Coach55 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I don't want to cut another starting tackle, this time just because he's 'injury prone.' He's arguably the best offensive linemen on the team. We can replace him if we have the opportunity to pick up someone better. This team does not get better by cutting Butler and giving his job to Demetrius Bell any more than it got better by cutting Langston Walker. And what have you seen in Chris Ellis that makes you want to start him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 A rookie QB behind that offensive line... We'd be lucky to win 2 games. I'm all for drafting a QB in the 1st round, but we still gotta go out and get a veteran QB, veteran capable OT's and LB's to compete and get better next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poeticlaw Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? I agree with the cuts with the exception of witner. I disagree with a QB in the first round. I know we need one but I think we go with the best player available Like a MLB/DE/DT/OL go for a QB in the second if necessary we could always rade for one it worked for the texans when they got Mat Schaub who knows Brohm could already be the guy. However in this draft i wouldnt waste a first round pick on a QB we need other positions more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach55 Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 I don't want to cut another starting tackle, this time just because he's 'injury prone.' He's arguably the best offensive linemen on the team. We can replace him if we have the opportunity to pick up someone better. This team does not get better by cutting Butler and giving his job to Demetrius Bell any more than it got better by cutting Langston Walker. And what have you seen in Chris Ellis that makes you want to start him? I am not a huge fan of Ellis, but we need to cleanse the "old mindset" and years of losing ways. Quite honestly, Schobel may have to go as well, but I believe he is a good enough player to overcome the team's losing attitude. There were some other players I want to expunge for that reason as well, but like them too much to put them on this list. I agree that Butler is arguably the best tackle on the team, but he has not made it through a full season. I would rather have a person who has 90% as good, but will be there for the whole season. We have a lot more talent on this line (albeit almost all interior) that people give credit to. We were just decimated with injuries. Between Hangman, Levitre, Wood, Simmons and now, if we keep him, Incognito, we have 5 quality starters for 3 positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 RT - Bell Bell would probably be the smallest, and almost certainly the weakest RT in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Hots Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I agree with the cuts with the exception of witner. I disagree with a QB in the first round. I know we need one but I think we go with the best player available Like a MLB/DE/DT/OL go for a QB in the second if necessary we could always rade for one it worked for the texans when they got Mat Schaub who knows Brohm could already be the guy. However in this draft i wouldnt waste a first round pick on a QB we need other positions more. Agreed. No way we spend our 1st on the a QB. A QB first round pick is too big of a gamble for this team given all the needs we have. We go after one in 2011 draft. While this stinks, I have a feeling that it is going to be at least 2-3 years to get this ship going in the right direction. McClean from Bama to black MLB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? DE and LB look too familiar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, thoughts? Dump Josh Reed and keep James Hardly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBaumer Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 with that lineup - we will have a worse record than this year - dead serious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derf Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derf Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? No way is Jackson a starter. Anyone that beleive this is nuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Cut both our quarterbacks? Start DiGorgio? Cut Butler? Yeah, no. DiGorgio's not even in the league (IIRC) We need OLine depth, and every other team in the league would be happy to have Butler. Cutting both quarterbacks is just stupid, beyond belief. Given these three factors, I've rendered the rest of your post haphazard and pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? Your concept about WR production is well noted. Good/bad or other, the production we are seeing there does not pass for any of the current top 4 bills wideouts, so why not unload them and start grooming the next crop because it just makes no sense to invest $ for less than 160 total rec yards/game. For example, no need to pay 6.5 million/yr for 51 yards/game (TO), 9.8 million for 31 yrds/game (LE), 2 million for reeds 21 yrd/game, $2.5million for parrish 2 catches and punt returns. For that level of production we should not be paying over $20 milllion. In fact it looks like the Bills are by far and away the most expensive group of WR's. In fact based on 2008 data and adding TO, almost twice any other team and over 3 times the average at WR. I was shocked when i started looking at these numbers. Not only are you right on about the other 3, but Maybe lee needs to go too. I know fans like him, as do I, but for $10 million a year the Bills should be paying for the entire reciveing corp and have a couple $million left over for a above average, TE, Linemen or LB. Man this team is mismanaged... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoretalk Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Ok ... I so agree that we need to get rid of some of the losing attitude that has helped lessen the impact of the 12th Man at THE RALPH but Brad Butler is not part of that and if we bring in a coach who has someone like a 'Rusty Jones' to keep the players in proper playing condition maybe we won't lead the lead in the IR list again as we have with THE DICK. The O-Line actually looked good in the first two games of this season before Butler went down. Parrish should have been let go some time ago ... he is just too small and has an attitude issue. He has given us great memories but send him away. I never thought I'd be in the say goodbye to Donte group but watching him closely the last few games has convinced me that he is part of the problem not part of the solution. So ... my line-up QB - Brian Brohm (I agree that we should look for a late round QB with potential but I want to see Brohm) RB - Jackson (A true winner who doesn't deserve to be stuck on a losing team; keep Lynch as the back-up) WR - Evans WR - Johnson (Anyone notice Sam Aikins yesterday? Why don't we let our young guys play at wide-out?) WR - Jenkins (see above ... I just don't get Hardy and think he falls into the Parrish/Witner head-case group; Felton Huggins is another with potential. I keep Josh Reed.) LT - Bell/Scott (a draft pick unless he is a stud will not give us anything better) LG- Levitre (he is our stud and for those suggesting he play LT forget it because his body is not right to play tackle in the NFL and frankly he is doing a great job for a rookie at the guard position) C - Hangartner (yea, he's blown a play or two but he is the best center we have had in a decade and does a good job of keeping this rag tag unit from total collapse, which is not an easy job) RG - Wood (Platoon Simmons??? Who are you kidding ... Simmons is old and injury prone and worth having on the bench with Igcognito but play your star rookie guard and let him develop if he recovers from the broken leg.) RT - Butler Defense (we going to a 3-4?) DE - Schobel DT - Williams (he can teach others about playing with passion) DT - Stroud DE - Kelsay (I have not understood the Kelsay haters because it seems that #90 is always in the mix and it is what stands behind him that leads to our failures against the run) LB - SCRAP THE ENTIRE BUNCH ... ok, seriously ... we need some run stoppers and I don't think that Mitchell gives that to us. It is this group that is responsible for the run gaps and frequently for tight end coverage and guess where we get burned most ... runs and tight end receptions. Poz seems to be coming on during the latter part of this season so I say leave him in the middle and find partners for him on the outside if we stay with the 4-3). Palmer is a potential outsider who has had some big special team hits this year. OLB - Palmer (?) MLB - Poz OLB - Someone who can tackle running backs and who plays disciplined ball. CB - McGee CB- Florence S- Byrd S - Wilson I have said this over and over again ... no team can win with the injuries we have had under Jauron and having the numbers of injuries we have had year after year is reflectice of the coach not just bad luck. Every time a commentator talks about the number of offensive line combinations we have had this year or the number of players/starters on IR I get sick .... Two more weeks ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 You don't cut players unless something better is in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJBuffalo Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 If we blow up this squad in the offseason, they need to clean house and I mean really clean house. This includes dumping people who may not be ready to go just to clean out the regime. Just going to the roster, I think the following people must be gone: Owens - He is not going to want to return. His drops have been painful to watch this season. Reed - Years have gone by where we have heard about his great route running and good run blocking, he is part of the old regime, needs to go. Parrish - His fumbles have killed us one too many times. Fitzpatrick - clearly not the answer, starter or backup Edwards - Did not think I would be saying this, as I am a big fan of his, but he can not win. His head is just shot (I will bite my tongue as he shows up elsewhere and leads them to the playoffs). Butler - His talent is there, but he is too injury prone. If we could trade him for a draft pick, I would do so. Denney/Kelsey - We have spent too many years with this 2 headed monster Whitner - needs to go. There are other fringe players on defense that I would also dump, but most would have some value as backups or spot starters (i.e. Shobel, Ellison.) So next years lineup would look something like this: QB - 1st Round Pick RB - Jackson WR1 - Evans WR2 - Hardy WR3 - Johnson TE - Nelson LT - 2nd Round Pick LG - Levitre C - Hangartner RG - Wood (Simmons platooning) RT - Bell - If we keep Incognito, move Levitre to LT, Wood to LG and Incognito to RG DE - Schobel DT - Williams DT - Stroud DE - Ellis OLB - Poz (yes I am moving him outside) OLB - Mitchell MLB - 3rd Round Pick or DiGiorgio CB - McGee CB - Florence/McKelvin S - Byrd S - Wilson Ideally, I would like to replace Mitchell and Ellis (maybe another year and Maybin will be better?) thoughts? How about addressing some needs in free agency!!! lots of free agent linebackers, i think we should sign 1 maybe 2 starting material LB's. If Digiorgio is opening day starter i will move out of Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 You should still consider moving out of buffalo. It's much better on the outside!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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