Jauron drafted Maybin…

[Fan in San Diego]

My problem with that draft isn't so much that they took Maybin. It was that Arakpo was still on the board, they could have had Arakpo! He is monster of a physical specimen compared to Maybin, passing on Arakpo is unforgivable! Ralph should have fired anyone associated with that draft decision because they are retarded.

[pimp on da' net]

Either way, Modrak has to wonder how thin the ice is.

 

Maybe Modrak doesn't want the job? He didn't want to be GM, when it was offered after TD and doesn't have it to be a full time scout. Hell he's prob wondering after his record since being here, what does it take to get fired? Or the key maybe just stay away from OBD on a daily basis and keep your mouth shout, there's know accountability obviously.

Edited October 29, 2010 by pimp on da' net

[Punch]

There was much deliberation about him being fired at the END of the season

Amongst whom... fans?

 

If you're privy to the backroom deliberations at One Bills Drive then you probably have access to other information, such as whether Jauron or Modrak are primarily responsible for drafting Maybin. Why start a poll, then?

 

Maybin was a terrible draft pick. Nix and company have publicly stated they will not make draft picks of that inexperienced and overhyped ilk. Until they do, I'll go with other TSW posters with actuall knowledge of the process and believe Dick Jauron had the final say about taking Maybin.

[pimp on da' net]

Which expert had Maybin rated as 4th round material? The Thoner7 report?

 

As mentioned by othe folks already, Maybin was projected as a 1st rounder by most of the gurus.

I do recall him rated as a 3rd OLB by sporting news, didn't see anything lower than that but most consensus followed with code words boom or bust and project. Either way Buffalo went against the norm in respect to drafting a one year wonder, who wasn't gonna start for PS if not for the injury to M. Evans

[Thoner7]

Amongst whom... fans?

 

If you're privy to the backroom deliberations at One Bills Drive then you probably have access to other information, such as whether Jauron or Modrak are primarily responsible for drafting Maybin. Why start a poll, then?

 

Maybin was a terrible draft pick. Nix and company have publicly stated they will not make draft picks of that inexperienced and overhyped ilk. Until they do, I'll go with other TSW posters with actuall knowledge of the process and believe Dick Jauron had the final say about taking Maybin.

From EPSN and NFLN?

 

Did you miss the week+ long topics about the deliberation and the insider discussions from Schefter/Mortensen/Clayton??? – it was all over TV.

[Punch]

From EPSN and NFLN?

 

Did you miss the week+ long topics about the deliberation and the insider discussions from Schefter/Mortensen/Clayton??? – it was all over TV.

You're implying the Bills were considering it--- I would've fired him and I'm sure 99% of those at TSW would as well. But whatever was said on ESPN was speculation about what they should do and has no bearing on what the Bills were discussing behind the scenes.

[dave mcbride]

I'd say look at the track record of both. When with Pitt and Philly, Modrak didn't draft undersized DEs who needed to be converted to LB.

 

At Philly, he drafted McNabb in his first year (1999) and Corey Simon in the first round in his second draft. Simon and McNabb both dominated for multiple years at the college level. In 01, he drafted Freddie Mitchell in the first. Mitchell was a bust, but he was in fact quite productive in college. He had a huge senior year, a pretty decent junior year, and a promising sophomore year cut short in game 4 by a broken leg (after racking up over 100 yards receiving vs. Texas).

 

He didn't have final say in Pitt, but it is in fact the case that Pitt had a penchant for drafting big, tough LBs and stout DEs over the time he was there. He also landed Derrick Burgess in the third round in 01 while at Philly (where he presumably had final say).

 

When he was at Chicago, Jauron presumably didn't have final say (particularly in his final season - 2003), but he was the coach when another Penn State DE with big sack numbers was drafted - Michael Haynes. Plus it is the case that Jauron favored smaller guys and got rid of more stout LBs in Buffalo.

 

I don't think the criticism of Modrak holds in this case.

[Punch]

I'd say look at the track record of both. When with Pitt and Philly, Modrak didn't draft undersized DEs who needed to be converted to LB.

 

At Philly, he drafted McNabb in his first year (1999) and Corey Simon in the first round in his second draft. Simon and McNabb both dominated for multiple years at the college level. In 01, he drafted Freddie Mitchell in the first. Mitchell was a bust, but he was in fact quite productive in college. He had a huge senior year, a pretty decent junior year, and a promising sophomore year cut short in game 4 by a broken leg (after racking up over 100 yards receiving vs. Texas).

 

He didn't have final say in Pitt, but it is in fact the case that Pitt had a penchant for drafting big, tough LBs and stout DEs over the time he was there. He also landed Derrick Burgess in the third round in 01 while at Philly (where he presumably had final say).

 

When he was at Chicago, Jauron presumably didn't have final say (particularly in his final season - 2003), but he was the coach when another Penn State DE with big sack numbers was drafted - Michael Haynes. Plus it is the case that Jauron favored smaller guys and got rid of more stout LBs in Buffalo.

 

I don't think the criticism of Modrak holds in this case.

That's all true--- Aaron Maybin fit the exact description for quick, undersized D-linemen coveted by Dick Jauron's Tampa 2 defense.

[Kelly the Dog]

 

Ok PTR. Show me one piece of evidence from a credible source. A $10 godaddy website doesn't make you a draft expert. Kiper and McShay are your other evidence? Thanks for making my argument for me. Mayock is the only credible media guy out there – as evidenced by his track record vrs the other guys. He had Maybin way down on his board. (see above) If you could drum up one single credible source, like a GM, Former GM (not Matt Millen), someone who knows something, maybe you would have an argument. But that's just another giant swing and a miss….

 

Seriously, does anyone remember the media "experts" loving a guy name George Selvie? He was a "top 10 lock" his Sophomore year. 2 years later he goes in the 7th round. Did he get that much worse or was he never that good? That's what happened here with Maybin. One good statistical year, idiots like McShay say he is a top 10 pick, other idiots on EPSN regurgitate it, other idiots with $10 websites copy McShay/Kiper, Juaron and the rest of the FO apparently fell for it.

Rick Gosselin. One of the very best.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/columnists/rgosselin/stories/041109dnspomockdraft.24fa77e.html

Walterfootball is a decent one. had him at 18.

http://walterfootball.com/draft2009.php

nbc sports had him at #9

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/28774609/

SI Don Banks had him 15

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/don_banks/01/22/mock2/index.html

 

I could go on.

 

The Selvie example is just plain stupid. There are players like that every year who two years earlier were thought to be one of the top picks overall. Look at Brian Brohm.

[polish lover]

I have seen posted in many threads, to the point where it seems to have become an accepted fact, that Maybin was a Juaron Draft pick 100%. Now I like everyone else have heard the reports the Jauron wanted Maybina and Modrak claims to have wanted Cushing – but do you believe everything you hear?

 

At the end of the 2008 Season Jauron was almost FIRED. He was a hair away from getting the Axe (so close so that halfway into 2009 he actually was canned). So, are we to believe that 4 ½ months later, the then “circle jerk of trust” went 100% with a lame duck coach who was sitting on the hottest of hot seats against the advice of the entire scouting staff? I don’t believe that one bit.

 

Now I don’t doubt Jauron wanting Maybin at all, but I do doubt the notion that Modrak was against selecting Maybin. Modrak may have had Cushing as BPA, but I bet he had Maybin as 2nd best BPA – a pick the staff has tried desperately to distance themselves from. There is no way that the scouting staff was trumped completely for the opinion of a coach everyone knew wouldn’t last another year or 2, Jauron defiantly had some backing from eh scouting staff in that draft room.

 

If Modrak was good at his job he would have had Maybin rated no higher than the 4th round. In that case, the “circle jerk of trust” decided to draft the highly un-recommended 4th round prospect that the lame duck halfway fired HC wants? Sorry if I don’t buy that scenario either.

 

Ok, so Modrak wanted Cushing…. Haven’t we heard this before? In 2004 he was part of the scouting staff hand picked by Donahoe to be head of scouting. That year that staff TRADED UP to select Losman. 2 years later in 2006, Modrak was reported to have wanted Cutler (this info, just like the Cushing info, came out AFTER the season). So Modrak had given up on Losman after 2 years, one of which was spent on the bench with a broken leg? Please – not buying it, no way he gave up on Losman that fast. Its also pretty fishy considering Cutler starts off his career on such a strong note – hindsight anyone? Again this Cutler news didn’t break until after the season. Fast forward to 2009 and its Cushing…”I wanted Cushing” Modrak says- again reported after the season, Oh what a coincidence that he is the ROY.

 

I bet if you asked him today who he wanted he would say “I wanted Mathews……”

Sorry but I am not buying it.

 

 

Based on your post, you don't really understand what Modrak does. Modrak is the head of scouting. He organizes his team of 20 guys who go around and scout out college players. They then use a rating system to rank the various players based on various categories: intelligence, athletic ability, size, intangibles etc. Then a huge list of all the draft eligible players, all ranked and sorted by position is presented to the GM and Head coach. The GM and Head coach and often Ralph then take a look at the top ranked players still on the board when it comes to their time to pick and they try to make some kind of judgement call. At this spot there is no QB worthy of the pick but there are two DE's that have potential. Do we take this guy who has great physical speed but less experience or do we take this guy who is big and tough but has less athleticism? Jauron and Brandon decided to go with Maybin. Not Modrak. Modrak does not make the picks he evaluates the players. The problem is that the guys making the picks were Brandon who is not a football guy and Jauron who clearly had no clue about any position but secondary. The only time I would blame Modrak is when they take a guy like McCargo in the first round who was generally not considered 1st round talent by any other team. That falls on Modrak and his staff.

 

I'd say look at the track record of both. When with Pitt and Philly, Modrak didn't draft undersized DEs who needed to be converted to LB.

 

At Philly, he drafted McNabb in his first year (1999) and Corey Simon in the first round in his second draft. Simon and McNabb both dominated for multiple years at the college level. In 01, he drafted Freddie Mitchell in the first. Mitchell was a bust, but he was in fact quite productive in college. He had a huge senior year, a pretty decent junior year, and a promising sophomore year cut short in game 4 by a broken leg (after racking up over 100 yards receiving vs. Texas).

 

He didn't have final say in Pitt, but it is in fact the case that Pitt had a penchant for drafting big, tough LBs and stout DEs over the time he was there. He also landed Derrick Burgess in the third round in 01 while at Philly (where he presumably had final say).

 

When he was at Chicago, Jauron presumably didn't have final say (particularly in his final season - 2003), but he was the coach when another Penn State DE with big sack numbers was drafted - Michael Haynes. Plus it is the case that Jauron favored smaller guys and got rid of more stout LBs in Buffalo.

 

I don't think the criticism of Modrak holds in this case.

 

 

Modrak doesn't draft anyone, he does player evaluations and then the HC and GM decide which guys to pick. They may talk to Modrak about a player if they need more info but the call is made by the GM and HC and sometimes ralph.

[dave mcbride]

Modrak doesn't draft anyone, he does player evaluations and then the HC and GM decide which guys to pick. They may talk to Modrak about a player if they need more info but the call is made by the GM and HC and sometimes ralph.

Modrak did draft people in Philly. He was the GM.

[PromoTheRobot]

Get your facts straight. The extension as durign the 4-1 start. There was much deliberation about him being fired at the END of the season

Gee, maybe you are only at a 2nd grade comprehension level? Of course he got the extension after going 5-1 (not 4-1) but he still had a 3-year extension at the end of the season, didn't he? What's so hard to understand?

Then its yes, as he must of supported the drafting of Maybin as he was his second BPA. Mayock had Maybin as the 4th best 3-4 OLB. He didn’t even grade him as a DE as he said he 100% could never play that position in the NFL. Now he didn’t grade him in one round or another – but look at that draft. Guess where the 4th best 3-4 OLB gets drafted- THE FORTH ROUND.

Mayock's 2009 mock draft showing the Bills taking Mabin at #11

McShay & Kiper mock have Maybin going at 9 or 10

 

Anymore inaccuracies you want me to clean up?

 

Ok PTR. Show me one piece of evidence from a credible source. A $10 godaddy website doesn’t make you a draft expert. Kiper and McShay are your other evidence? Thanks for making my argument for me. Mayock is the only credible media guy out there.

Mayock is pretty good I will admit but there are a dozen people besides Kiper and McShay that are on major networks and websites, and most of them had Maybin going round one. You can't change the truth.

 

NBC Sports - Maybin at 9

Sporting News-Albert Breer - Maybin at 13

Sporting News-Dave Curtis - Maybin at 13

Sporting News-Vinnie Iyer - Maybin at 11

 

Pick 30. Titans Aaron Maybin DE Penn State

 

Charles Davis: "He's an edge rusher. Every year it screams receiver for the Titans, and they never do it in the first round. I'm going to take Maybin at this point."

The experts weigh in ...

Mike Mayock: "Can he play in that scheme?"

Charles Davis: "He's going to have to now, I just picked him. Otherwise I'm getting fired. I'm bringing him in to rush the passer."

Mike Mayock: "I have less of a problem with him at No. 30."

Charles Davis: 'Lock him in the weight room, get him a little bigger, give me a couple years with him and turn him loose."

 

Gee...even your pal Mayock is okay with Maybin at 30. You know, the guy who according to you is the only credible media guy? FTW! Thoner, you can't make crap up and then not expect to be called out on it.

 

PTR

Edited October 29, 2010 by PromoTheRobot

[Charles Romes]

Russ Brandon drafted Maybin.

 

Right before the 09 draft Brandon was at the peak of his power, having been formally given the GM title. Maybin was another step in the Russ Brandon regionalization plan. Look East: Training camp in Rochester. Look North: The Toronto series. Where else to market? Northern Pa. I'm sure everyone remembers how quickly that corny video of Poz hamming it up with Maybin went up after the draft. I'm sure a lot of other players were in the mix with Maybin, but his Penn State connection tipped the balance in his favor. There are over 100,000 fans that flock to every Penn State home game from Northern and Western PA, and the Southern tier, a fact not overlooked by the organization and Brandon in particular.

[dave mcbride]

Russ Brandon drafted Maybin.

 

Right before the 09 draft Brandon was at the peak of his power, having been formally given the GM title. Maybin was another step in the Russ Brandon regionalization plan. Look East: Training camp in Rochester. Look North: The Toronto series. Where else to market? Northern Pa. I'm sure everyone remembers how quickly that corny video of Poz hamming it up with Maybin went up after the draft. I'm sure a lot of other players were in the mix with Maybin, but his Penn State connection tipped the balance in his favor. There are over 100,000 fans that flock to every Penn State home game from Northern and Western PA, and the Southern tier, a fact not overlooked by the organization and Brandon in particular.

This is an excellent point.

[Thoner7]

Gee, maybe you are only at a 2nd grade comprehension level? Of course he got the extension after going 5-1 (not 4-1) but he still had a 3-year extension at the end of the season, didn't he? What's so hard to understand?

 

Mayock's 2009 mock draft showing the Bills taking Mabin at #11

McShay & Kiper mock have Maybin going at 9 or 10

 

Anymore inaccuracies you want me to clean up?

 

 

Mayock is pretty good I will admit but there are a dozen people besides Kiper and McShay that are on major networks and websites, and most of them had Maybin going round one. You can't change the truth.

 

NBC Sports - Maybin at 9

Sporting News-Albert Breer - Maybin at 13

Sporting News-Dave Curtis - Maybin at 13

Sporting News-Vinnie Iyer - Maybin at 11

 

Pick 30. Titans Aaron Maybin DE Penn State

 

Charles Davis: "He's an edge rusher. Every year it screams receiver for the Titans, and they never do it in the first round. I'm going to take Maybin at this point."

The experts weigh in ...

Mike Mayock: "Can he play in that scheme?"

Charles Davis: "He's going to have to now, I just picked him. Otherwise I'm getting fired. I'm bringing him in to rush the passer."

Mike Mayock: "I have less of a problem with him at No. 30."

Charles Davis: 'Lock him in the weight room, get him a little bigger, give me a couple years with him and turn him loose."

 

Gee...even your pal Mayock is okay with Maybin at 30. You know, the guy who according to you is the only credible media guy? FTW! Thoner, you can't make crap up and then not expect to be called out on it.

 

PTR

 

Charles Davis - another non expert .

 

"I have less of a problem with Maybin at 30" - Implying he still has a problem with Maybin at 30. That comment right there solidifies Mayock’s stance that Maybin was not a 1st round talent in Mayock’s eyes. Man am I glad you aren't my lawyer. Further still you cannot refute that Maybin was Mayocks 4th best 34 OLB and the number of 3-4 OLBs that were drafted, lasting into the 4th round.

 

From the week of the draft:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80dff358&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

 

EXCUSE ME!!! I was WRONG!!! Maybin was tied for 5th best OLB! My mistake

[PromoTheRobot]

Charles Davis - another non expert .

 

"I have less of a problem with Maybin at 30" - Implying he still has a problem with Maybin at 30. That comment right there solidifies Mayock’s stance that Maybin was not a 1st round talent in Mayock’s eyes. Man am I glad you aren't my lawyer. Further still you cannot refute that Maybin was Mayocks 4th best 34 OLB and the number of 3-4 OLBs that were drafted, lasting into the 4th round.

 

From the week of the draft:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80dff358&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

 

EXCUSE ME!!! I was WRONG!!! Maybin was tied for 5th best OLB! My mistake

There's a huge gulf between #30 overall and 4th-5th round which you are claiming. Oh, and way to go ignoring all my other links.

 

PTR

Edited October 29, 2010 by PromoTheRobot

[BEAST MODE BABY!]

Russ Brandon drafted Maybin.

 

Right before the 09 draft Brandon was at the peak of his power, having been formally given the GM title. Maybin was another step in the Russ Brandon regionalization plan. Look East: Training camp in Rochester. Look North: The Toronto series. Where else to market? Northern Pa. I'm sure everyone remembers how quickly that corny video of Poz hamming it up with Maybin went up after the draft. I'm sure a lot of other players were in the mix with Maybin, but his Penn State connection tipped the balance in his favor. There are over 100,000 fans that flock to every Penn State home game from Northern and Western PA, and the Southern tier, a fact not overlooked by the organization and Brandon in particular.

 

 

This, unfortunately, makes a lot of sense.

[PromoTheRobot]

This, unfortunately, makes a lot of sense.

No it doesn't. Not in the least. If it were true, where is the big surge in season ticket sales?

 

PTR

[It's in My Blood]

Even if Modrak really wanted Cushing and wanted Cutler , it still doesn't change my opinion of him. Cushing's a a cheater and Cutler is probably the most overrated QB in the league. If Modrak came out and said he wanted to draft Oher or Orakpo , then ok , maybe.

[Simon]

Charles Davis - another non expert .

 

I'm not getting into the Maybin crap, except to say that he's a wonderful example of what happens when you draft for need. But you should be aware that along with Mike Mayock, Charles Davis has been one of the best informed talking heads for several years now. Don't dismiss the guy because you're not familiar with him, he's wildly underrated and very, very good.