Kirby Jackson

Nope, they are irrelevant. KC is the biggest rival now. Miami is the most hated other than potentially KC.

I’m struggling with how anyone could argue that he was more impactful than Lamar?

Who said he was a backup? That’s insanity. It’s equally insane to believe that he would be a top 3 guy in this elite QB era. He wasn’t a top 3 guy in his era (Marino, Elway, Montana). Anywhere in 4-12 feels okay. I really don’t know the question that I’m asking. I guess that it is, “20 years from now, a young fan asks someone that is 70, and would have seen both primes, which one was better?” I think you did a nice job laying it out.

Who is the better QB historically Jim Kelly or Matt Stafford? I don’t know the right answer but it feels interesting.

This is a tough question. I voted Dawkins because I think that the OL has been the 2nd best player on the team. More specifically, the tackles have been elite. I picked the guy responsible for Josh’s blindside.

He’s definitely not top 3. He wasn’t top 3 when he played. I think anywhere from 4-12 is probably fine. He would be in the tier with Hurts, Goff, Stafford, Baker. Kelly was the steward of a great offense and a guy that you won a lot with. You win because of Allen, Jackson and Mahomes. The next tier has guys that can carry their teams but not every week. Its hard to compare eras but it feels like he would fall outside of the top tier and then it becomes personal preference.

They’ve tried to sell us on that over the last few years. I realize Raiola is a freshman but think that we are at 3,000+ days since a ranked win. Basically 8+ years without beating a ranked team. They’ve lost 27 consecutive games vs. ranked opponents!! Only 1 power 5 team has a longer streak, Rutgers. Maybe they just aren’t going to be good again?

Perfectly said!! Ironically, if there is a play on 3rd down and we need to force it to a WR, it’s the guy that they traded for. He didn’t have a target this week but did have 14 the week before. He’s probably the guy that they are most comfortable “winning” his matchup. These guys have all played fine. Hollins has blocked well and made some tough/clutch catches. Shakir has developed into a rich man’s Beasley with his ability to run after the catch. Coleman has flashed. His strengths coming out have been his strengths and his weaknesses coming out have been his weaknesses. The Cooper addition was big and it will play dividends. He’s a consummate pro. He can get open and make plays down the field. He can explode in any given game. Samuel was always going to be a gadget guy. That’s fine if they knew how to use him. Throw the ball down the field to him. Use misdirection. Get him in space. Don’t just throw WR screens to him. As a whole @Buffalo_Stampede hit the nail on the head. It is working. I’ve enjoyed this last season of Joe Brady as OC. The offense has been excellent.

See above. In a nutshell, Kelly was a 5 time Pro Bowl player that went to 4 Super Bowls. He was a steward of some of the greatest offenses in history. Goff is 30 and about to be a 4 time Pro Bowl player with potentially his 2nd Super Bowl appearance. By next year, Goff’s numbers for his career will all surpass Kelly’s. Now, it would be foolish to not take into account the era. Obviously gross numbers now are going to surpass that of the past. Both guys have won and distributed the ball to elite playmakers. Kelly is a better player historically than Goff. If (big if) Goff plays 5 more years and goes to 2 more Super Bowls, that discussion will be a little uncomfortable for some. The point was that Kelly was never the best QB in the league. He was never in that discussion by people other than Bills fans. He was in the discussion with guys like Aikman and Moon. The guys that come just after the top tier, almost exactly like one would view Hurts or Goff now. I don’t want to derail this thread by making it a Kelly conversation. He was left off the list because there isn’t a reasonable argument to be made that he was one of the 3 best football players to play for the Bills. If the conversation was the “3 most important players to play for the Bills” he would definitely be on there. Those 2 things aren’t interchangeable though.

Kelly is a very important Bill. There’s no doubt. He was the steward of the greatest run in franchise history. He might not have been one of the 4 best players on those teams. Bruce, Thurman and Andre were better players for sure. You could make an argument, talent wise, that Bennett was as well. By the nature of him being a QB, he was important. I actually think that the Goff or Hurts comparison is quite fair. Their teams are winning a lot. They’ve each been to the Super Bowl and could go again. They are Pro Bowl QBs. No one considers them the best QB in the league though. That’s who Kelly was. If we put our fond memories of that era aside, and look at it objectively, that was kind of who he was. He was more like Troy Aikman than he was like Josh Allen. The gap from Allen to Kelly is already pretty wide (even Kelly would admit that). It’s only going to grow over the next decade. Lol, I don’t mean it as an insult. I mean it as a “pump the brakes.” Those guys are good. Those guys will be WOF players for their respective franchises. With continued team success, they each will have a shot at the HOF. Feel free to substitute Aikman, Fouts or Moon.

No he shouldn’t. He was very intentionally left off the list. He was great. The idea of Jim Kelly is much better than the player. He was a great player in his era. He was, in his era, what Goff or Hurts is now. He was a pro bowl guy but never once considered the “best in the business.” He won a lot. He belongs in the HOF. He’s a top 25ish all-time QB. As a player, he is not in the conversation with those 3. Honestly, there are multiple guys that are between 3 and Kelly.

I can accept that. OJ was before my time but he was historically great. He was doing things that others weren’t. I think that all 3 answers are reasonable. There’s a case to be made for each. No one else belongs in the conversation.

Kelly was the steward of a great offense. He had pro bowlers and HOFers everywhere. He was the QB of that team but he’s not Allen. If you put Allen on those teams they win multiple. He’s WAY more dominant.

This sucks if so

Jim Kelly doesn’t belong near the list. OJ had 2,000 yards in 14 games. He was historically great. Kelly was historically good. He’s probably a top 25ish QB ever. He’s not a viable answer for the best player to wear a Bills uniform.

They were fine and have been pretty good. They still had 9/111/1 of the 362 passing yards. Shakir was the only WR with more than 1 catch. This conversation was about the wide receivers and not the pass catchers. The receivers have been fine but they are still just okay.

I had Bruce as 1 until about the middle of the season. The positional value of QB is too great. Bruce was ridiculous but for me, it’s Allen.

We are doing this. Who is the best player that the Bills have ever had? Go on record. You can make a case for any of the 3. The “someone else” answer is not reasonable but there for the people who choose to be wrong. The Bills have had great players but there are 3 options as to the “best.”

Allen Brady OL All 3 RBs Ed Oliver

Usually these individual awards are cool but don’t mean much. I don’t look back at Cam or Matt Ryan’s MVP awards & think differently of them because of them. It’ll be different for Allen. So many people thought he’d flop pre-draft that they’ve stuck to their guns. They’ve refused to admit to their mistakes & have spent his career looking to trash him. “Diggs made him.” “He’s a turnover machine.” Hell, even a small group of his peers, voted him the most overrated player in the league. All of this is taking place as he assaults the record book & carries a mediocre roster to Super Bowl contention. This award will give, undeniable validation, to the best player to ever put on a Bills uniform (with all due respect to Bruce).

The Bills are elite at giving teams a chance.

Thought that the Bills would win by 2 scores. This has been impressive. There’s some stuff to clean up but it’s a physical beating. The Bills are really, really good.

Another McDermott masterclass at clock management. He’s incompetent. That’s impossible to take the run off if you planned on trying to score. The order of plays that you should have run there: 1. FG 2. Hail Mary Last anything else (that was the Peterman scramble all over)