Trent Edwards v.s. Jay Cutler

[PushthePile]

You my friend are one of the nicest fellas on the board.

Thanks Dog you too

[evilbuffalobob]

Just throwing it out there... but maybe our receivers who suck the most? Maybe it's the WR's who never get open, and therefore make Trentative look like himself. Maybe the fact that our WRs fail to block well and/or finish blocks is the cause for a poor running game, which therefore puts more pressure on the WRs to get open?

 

Something I notice in just about every game is our opposing teams WRs and TEs ALWAYS getting open (drastically and quickly) 15-30 yards down the middle of the field.

 

WE-NEVER-DO-THAT. Why?

[BADOLBILZ]

This subject was all the rage in the preseason, and it nearly split TSW apart at the seams. Posters argued with such fury and passion you would think Cutler was on the team. I personally was at the heart of the argument and in the Cutler camp. It was a crazy time period with TO, Cutler, Peters, and hope.

 

....now that the dust has settled. I'd like to be the first to say I was wrong. They both suck.

 

Edwards in no way warrants mention in the same breath with any QB who has put up 4000 yards in a season. Cutler may be enigmatic and turn out to be a latter day Jeff George, but Edwards isn't even good enough to be a laughingstock like Rob Johnson. He's a QB who does not produce TD's, or wins, or feats of durability or grit, or yards or good decisions.......he's utterly irrelevant. I don't know if Edwards will ever make an impact of any kind in the league, but at this point he's literally done nothing of note whatsoever.

[FreakPop]

Edwards in no way warrants mention in the same breath with any QB who has put up 4000 yards in a season. Cutler may be enigmatic and turn out to be a latter day Jeff George, but Edwards isn't even good enough to be a laughingstock like Rob Johnson. He's a QB who does not produce TD's, or wins, or feats of durability or grit, or yards or good decisions.......he's utterly irrelevant. I don't know if Edwards will ever make an impact of any kind in the league, but at this point he's literally done nothing of note whatsoever.

 

I agree

[The Big Cat]

Edwards in no way warrants mention in the same breath with any QB who has put up 4000 yards in a season. Cutler may be enigmatic and turn out to be a latter day Jeff George, but Edwards isn't even good enough to be a laughingstock like Rob Johnson. He's a QB who does not produce TD's, or wins, or feats of durability or grit, or yards or good decisions.......he's utterly irrelevant. I don't know if Edwards will ever make an impact of any kind in the league, but at this point he's literally done nothing of note whatsoever.

 

Every word of this is true.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Every word of this is true.

Which makes you a total hypocrite as you chastise other posters for being critical of their team.

[The Big Cat]

Which makes you a total hypocrite as you chastise other posters for being critical of their team.

 

Nope, it doesn't.

 

EDIT: Let me elaborate. Yours is at least a critical critique of the coaching staff. I can't say the same for most others who just log on to start screaming FIRE JAURON.

 

We see what Edwards does when he takes the field. We see the outcomes of every play he's involved with and for him, and any other player it's right or wrong, pass or fail on any given play or assignment.

 

The same CANNOT be said for the coaching staff, or even the front office for that matter. They don't "perform" in the same sense players do, and there's no way for any of us fans to know what happens behind closed doors and in the practice setting where the coach does the vast majority of his job.

 

We can, however, see what takes place when a player does his job (they are, after all, called PLAYers), and therefore one can be a bit more black and white with his critique.

 

Edwards, like all other players earns and makes statistics. A coach does not make statistics. Statistics don't tell the whole tale, but they certainly tell a tale, especially Trent's. A win-loss record is not a coach's stat. It's a team's stat.

 

To critique a player and a coach with the same set of limited knowledge we all have (based on media coverage and game footage) is downright silly.

 

Someone here said it perfectly. Jauron's a good coach, but he's not a successful one. The two don't always go hand-in-hand. If you argue to the contrary, you likely didn't play many sports.

[bizell]

His absence has really hurt Denver.

The appearance of Denver's defense being top-5 instead of bottom-3 has more to do with Denver winning than anything else.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Nope, it doesn't.

 

EDIT: Let me elaborate. Yours is at least a critical critique of the coaching staff. I can't say the same for most others who just log on to start screaming FIRE JAURON.

 

We see what Edwards does when he takes the field. We see the outcomes of every play he's involved with and for him, and any other player it's right or wrong, pass or fail on any given play or assignment.

 

The same CANNOT be said for the coaching staff, or even the front office for that matter. They don't "perform" in the same sense players do, and there's no way for any of us fans to know what happens behind closed doors and in the practice setting where the coach does the vast majority of his job.

 

We can, however, see what takes place when a player does his job (they are, after all, called PLAYers), and therefore one can be a bit more black and white with his critique.

 

Edwards, like all other players earns and makes statistics. A coach does not make statistics. Statistics don't tell the whole tale, but they certainly tell a tale, especially Trent's. A win-loss record is not a coach's stat. It's a team's stat.

 

To critique a player and a coach with the same set of limited knowledge we all have (based on media coverage and game footage) is downright silly.

 

Someone here said it perfectly. Jauron's a good coach, but he's not a successful one. The two don't always go hand-in-hand. If you argue to the contrary, you likely didn't play many sports.

Actually, it does make you a hypocrite. You've been dogging around behind my posts for over a year now trying to counter my football arguments with ad hominem attacks, straw men, incorrect over generalizations, and by making **** up out of thin air -- "you likely didn't play sports". WTF? You don't know me from Adam. Posting nonsense like that says a lot more about you as a person than it does me, especially since it is factually ignorant.

 

As a fan that's been on this board since the beginning, I have every right to be critical of management, coaching, and players. I have every right to applaud when things work out. And, I believe you do to. But, going around trying to lecture other fans about how to be a "true fan" is assholic. Especially, when you are a hypocrite and make criticisms yourself. WTF makes you so self-important that you are allowed to criticize this team whereas you tell others they cannot and even grant yourself the authority to tell other fans that they cannot be critical?

 

I strive to talk about football and this post is an exception to the rule. I avoid these puerile exchanges of misplaced and misdirected anger. If you want to be pissed off at something, be pissed off that your team sucks and put a cork in it rather than pissing on other fans.

 

Look, I assume you are a nice person and a die-hard Bills fan. Applaud or criticize the team as much or as little as you want. Capiche?

[wnyguy]

So like 'Italian beef' on Weck and then Roast beef on Italian-style roll ? MMMMMM.... beef on Weck

 

 

Now that was pretty danged funny.

[Sisyphean Bills]

EDIT: Let me elaborate. Yours is at least a critical critique of the coaching staff. I can't say the same for most others who just log on to start screaming FIRE JAURON.

 

The same CANNOT be said for the coaching staff, or even the front office for that matter. They don't "perform" in the same sense players do, and there's no way for any of us fans to know what happens behind closed doors and in the practice setting where the coach does the vast majority of his job.

As far as defending Jauron and his work, I defend your right to do so. I think you are preaching to an empty room at this point, but by all means, that is your prerogative.

 

My criticism of him the past 3.5 seasons and the way he "re-built" this team has been more than amply supported by his record and the regression of this team in all phases. I totally disagree with you that you cannot tell if a coach is performing well or not as his record and the progress of the team under his leadership are publicly displayed. Jauron has been a head coach in the NFL almost as long as Vince Lombardi was. The difference is overtly obvious, and any hopes that he'll "turn it around" are pinned on eventual disappointment.

[Poeticlaw]

This subject was all the rage in the preseason, and it nearly split TSW apart at the seams. Posters argued with such fury and passion you would think Cutler was on the team. I personally was at the heart of the argument and in the Cutler camp. It was a crazy time period with TO, Cutler, Peters, and hope.

 

....now that the dust has settled. I'd like to be the first to say I was wrong. They both suck.

 

 

Are you taking into account what Cutler could have done with this receieving core which is alot more talented then his reciveing core.

 

Cutler would be putting up some stats here and the offense wouldnt look so atrocious.

[Magox]

The appearance of Denver's defense being top-5 instead of bottom-3 has more to do with Denver winning than anything else.

you're right. Forget about the fact that Orton has a 95.5 QB rating with 9 TD's and 1 INT, and that Cutler has a 80.8 rating with 11 TD's and 11 Int's. Oh and lets not forget that he had a 85 QB rating last year and also wasn't able to beat teams with winning records.

 

But that guy Orton, he's just lucky, defenses always carry his team

[The Big Cat]

Actually, it does make you a hypocrite. You've been dogging around behind my posts for over a year now trying to counter my football arguments with ad hominem attacks, straw men, incorrect over generalizations, and by making **** up out of thin air -- "you likely didn't play sports". WTF? You don't know me from Adam. Posting nonsense like that says a lot more about you as a person than it does me, especially since it is factually ignorant.

 

As a fan that's been on this board since the beginning, I have every right to be critical of management, coaching, and players. I have every right to applaud when things work out. And, I believe you do to. But, going around trying to lecture other fans about how to be a "true fan" is assholic. Especially, when you are a hypocrite and make criticisms yourself. WTF makes you so self-important that you are allowed to criticize this team whereas you tell others they cannot and even grant yourself the authority to tell other fans that they cannot be critical?

 

I strive to talk about football and this post is an exception to the rule. I avoid these puerile exchanges of misplaced and misdirected anger. If you want to be pissed off at something, be pissed off that your team sucks and put a cork in it rather than pissing on other fans.

 

Look, I assume you are a nice person and a die-hard Bills fan. Applaud or criticize the team as much or as little as you want. Capiche?

 

I take issue with you calling me a hypocrite because all along I've said that the product on the field is more a reflection of the players than the coaches.

 

It's a chicken v egg argument that you and I will just have to agree to disagree on.

 

You're completely within your own right to be negative about everything, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to find an instance where I questioned your fandom as a result. Implied that your negativity gets tired? Most certainly. Said you're not a true fan, not so much.

[Alphadawg7]

Edwards in no way warrants mention in the same breath with any QB who has put up 4000 yards in a season. Cutler may be enigmatic and turn out to be a latter day Jeff George, but Edwards isn't even good enough to be a laughingstock like Rob Johnson. He's a QB who does not produce TD's, or wins, or feats of durability or grit, or yards or good decisions.......he's utterly irrelevant. I don't know if Edwards will ever make an impact of any kind in the league, but at this point he's literally done nothing of note whatsoever.

 

^^^What he said^^^

 

[grelit]

I would love to see a Buffalo Bills QB (whether it is Edwards or anyone else) play behind a good offensive line. It has been years since we had a good offensive line. I don't care who you put back there, we need a good line. It all starts up front.

 

P.S. You can have Cutler.

 

 

In this day in age, there is no such thing as a perfect offensive line. With the turn over in Free agency you have to make the best of what you have. Look at the Colts, Steelers and Packers O lines. They are not great by any means, but they have a quarterback that makes plays. You could have any line in football in front of Trent, bottom line that he is no adequate on the NFL level to be a starter. You said its been years since we had a good offensive line...I say its been years since we had a quarterback as well. Edwards had "the best left tackle in football" the last two seasons and it still didn't help. I am done making excuses for him and officially of the Edwards bandwagon.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I would kind of summarize it this way, Trents not THE problem, but he is not ______(good, smart, passionate, talented, mentally tough, strong, or what ever other adjuictive) enough to be THE solution.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

This subject was all the rage in the preseason, and it nearly split TSW apart at the seams. Posters argued with such fury and passion you would think Cutler was on the team. I personally was at the heart of the argument and in the Cutler camp. It was a crazy time period with TO, Cutler, Peters, and hope.

 

....now that the dust has settled. I'd like to be the first to say I was wrong. They both suck.

 

I've been saying Jay Cutler sucks for over 2 seasons!!!

 

How does Rex Gross-man who sucked in Chi-town look so GREAT in Denver?

[SuperKillerRobots]

Edwards sucks way more. I would take Cutler over Edwards 100% of the time.

 

Cutler has no receivers in Chicago and Trent has great ones. Imagine if the rolls were reversed Cutler would have monster numbers throwing to Evans and TO and Edwards would be worse if that's possible.

 

Not in our offense he wouldn't.

[Fingon]

Cutler has never been an above average QB, even when he had all that talent around him in Denver. I would take him over Edwards, but i would NOT trade two 1st round picks for him.

 

 

Cutler= Jeff George 2.0