markgbe Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) I was just doing a bit of quick research and it seems that the defenses that he's been around have not done so good, especially those where he was coordinator/assnt coordinator.. He has to go right? At the very least, i think a demotion to linebackers coach or something if he really has some type of worth. My research was quick and dirty, so i might be missing something... I understand the talent on the field is not great, but the talent hasn't changed much since last year i don't think. Not that the bills D was good last year, but it was definitely not quite as bad as it was this year. Thoughts? Edited January 3, 2011 by markgbe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 He's gotta go. Far, far away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RkFast Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I cant fire a guy for not turning water into wine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markgbe Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) Eric Mangini is available. I wouldn't mind him as our DC. I just think there's a tad bit more to the drop off on the D since Perry left; more than just talent on the field. Edited January 3, 2011 by markgbe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 What has Mangini done to deserve being a D-Coordinator in the NFL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markgbe Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) What has Mangini done to deserve being a D-Coordinator in the NFL? Well he must have done something good in the past. Being the DB coach from 2000-2004 and the DC in 2005 in New England earned him a head coaching job with the jets, and then Cleveland. Edited January 3, 2011 by markgbe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Edwards isn't going anywhere, not this offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I cant fire a guy for not turning water into wine. I hear ya. And I have been back and forth with this all year. Off the cuff I would say that, if the Bills can land one of the available proven coordinators, I would be thrilled -- but I wouldn't necessarily fire Edwards just to appease the masses. My initial instinct was to dislike the Edwards hire, especially when Chan, an offensive coach by trade, admitted that he would not he hiring a household name as DC. It was clearly evident the first few weeks that Edwards was definitely in over his head, trying to cram square pegs (his existing roster, which he inherited from the Cover-2 favoring Jauron) into round holes (his 3-4 scheme). However, he started growing on me mid season, as he started showing signs of being able to adapt. Frankly, I do not know that I can blame anyone on the staff for the miserable showing the last two weeks against clearly superior division foes and with a bevy of injuries to plan around. Moreover, when your offense turns the ball over 13 times in those 2 games, it is hard to fault the defense. In a way, the scheme switch didn't make much of a difference. Last year, the team couldn't stop the run -- this year they couldn't stop the run. Last year the team had trouble pressuring the QB, this year they had trouble pressuring the QB. That was further compounded by losing their only viable pass rusher (Schobel). As a counter-point, look at how much better Fewell's pass rush looked when he had a superior defensive line in New York. Assuming that young players like Moats and Carrington continue to develop and assuming the team makes some upgrades via the draft and free agency (not counting Merriman, whom I am NOT counting on), I would be willing to give Edwards a little latitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markgbe Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 Edwards isn't going anywhere, not this offseason. I have that same feeling. I hear ya. And I have been back and forth with this all year. Off the cuff I would say that, if the Bills can land one of the available proven coordinators, I would be thrilled -- but I wouldn't necessarily fire Edwards just to appease the masses. My initial instinct was to dislike the Edwards hire, especially when Chan, an offensive coach by trade, admitted that he would not he hiring a household name as DC. It was clearly evident the first few weeks that Edwards was definitely in over his head, trying to cram square pegs (his existing roster, which he inherited from the Cover-2 favoring Jauron) into round holes (his 3-4 scheme). However, he started growing on me mid season, as he started showing signs of being able to adapt. Frankly, I do not know that I can blame anyone on the staff for the miserable showing the last two weeks against clearly superior division foes and with a bevy of injuries to plan around. Moreover, when your offense turns the ball over 13 times in those 2 games, it is hard to fault the defense. In a way, the scheme switch didn't make much of a difference. Last year, the team couldn't stop the run -- this year they couldn't stop the run. Last year the team had trouble pressuring the QB, this year they had trouble pressuring the QB. That was further compounded by losing their only viable pass rusher (Schobel). As a counter-point, look at how much better Fewell's pass rush looked when he had a superior defensive line in New York. Assuming that young players like Moats and Carrington continue to develop and assuming the team makes some upgrades via the draft and free agency (not counting Merriman, whom I am NOT counting on), I would be willing to give Edwards a little latitude. i'm definitely on the fence because i also agree with this. I'd definitely hate to be too hasty and ax a guy that was dealt an unfair hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drifter Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 There is no doubt he was given an unenviable job in trying to run a 3-4 with 4-3 personnel. My main concern is can he design a defense to slow down divisional offenses when we finally do get the right players on the team. I do not know much about Edwards so if Chan thinks he can do it then I'll have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 What about Wade Phillips? He's a "good-ole-boy." Seems that he would fit right in with Buddy & Chan, and is an exceptional defensive coordinator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Put me down as wanting Edwards gone on the next bus out of Buffalo. The defense got way worse this year. Last year the Bills gave up 326 points, this year 425. Sorry, that's way worse. The talent on the field was not great, but 26.6 points per game? There will be some decent DC candidates out there. Marvin Lewis (perhaps), Leslie Frazier (perhaps), John Fox, Mangini (perhaps), Singeltary and others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 On merit, sure, you'd think he'd get fired. On the other hand, this is the front office that gave Kelsay, who was playing absolutely terrible football, an extension because he was "improving". If they follow that mode of thinking, Edwards will be promoted to Asst. Head Coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiderweb Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) I was just doing a bit of quick research and it seems that the defenses that he's been around have not done so good, especially those where he was coordinator/assnt coordinator.. He has to go right? At the very least, i think a demotion to linebackers coach or something if he really has some type of worth. My research was quick and dirty, so i might be missing something... I understand the talent on the field is not great, but the talent hasn't changed much since last year i don't think. Not that the bills D was good last year, but it was definitely not quite as bad as it was this year. Thoughts? Even if he was demoted, his background included coaching the LB's and we all know how well ours played this year. Yes, there was a serious talent deficiency once we got by Poz who I believe is above average. Edwards did not do the job, by any means of evaluation. He needs to go and someone who can run a defense be brought in. Edited January 3, 2011 by Spiderweb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meathead Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 once again, the kelsay deal was good for the bills they got an average starting nfl de for 2.5mil in 2010, 3.0m in 2011, and only a measely 2m signing bonus with no other guaranteed money they havent had him play lb AT ALL since about game six and hes been pretty decently effective in providing pressure and being around the ball to top it off, hes a great lockerroom presence and bills ambassador hes not a star but at his salary and attitude hes very valuable to this team right now. im not gonna let ignorant fan haters twist that into something its not. again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 salmaiorana Sal Maiorana Gailey said he has no plans to make any coaching staff changes. Said he's satisfied with DC George Edwards. Of course, it's Ralph's call http://twitter.com/#!/salmaiorana/status/22041760431603712 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 If he is to be fired, than so should Chan and the rest of the coaches. Our offense was just as bad as our defense, imo. Same with Special Teams. Our coaching, players and front office all suck, I can't pin the blame on one person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Defense Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 What about Wade Phillips? He's a "good-ole-boy." Seems that he would fit right in with Buddy & Chan, and is an exceptional defensive coordinator. Yes, Wade was almost always a superb defensive coordinator--doesn't have the personality maybe to be a great head coach. He was one of the few capable of establishing a defense to stop the great Bills teams of the early 90's. And yeah, he would fit in VERY well with Gailey and Nix--no BS, down to earth footbal guys, not worried about any limelight. I know this concept has been brought up before, with some saying that his relationship with Wilson would prevent this, but I don't think that would be the case. I think he would like to be back here, with the Bills' fans, and at Ralph Wilson Stadium, and with Gailey as his boss. Wade Phillips would likely make this defense dramatically better, overnight, and add in a 1st and 2nd round pick, with a choice free agent or two, and this could be a playoff team next year--despite the drubbing the Bills took the last two weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdBlueNorth Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I don't think so. Not that I am enamored with the product that he has been able to put on the field, but the team was very up front (see linky from May last year) about the challenges of shifting defensive philosophies early in the year, the fact that they did not have the right personnel to run either well, and that this year would be a tough year running a hybrid system of both. I think the year was even more tough than imagined because we did not have any good run stoppers and our pass rush was abysmal. How did we address that in the off-season? - Well, we lost Schobel our one true pass rusher and no slouch in run defense, and we gained a bunch of rookies and castoffs from other teams. Not surprisingly, we still stink at stopping the run (Troup is still a bit light and is having a slow rookie acclimation year), but as the rookie Moats and Carrington have come on we have found more ways to pressure the QB. Pass defense has been abysmal IMO, I would like to see a big shift in the off-season on how our DBs play the pass and the run. Byrd definitely needs coaching up. Last year his primary focus was one half of the field in a cover-2 defense which was easy for him to absorb, but the way you have to use the FS in a 3-4 means that Bryd has to be able to read either side of the field, react, and take better angles to be successful - he has struggled both with injuries and picking up his assignments. Edwards defensive changes I like Edward's pedigree and he has worked many years under some really good defensive coordinators including Wade Phillips, Saban, Capers... he knows the strengths and weaknesses of both systems and I think he can get us further down the road next year with some personnel upgrades. I am not sure that all that experience will translate into someone who can shoulder all the responsibilities needed at DC, but time will tell. I am more confused as to why they kept our DB coach on from the Jauron era - his experience is Tampa-2 (Carolina, Indianapolis, KC...) all the way when we definitely need a DB coach who can coach up our secondary to play more single coverage, blitz, and run support. This guy has been bounced around so much I would like to see what he can do when given the luxury of having the same OC and more than a year, but like my take with Gailey I expect to see better results next year - period. For myself, I will give them a pass on this year because of all the personnel and scheme changes...we will see if they can make the grade next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Gailey said he'll evaluate it, but he anticipates zero changes in the staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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