Nix for sticking with the D! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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