Receiver Depth Chart

[Poznasty51]

What speed? The guy is like a snail on valium!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Were you aware that Jauron and those idiots didn't play Steve Johnsonhis rookie year and that every opportunity he got, he made plays? Were you also aware that last year we signed a guy named Terrell Owens and he got a ton of balls thrown his way in a Pop Warner offense? We also had Josh Reed who carved a little niche and did jack squat in the 3rd receiver spot. Steve Johnson is getting an opportunity to play FINALLY!!! Name something this preseason that he has done wrong besides the ball in the Skins game that he dropped and there was no Pass INT. He is the 2nd receiver. He runs a lot of distraction. Go back to the Colts game. If he doesn't run a precise route, the saftey doesn't bite and Lee Evans isn't WIDE OPEN!!!

 

Nelson is showing a ton of talent and potential and is a solid option as a 4th receiver. He cathces EVERYTHNIG that comes his way and matched up against a Safety, Nickel CB, or a LB, I'll take Nelson everytime. Maybe he will end up as the 2nd but he should not start there. Steve Johnson will be solid. Just wait to see it now that he will actually be on the field.

 

Roosevelt for the Roster!!! SJCI BABY!!!

 

Hardy ran a 4.47 at the combine. Thats pretty good for a big man. He is also the only receiver on the bills that can rebound like a basketball player. His scouting report said he has a knack for getting to the ball at its highest point. I think easley going on ir opens the door for hardy.

Edited August 31, 2010 by Poznasty51

[EastRochBillsfan]

Johnson has done next to nothing this preseason. The one good play he made against the Bengals NO ONE covered him, and it wasn't because of anything he did. They just didn't cover him with anyone. He then, to his credit, charged up field and made it a first down after he caught a two yard pass with no one within five yards of him. It was a nice 10 yard run. He also caught another 4 yard pass I think. And he totally blew the first large loss that Spiller had, as his whiffed completely and his guy was responsible for the 7 yard loss.

 

His best play the entire pre-season was a common drag route where the safety came running up to cover him. If you watch the replay, it wasn't all that special of a route or great cut, he simply did his job well and ran across the field. He also dropped a bomb right in his hands against the Skins, although there was a guy on him. Still, two hands on the ball you need to make the play.

Made the most out of every opportunity? He has 12 catches in 16 games for under 10 yards a catch. He has some skills but if we are talking about actual production, including pre-season where most of Johnson's "making the most" has occurred, both David Nelson and maybe even Namaan Roosevelt have looked as good. I have nothing against SJ at all, but I would start Nelson right now.

 

I'm with tbone on this one. that was pass interference ALL DAY LONG. The defender grabbed his shirt and pulled him right before the ball got there. Even w'out that, the defender got his hands all over that ball. TO wouldn't have caught that and probably not even strong handed evans would have gotten that ball. other than the interference, that was a good play by the defender.

Edited August 31, 2010 by EastRochBillsfan

[bowery4]

I get rid of Hardy and Jones Roosevelt to PS, Go with 5

I could see anybody left going for number 2 except Parrish, coach thinks he is #2 so at this point it is not up to me. lol

Spiller is not likely to be used that way just because he never was one, running routes out of the back field is very different then a WR set. I see the point but he is not a 2 position player. I could be wrong but if I am I guess I won't be surprised now.

It sure sounded interesting I am all for creativity.

[Fan in Chicago]

Hardy ran a 4.47 at the combine. Thats pretty good for a big man. He is also the only receiver on the bills that can rebound like a basketball player. His scouting report said he has a knack for getting to the ball at its highest point. I think easley going on ir opens the door for hardy.

 

Despite his paper skills and straight line speed, if he cannot work on getting open and catching balls (see the ball bounce off his hands in Cincy game) he is a gonner. I know he has been injured a lot but if there he is not producing (whatever the reason), he will be cut by this staff. I think we will have Evans, Parrish, Chad Jackson, Steve Johnson and Nelson as our WRs with Roosevelt and Hardy on the bubble.

[Trader]

Hardy ran a 4.47 at the combine. Thats pretty good for a big man. He is also the only receiver on the bills that can rebound like a basketball player. His scouting report said he has a knack for getting to the ball at its highest point. I think easley going on ir opens the door for hardy.

 

Do you think that Hardy's combine numbers are still relevant? He has had major surgery and his combine was several years ago. Players change with maturity, Ideally they improve but for injury and concentration problems Hardy has had both. Hardy never got separation even in college where he was a man playing against boys. Defensive backs in the pros are much faster, more athletic and way stronger. Hardy gets pushed around by DB's half his size.

 

If you are going to make decisions by combine numbers then Chad Jackson is clearly the best of the lot and even can give Evans a run for the money. David Nelson is a better receiver right now in his rookie year than Hardy ever was. I am not ready to declare Hardy a bust but he has been outplayed by every receiver on the Bills roster. Any coach would be hard pressed to keep him over guys who have worked harder and who have been more diligent in learning to run correct pass routes and who actually block for our running backs. Speaking of blocking any receiver or tight end who cannot block is not going to get playing time on this team including one Shane Nelson.

 

Having said all that I know how you feel we see Hardy in a football uniform and he really looks like something special. You know the expression, "looks like Tarzan....." I think Hardy will see a lot of playing time against Detroit based on that performance he will make the roster or not.

[tbonestake]

Hardy ran a 4.47 at the combine. Thats pretty good for a big man. He is also the only receiver on the bills that can rebound like a basketball player. His scouting report said he has a knack for getting to the ball at its highest point. I think easley going on ir opens the door for hardy.

 

Granted Hardy has a basketball body but he hasn't used it in the NFL. If you're going by his combine numbers, you need to live in the now. I don't know if you heard but he blew out his knee and is recovering from it. He also is coming back from a foot injury. He is S.L.O.W....David Nelson is around the same size and much quicker. He also has better hands. Hardy should get whacked. End of story

Edited August 31, 2010 by tbonestake

[Paup 1995MVP]

Now that training camp is over and 75% of the preseason, the conversation at receiver is even more interesting. For purposes of rank, I will put Stevie ahead of Roscoe just because he plays on the outside opposite Lee. I personally think roscoe will put up bigger numbers.

 

1 - Lee

2 - Stevie

3- Roscoe

4 - David Nelson

5- Chad Jackson

6 - James Hardy

7 - Roosevelt

8 - Donald Jones

 

5-8 were tough. How would you rank them?

This is a great question. And what makes this so intriguing is that all these guys look like they can play, except for Hardy. But you have to love the guys size. But he just doesn't look like he plays the game with much passion and energy. He makes a nice catch and than dropped two. I like Roosevelt and Jones a lot as well. Jones is very physical and Naaman looks like he has a good feel for getting open. I believe that Nelson has more upside than Johnson. But both guys can play. Nelson has more size though. I think this last preseason game will determine a lot about which receivers make the team, and who doesn't. Regardless, all of these guys can play, and the way Gailey sets things up, I believe we will see a lot of offense this season.

 

On our first TD against Cinci, we had Lee in motion coming from rt. to left moving into the slot. He took two defenders down the field with him leaving Roscoe to cross underneath beating #57 easily for Cinci. Previously, we never had Lee in motion, or anyone for that matter. This years offense is going to be fun.

[H2o]

Wait wait wait! Tell me what Chad Jackson has done vs 1ST TEAMERS that has been so impressive. He caught 1 ball from Brohm vs. Indy's Grocery Baggers. He dropped a TD vs. Cincy. Did it ever occurto you that they are spreading the ball around a little bit? Do you think that they're going to target our 2nd receiver for 15 looks a game in the PRESEASON? Wait till the year starts and if SJ is consistently bad, put somebody else at #2. He must be pulling one over on the coaching staff because they believe he is a # 2 as well.

Wait, wait, wait! Tell me, what SJ has done against other teams 1st string? You want to start him because he's a decent run-blocking WR? He has been less than impressive as a WR IMO. People still continue to set him on this pedestal. I do too, it's just a short one that has 5th WR on it. His value is in special teams, sorta like Sam Aiken part deux.

[tbonestake]

Wait, wait, wait! Tell me, what SJ has done against other teams 1st string? You want to start him because he's a decent run-blocking WR? He has been less than impressive as a WR IMO. People still continue to set him on this pedestal. I do too, it's just a short one that has 5th WR on it. His value is in special teams, sorta like Sam Aiken part deux.

 

 

Who are you referring to? Jackson or Johnson? You lost me. They haven't thrown the ball to Johnson too much and they have been playing well, right? Why rock the boat? Colts game, Johnson runs a crossing route and occupies the safety so Lee is open over the top. Thats one. Bengals game, third down in the 2 minute drill, SJ catches a ball over the middle to keep the drive alive. No penalties for holding on Spiller's long runs as well. What more do you want? More catches? The guy can play and he'll show that during the regular season when he gets more opportunities. It's obvious the coaching staff has confidence in him because he IS the 2nd receiver. You didn't tell me how Chad Jackson/David Nelson would be a better 2nd Receiver. CONVINCE ME!!!

[Poznasty51]

Granted Hardy has a basketball body but he hasn't used it in the NFL. If you're going by his combine numbers, you need to live in the now. I don't know if you heard but he blew out his knee and is recovering from it. He also is coming back from a foot injury. He is S.L.O.W....David Nelson is around the same size and much quicker. He also has better hands. Hardy should get whacked. End of story

 

You have to pay attention to upside potential. Buddy Nix picked Chan Gailey because of teaching. I am not sold on hardy being a bust yet because we really haven't seen much of him. It's too early in his career. Maybin has improved, they have coached him up a bit. He has a new move in the counter game and it worked a few times. Chad Jackson, a former second round pick is finding his game with the Bills. Hardy has no experience in an NFL offense and he was out there early with the twos. He was getting snaps with the ones as the 4th toward the end of training camp when I went. While I don't disagree that he hasn't done much, I only see them cutting him if he is not getting better. We will find out saturday. I am sure someone will ask gailey why certain guys were cut.

[Hplarrm]

Wait wait wait! Tell me what Chad Jackson has done vs 1ST TEAMERS that has been so impressive. He caught 1 ball from Brohm vs. Indy's Grocery Baggers. He dropped a TD vs. Cincy. Did it ever occurto you that they are spreading the ball around a little bit? Do you think that they're going to target our 2nd receiver for 15 looks a game in the PRESEASON? Wait till the year starts and if SJ is consistently bad, put somebody else at #2. He must be pulling one over on the coaching staff because they believe he is a # 2 as well.

Sounds like another recruit for the Spiller at #2 WR movement to me.

 

Think about it, for the first time in eons Bills fan are beginning to hope against past disappointment that we actually have a working offense.

 

Getting all revved up due to pre-season is actually a fun (though often football stupid thing to do- no one who even wants to pretend they are football knowledgable should be getting all excited by two not bad pre-season outings) but still one can feel the contrast between an approach that fired its OC a couple of weeks before the season and this year's model under Gailey.

 

The really impressive thing about it though is that we are doing this with out not only clearly most productive O player last year, Jackson hobbled by injury but also without the former Pro-Bowler backing him up.

 

With Spiller's impressive play in two games, one of the key questions facing this O (along with little things like Edwards demonstrating he is not injury prone and the OL coming together, is going to be how do we get enough touches for

 

Spiller- He is an exciting player who threatens a big play every play, but is not seen as a 40 rush a game durable back

 

Jax- A surprising all around leader in yards running, receiving, and even returns who needs to be on the field to produce these results.

 

Lynch- former Pro Bowler who eked in but did deserve the accolades from his production. He can run the ball (and even showing receiving prowess in college) but his problems which endanger whether he should be a Bill or not are off the field rather than on it.

 

I will continue my campaign to see Spiller at #2 WR as not only do I think this solve a major problem for making Evans effective, but it also would help the problem of we need to see Jax, Lynch and Spiller all on the field. Its either split Spiller out wide or go with the Wishbone T.

[tbonestake]

Sounds like another recruit for the Spiller at #2 WR movement to me.

 

Think about it, for the first time in eons Bills fan are beginning to hope against past disappointment that we actually have a working offense.

 

Getting all revved up due to pre-season is actually a fun (though often football stupid thing to do- no one who even wants to pretend they are football knowledgable should be getting all excited by two not bad pre-season outings) but still one can feel the contrast between an approach that fired its OC a couple of weeks before the season and this year's model under Gailey.

 

The really impressive thing about it though is that we are doing this with out not only clearly most productive O player last year, Jackson hobbled by injury but also without the former Pro-Bowler backing him up.

 

With Spiller's impressive play in two games, one of the key questions facing this O (along with little things like Edwards demonstrating he is not injury prone and the OL coming together, is going to be how do we get enough touches for

 

Spiller- He is an exciting player who threatens a big play every play, but is not seen as a 40 rush a game durable back

 

Jax- A surprising all around leader in yards running, receiving, and even returns who needs to be on the field to produce these results.

 

Lynch- former Pro Bowler who eked in but did deserve the accolades from his production. He can run the ball (and even showing receiving prowess in college) but his problems which endanger whether he should be a Bill or not are off the field rather than on it.

 

I will continue my campaign to see Spiller at #2 WR as not only do I think this solve a major problem for making Evans effective, but it also would help the problem of we need to see Jax, Lynch and Spiller all on the field. Its either split Spiller out wide or go with the Wishbone T.

 

I love your enthusiasm bro but why would you want to LIMIT Spiller's ability by making him a #2 WR? The best thing about Spiller is that he is dynamic! He can play different positions on the field. He can run and catch but you CANNOT limit him by making him a # 2. He isn't a route runner. He is a guy who will go over the middle or out of the slot. I cannot stress this enough. DO NOT PIGEON HOLE SPILLER AS A #2 WR!!! MOVE HIM AROUND ALL OVER THE FIELD!!!! KEEP OTHER TEAMS GUESSING!!!!

[The Dean]

I love your enthusiasm bro but why would you want to LIMIT Spiller's ability by making him a #2 WR? The best thing about Spiller is that he is dynamic! He can play different positions on the field. He can run and catch but you CANNOT limit him by making him a # 2. He isn't a route runner. He is a guy who will go over the middle or out of the slot. I cannot stress this enough. DO NOT PIGEON HOLE SPILLER AS A #2 WR!!! MOVE HIM AROUND ALL OVER THE FIELD!!!! KEEP OTHER TEAMS GUESSING!!!!

 

 

Spiller isn't going to be the #2 WR or a WR at all, in the traditional sense. You can take that to the bank. He will see some time as a traditional RB, though.

 

Will CJ get some passes thrown his way? He damn well better. But, he'll be far more useful as a weapon as an RB, IMO.

 

Right now, Parrish is the 2nd best WR on the team, but he won't he called #2 as he plays from the slot most often.

[tbonestake]

Spiller isn't going to be the #2 WR or a WR at all, in the traditional sense. You can take that to the bank. He will see some time as a traditional RB, though.

 

Will CJ get some passes thrown his way? He damn well better. But, he'll be far more useful as a weapon as an RB, IMO.

 

Right now, Parrish is the 2nd best WR on the team, but he won't he called #2 as he plays from the slot most often.

 

Finally the voice of reason

[Kelly the Dog]

The WR depth chart means zero. There will be so many combinations of players and formations the other team is likely never to use the term "#2 RECEIVER" in its game planning. There are going to be plays with one, two and three backs at once, plays with one, two, three and four WR, plays with zero, one and two TE, plays with Evans as the #1 split only with Parrish, split only with SJ, split only with Nelson, Hardy, or Jackson, or any combination. They will be plays with five wide but only two of them WR (Evans and Parrish). There will be plays with three backs, Spiller split wide, and then Freddy in motion wide leaving Lynch behind the line. McIntyre split out against Cinci on Saturday. And when Shawn Nelson returns, it will really get hairy.

 

Chances are that either Evans or Spiller leads the team in receptions (simply because CJ will get a bunch of screens and dumpoffs), and then Roscoe will have the third most even as the #3 WR. The rest will be split IMO almost equally between Freddy, Stupar, Shawn Nelson, Stevie Styles, and then probably Lynch, Hardy and David Nelson (depending on if Hardy makes the team). I would doubt our #2 WR makes more than 25 catches this year because they will be interchangeable. Although if David Nelson gets the nod over SJ< I could imagine him getting quite a few catches.

[H2o]

Who are you referring to? Jackson or Johnson? You lost me. They haven't thrown the ball to Johnson too much and they have been playing well, right? Why rock the boat? Colts game, Johnson runs a crossing route and occupies the safety so Lee is open over the top. Thats one. Bengals game, third down in the 2 minute drill, SJ catches a ball over the middle to keep the drive alive. No penalties for holding on Spiller's long runs as well. What more do you want? More catches? The guy can play and he'll show that during the regular season when he gets more opportunities. It's obvious the coaching staff has confidence in him because he IS the 2nd receiver. You didn't tell me how Chad Jackson/David Nelson would be a better 2nd Receiver. CONVINCE ME!!!

I believe the initials I used were SJ and we haven't been talking about Spencer. We need a guy who's going to be productive opposite Lee, not a guy who will occupy a S in a preseason game. Also, it could've been anyone running the crossing route you speak of, he surely was not biting because they were scared of getting burnt by Steve Johnson. Jackson is better running routes and is better on his cuts that SJ. As for being convinced? Not my job, but if you are not convinced by actual on the field production I can't help you. Like I said, Sam Aiken part deux(slower version of course).

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

I say Nelson starts over Steve Johnson, who over the last 3 years has done absolutely nothing to earn a starting job. True, neither has Nelson, but he's looking very promising right now. Give him a shot.

 

I must be missing your logic here...neither guy has done anything to earn a starting job, so let's just arbitrarily start the rookie for the hell of it?

[Hplarrm]

The WR depth chart means zero. There will be so many combinations of players and formations the other team is likely never to use the term "#2 RECEIVER" in its game planning. There are going to be plays with one, two and three backs at once, plays with one, two, three and four WR, plays with zero, one and two TE, plays with Evans as the #1 split only with Parrish, split only with SJ, split only with Nelson, Hardy, or Jackson, or any combination. They will be plays with five wide but only two of them WR (Evans and Parrish). There will be plays with three backs, Spiller split wide, and then Freddy in motion wide leaving Lynch behind the line. McIntyre split out against Cinci on Saturday. And when Shawn Nelson returns, it will really get hairy.

 

Chances are that either Evans or Spiller leads the team in receptions (simply because CJ will get a bunch of screens and dumpoffs), and then Roscoe will have the third most even as the #3 WR. The rest will be split IMO almost equally between Freddy, Stupar, Shawn Nelson, Stevie Styles, and then probably Lynch, Hardy and David Nelson (depending on if Hardy makes the team). I would doubt our #2 WR makes more than 25 catches this year because they will be interchangeable. Although if David Nelson gets the nod over SJ< I could imagine him getting quite a few catches.

 

Agreed that the traditional depth chart is meaningless (as I have said all along in my Spiller rants the Bills would be stupid if they planned to use Spiller in a role that could be called the #2 as he lines up wide with Evans mirroring the role on the other side and then called him #2 WR on the depth chart).

 

I think it would be stupid for Gailey to call him the #2 WR but it would likely make this O hum if he is actually utilized as a traditional #2 WR in our offense because:

 

1. There is no zero, nada, zippo, a whole number less than one) players on the Bills team whom one could make an objective case (or even a good subjective one as yes Jackson has shown good route running ability and hands in college and as a rookie but regressed statistically last year) for playing as our #2 WR.

 

I am not maintaining that playing Spiller in a role that really amounted to him being the closest thing we have to s #2 WR is a deadlock certainty to work or even that it is a good idea.

 

I simply say that even as a bad idea it has more going for it than suggestions of other players I have heard on TSW.

 

If not use of Spiller in this role how and who do folks see this O working.

 

2. On that point I doubt it works very well at all with the candidates for #2 WR we have. I think that under Jauron and underlings two years ago we saw this demonstrated when Peerless was the #2 and not only had he lost a step from his world class speed, but the Bills O shoehorned him into a traditional possession receiver role which allowed opponents to take Evans out of being a huge factor for the most part (I think he is actually a very good talent but he needs to have a partner WR who stops the opposing DC from simply doubling him).

 

I hope that somehow Jackson reverses his fallen production, Roscoe suddenly proves to be go to guy that we can depend on as a #2, Hardy regains his promise, Nelson proves to be more than a rookie or Easley rises from the temporarily dead. However, I think these are worse choices than even a bad choice of using Spiller as our #2 (though the depth chart should never admit this).

 

3. Some folks above seem to want to bellow that condemning Spiller to WR ties his hands unlike having him as a back-up back-up RB.

 

Huh?

 

Sitting on the bench will tie his hands.

 

The question is how do we get Spiller more touches and at this point with Gailey saying just to day he is the 3rd RB pm the depth chart reserve RB duty is not going to get him into the game. If he lined up virtually every offensive snap as the wideout opposite Evans and only ran the ball on end arounds and a few playes where he actually lined up as an RB this strikes me as a method giving him more runs and touches than lining him up as a traditional RB after we ran Jax and Lynch.

 

I want him to get touches and I think having him play the #2 WR slot would do just that.

[Magox]

I would say the two starting receivers will be Evans and Johnson with Roscoe in the slot.

 

The other two wide receivers that will get playing time will be Chad Jackson and Nelson. My guess is that initially if Johnson were to falter that the first choice to replace him on the depth chart would be Jackson with Nelson being close behind.

 

I believe Hardy will just squeek it out to make it to the final roster and Roosevelt to the practice squad.

[4BillsintheBurgh]

I agree with us keeping only five and using the other spot to cover positions like OT, TE and RB.

 

While reading the thread, I keep hearing - It's a tough game for tough people. I don't think Hardy has shown much toughness judging by his time spent on the sidelines. Not entirely his fault, but it is what it is.

 

Seems to me Evans, Johnson, Parrish and Nelson are in, the question is the fifth spot and that may come down to special teams. I don't know enough about how those receivers have been doing there to make a call on who is the best.

 

I think CJ will be used like Thurman was out of the backfield to catch the ball, but with less carries. I think over the last couple of preseason games Chan has been adjusting CJ's projected number of touches per game up.