yall

I liked him more because I thought he had less of a tendancy to pander. Color me misinformed: http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/375071.aspx

Dude, its Ruben Navarrete. He's lame and his logic is lame. Everyone who has an opinion on immigration other than full amnesty is a total racist in his mind. Also, notice how he mentions black people vote for Obama, but white people vote against him, instead of saying they are voting for Clinton. Keep in mind Clinton was fully ordained as the Dem candidate in many people's minds before Obama came along. So by them sticking to their original horse (look no further than PastaJoe) they are obviously racist.

Damn straight. When I get a tan my productivity plummets.

I guess you have never been to a Hardy family picnic, have you?

It certainly came close. I think what saved it for me was how well the did the crash. That was a pretty realistic scene. Other than that I thought the whole "wow look at me I'm bleeding from my ear and I'm still smarter than you" combined with the "look at me OD on alzheimers drugs and die, but then come back from the brink with the answer" was pretty much nonsense. Hell yeah - her a$$ was incredible.

Your example shows that the innocents are slowly being cleared. We may not like the timeline, certainly the process should be sped up within reason. But I still doubt there is torture and a total suspension of habeas corpus if people are eventually being released.

This is a lot to respond to all at once, but I'll just take on the first article for now The subject of the article admitted to delivering the explosives that killed innocent people. He admitted to attending an AQ training cap for "self defense purposes". He also admitted to helping AQ operatives obtain fake passports and cross boarders illegally. Doesn't sound like much of a problem to me to hold him indefinitely. From the article you linked: "Ghailani, a Tanzanian, is suspected of buying the Nissan truck used to deliver the bomb, supplying the TNT and detonators, and later running a document forgery office for Al Qaeda in Afghanistan. He was arrested after a gunbattle in Gujrat in eastern Pakistan in July 2004." In his own words: "At times speaking in English, Ghailani said he went to an al-Qaida training camp in Afghanistan after the bombing, because he wanted military training for self-defense." Again his words:"Ghailani said he later he worked for Al Qaeda in Pakistan providing passports and documents to help them get across borders" I'm not feeling too bad for this guy if he knowingly worked with a known terror organization and then later admitted it, and now regrets it because he is locked up.

Yeah - I'm just trying to display my super-awesome level of reading comprehension.

Didn't the wiki entry (I know, I know ) also state there was no evidence of sexual assualt?

FYI - She denies this.

Wasn't this on the 190 last night?

Godamit Sketch - you stole my idea!

I might just put the word 'Hitler' in my sig, that way every thread I post in will be insta-Godwin'd.

I'm not sure what is funnier, the comment from ieatcrayonz, or the fact that you made this thread, and then took a crap in it.

Post of the year candidate.

I am and will at least see if any of therm are in the library. I may take extreme positions on the subject matter when arguing on the internet, but many times it's simply to elicit a response for a wide variety of opinions.

I ran into him on Saturday, looked pretty good.

Buy 'em and have them shipped and I will gladly read them. Edit: And have you actually read those books, or are you just linking them? Just reading the descriptions from one of the books, the author mentions that the people in organizations like Hamas, etc, mostly aren't religious. That doesn't seem to be the case with the detainees. I don't necesarily disagree with the notion that suicide bombing is (in the eyes of a would be bomber) a tactic rather than some easy way to paradise in their eyes. Certainly Saddam was secular, and not very pious, and he helped fund suicide attacks. Again though, all I've really said in this thread is that if there is some evidence that these guys in Gitmo are 'bad' I have no problem detaining them. And I don't consider that a violation of human rights. And do we actually have verifiable proof that the only way to get a trial/tribunal is to plead guitly?

I would say that I wasn't the one who made that argument.

It says "FIGHTS AT THE RALPH" not "FIGHTS AT THE SKYDOME" The original post was not talking about games in Toronto.

It seemed like you were justifying the efforts of those who oppose the existence of Israel based upon their religious claim, and I was just pointing out the Jews have just as valid a claim. Sorry if I misconstrued your meaning. Yes. We have been best freinds for years and lived together. He refers to me as his 'uncle' because he is a few years younger and I took him under my wing at college. I trust him implicitly. I never made (in this thread anyway) any sweeping generalizations about muslims or their support or dislike for terrorism. I merely referred to those who are currently detainees. I have also (3 times now?) stated that there should be tribunals. I think what I did not do well was clearly state my thoughts on the situation. I'm ok with holding the indefinite detention of people who are committed to being violent. I would like sufficient proof that someone falls into this category and this should be done in a timely manner. Based upon that, as long as the govt follows the same logic (and I can't say with certainty that they are) I do not believe that constitutes a human rights violation

Great article. Thanks!

I don't know that we are really that far off on the 'basics'. I have stated (twice I think) that i support tribunals for those incarcerated at Gitmo. I don't think I have advocated that anyone be tortured or that we continue to hold those who are obviously innocent. Primarily, where we seem to differ is on the impact of Gitmo on the hearts and minds of people around the world. I tend to think it's in the negligible range, and you and some other posters seem to think it's much higher.

Riveting exchange.

Yes - ha ha irony. Thanks Alanis. I was hoping you had something more specific than "laws and principles" especially since both can change.