jahbonas Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Great moves made by Ralph: Fires Head Coach Saban who brought him 1st success 1966 Fires /Saban leaves after bringing success a 2nd time in OJ era 1976 Allows allpro Ahmad Rashad to leave for Vikings over 15k 1976 Allows #1 pick Tom Cousineau to go to CFL 1979 Cousineau leaving paved the road for Knox leaving to Seattle where he won division champs 1982 Allows 4 time All pro Joe Cribbs to leave for USFL 1983 Fires Bill Polian where he brought Superbowl to Indy 1992 Fires John Butler where he built San Diego Chargers 1999 It can be argued only the following guys brought Wislon success in his 50 years Lou Saban (twice) Chuck Knox Bill Polian John Butler - continued blueprint created by Polian He fired or forced those guys to look elsewhere... Inbetween these guys his organizations were worst in football After Saban 1 NFL worst team in 1969 NFL worst in 1972 After Knox departs NFL worst in 1984 NFL worst in 1985 After Polian/Butler gone 2001-present 10 years of no playoffs...and where is Indy & SanDiego? Compare this non-appreciation for men who bring you success to what is done in Pittsburgh!!! The ONLY justification for his HOF induction is if he guarantees the existence of a NFL team in a small market like Buffalo However even now at 90yrs old he cannot publicly give us that assurance How great would his HOF speach have been if he used that platform to announce to all that he had somehow put a plan in place that will keep the team in Buffalo long after he is gone? t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 I will replace the word Jauron with Ralph and the number 4 with 3 and what do I get? It's about time that we saw another Ralph thread, it's been at least what? 3 hours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Philster Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Couple of corrections to make SABAN was NEVER FIRED BY THE BILLS! Every Bills fan knows he quit on his own both times Also, Butler refused to negotiate a new contract with Ralph and there was speculation at the time that he had already talked to the Chargers while under contract to the Bills. As far as why he was inducted into the HOF, apparently you slept through the inductions...because the NFL wouldn't be the top sports league in the world were it not for Ralph's contributions, many of which were brought up when he was inducted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Couple of corrections to makeSABAN was NEVER FIRED BY THE BILLS! Every Bills fan knows he quit on his own both times Also, Butler refused to negotiate a new contract with Ralph and there was speculation at the time that he had already talked to the Chargers while under contract to the Bills. As far as why he was inducted into the HOF, apparently you slept through the inductions...because the NFL wouldn't be the top sports league in the world were it not for Ralph's contributions, many of which were brought up when he was inducted. Right. he was inducted for his contributions to the NFL, not his combined record and an NFL owner. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChevyVanMiller Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Great moves made by Ralph: It can be argued only the following guys brought Wislon success in his 50 years Lou Saban (twice) Chuck Knox Bill Polian John Butler - continued blueprint created by Polian Marv Levy????????????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotwing Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Marv Levy????????????????????????? Beat me to it, guess he never heard of Marv Levy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwws9999 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Couple of corrections to makeSABAN was NEVER FIRED BY THE BILLS! Every Bills fan knows he quit on his own both times Also, Butler refused to negotiate a new contract with Ralph and there was speculation at the time that he had already talked to the Chargers while under contract to the Bills. As far as why he was inducted into the HOF, apparently you slept through the inductions...because the NFL wouldn't be the top sports league in the world were it not for Ralph's contributions, many of which were brought up when he was inducted. Saban and Butler both quit because Ralph was a jerk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwws9999 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Couple of corrections to makeSABAN was NEVER FIRED BY THE BILLS! Every Bills fan knows he quit on his own both times Also, Butler refused to negotiate a new contract with Ralph and there was speculation at the time that he had already talked to the Chargers while under contract to the Bills. As far as why he was inducted into the HOF, apparently you slept through the inductions...because the NFL wouldn't be the top sports league in the world were it not for Ralph's contributions, many of which were brought up when he was inducted. So did Knox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwws9999 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Couple of corrections to makeSABAN was NEVER FIRED BY THE BILLS! Every Bills fan knows he quit on his own both times Also, Butler refused to negotiate a new contract with Ralph and there was speculation at the time that he had already talked to the Chargers while under contract to the Bills. As far as why he was inducted into the HOF, apparently you slept through the inductions...because the NFL wouldn't be the top sports league in the world were it not for Ralph's contributions, many of which were brought up when he was inducted. the NFL would have been just fine without Ralph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 the NFL would have been just fine without Ralph That is just horsesh*t, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwws9999 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 That is just horsesh*t, sorry. no it's not, the nfl was established long before ralph got there, and the afl merger would have happened either way. he got lucky and was in the right place at the right time. and he still manages to screw it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjamin Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 I'm not sure I'd go with the majority of the post, but I too was really hoping that Ralph would use the HoF speech to unveil a plan for keeping the Bills in WNY. (I know that they are grandfathered in over the rule of having more than a certain amount of owners, but could you imagine if Ralph set up ownership for Buffalo the way it is in Green Bay?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 That is just horsesh*t, sorry. Agreed. To my recolection the NFL needed all 8 teams and if it werent for the Bills, and Ralph fronting Al Davis $400K that would have broken the deal. Im too young to know this. But thought I read that once. Someone please school me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwws9999 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Agreed. To my recolection the NFL needed all 8 teams and if it werent for the Bills, and Ralph fronting Al Davis $400K that would have broken the deal. Im too young to know this. But thought I read that once. Someone please school me. good for al davis, but irrelevant for the nfl. would have happened either way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahbonas Posted August 31, 2009 Author Share Posted August 31, 2009 Marv Levy????????????????????????? What did Levy ever do before Buffalo? Before he was allowed to coach the great talent provided by Polian & Butler. The success of the 1990s was not the coaching staff - it was clearly the scouts and GM's. Time has shown this to be more true as we saw no success before/after of the coaches and have seen great success of the GM's and scouts. Levy rode secretariat and came in 2nd !!! He was great at 1 thing...brown nosing to Mr Wilson and always be sure to get along with him Saban & knox were far better coaches . Knox brought division championships to the Rams before the Bills and did so to Seattle afterwards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stenbar Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 good for al davis, but irrelevant for the nfl. would have happened either way Some other owner woulda ponied up the cash.. Ralph in the HOF is a a joke..Shoulda never happened..He should be more than judged on the ownership of his own franchise first and foremost and that record is abysmal..Bill Bidwell is next I suppose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Agreed. To my recolection the NFL needed all 8 teams and if it werent for the Bills, and Ralph fronting Al Davis $400K that would have broken the deal. Im too young to know this. But thought I read that once. Someone please school me. He was protecting his investment. We all try to do that. It was a good bet and paid off handsomely but it's hardly heroic. Many of the guys in the HOF qualify as heros but Ralph...not so much. BTW jahbonas, love the "riding secretariat to second "metaphor but I think it's misapplied here. Levy was a great coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VJ91 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Great moves made by Ralph: Fires Head Coach Saban who brought him 1st success 1966 Fires /Saban leaves after bringing success a 2nd time in OJ era 1976 Allows allpro Ahmad Rashad to leave for Vikings over 15k 1976 Allows #1 pick Tom Cousineau to go to CFL 1979 Cousineau leaving paved the road for Knox leaving to Seattle where he won division champs 1982 Allows 4 time All pro Joe Cribbs to leave for USFL 1983 Fires Bill Polian where he brought Superbowl to Indy 1992 Fires John Butler where he built San Diego Chargers 1999 It can be argued only the following guys brought Wislon success in his 50 years Lou Saban (twice) Chuck Knox Bill Polian John Butler - continued blueprint created by Polian He fired or forced those guys to look elsewhere... Inbetween these guys his organizations were worst in football After Saban 1 NFL worst team in 1969 NFL worst in 1972 After Knox departs NFL worst in 1984 NFL worst in 1985 After Polian/Butler gone 2001-present 10 years of no playoffs...and where is Indy & SanDiego? Compare this non-appreciation for men who bring you success to what is done in Pittsburgh!!! The ONLY justification for his HOF induction is if he guarantees the existence of a NFL team in a small market like Buffalo However even now at 90yrs old he cannot publicly give us that assurance How great would his HOF speach have been if he used that platform to announce to all that he had somehow put a plan in place that will keep the team in Buffalo long after he is gone? Excellent post, and hard to argue any of those points. However, here are the fans of NFL teams that wish they could replace their history with the exact history of ours in Buffalo you listed above: 1) The Detroit Lions under the Ford family. 2) The New Orleans Saints under whoever and then that screwball car dealer that used to dance around with that stupid hat after the Saints won a few games years ago - Bentson I think? After over 40 years, still 0-0 in SB's. 3) Despite their amazing run in last years' playoffs, Bidwell's Cardinal fans would absolutely have loved to trade their history with ours over the last 50 years, both the fans in St. Louis and Arizona. 4) The Cleveland Browns from 1965 on, under scum bag Modell and then the Lerner family. 5) The Tenessee Titans fans, since they have only been to one SB and lost it, and of course their Houston fans before them, under Bud Adams who regularly lost to our Bills in the playoffs. 6) Possibly the Chargers fans??...They have had their share of lousy losing seasons over their long history, and also have never won a SB either, with a 0-1 record. (Playing in 4 straight is still better then playing and losing just one, right?) So although the Bills overall history is in the bottom third of NFL teams, we can always point to other fans in the NFL that have had it worse then us over 40 to 50 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Excellent post, and hard to argue any of those points. However, here are the fans of NFL teams that wish they could replace their history with the exact history of ours in Buffalo you listed above: 1) The Detroit Lions under the Ford family. 2) The New Orleans Saints under whoever and then that screwball car dealer that used to dance around with that stupid hat after the Saints won a few games years ago - Bentson I think? After over 40 years, still 0-0 in SB's. 3) Despite their amazing run in last years' playoffs, Bidwell's Cardinal fans would absolutely have loved to trade their history with ours over the last 50 years, both the fans in St. Louis and Arizona. 4) The Cleveland Browns from 1965 on, under scum bag Modell and then the Lerner family. 5) The Tenessee Titans fans, since they have only been to one SB and lost it, and of course their Houston fans before them, under Bud Adams who regularly lost to our Bills in the playoffs. 6) Possibly the Chargers fans??...They have had their share of lousy losing seasons over their long history, and also have never won a SB either, with a 0-1 record. (Playing in 4 straight is still better then playing and losing just one, right?) So although the Bills overall history is in the bottom third of NFL teams, we can always point to other fans in the NFL that have had it worse then us over 40 to 50 years. I just can't feel bad for the Titans fans. I was at the "miracle in music city" game, and while the titans fans were very hospitable (and some there were actual original Oilers fans) the memory makes sympathy impossible. I think that one play, more than makes up for all the AFL wins over them. Plus, Nashville is a great city (if the bills are decent at all this year, consider going to the Titans game-check out the honky tonk country music bars the night before the game). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Great moves made by Ralph: Fires Head Coach Saban who brought him 1st success 1966 Fires /Saban leaves after bringing success a 2nd time in OJ era 1976 Allows allpro Ahmad Rashad to leave for Vikings over 15k 1976 Allows #1 pick Tom Cousineau to go to CFL 1979 Cousineau leaving paved the road for Knox leaving to Seattle where he won division champs 1982 Allows 4 time All pro Joe Cribbs to leave for USFL 1983 Fires Bill Polian where he brought Superbowl to Indy 1992 Fires John Butler where he built San Diego Chargers 1999 It can be argued only the following guys brought Wislon success in his 50 years Lou Saban (twice) Chuck Knox Bill Polian John Butler - continued blueprint created by Polian He fired or forced those guys to look elsewhere... Inbetween these guys his organizations were worst in football After Saban 1 NFL worst team in 1969 NFL worst in 1972 After Knox departs NFL worst in 1984 NFL worst in 1985 After Polian/Butler gone 2001-present 10 years of no playoffs...and where is Indy & SanDiego? Compare this non-appreciation for men who bring you success to what is done in Pittsburgh!!! The ONLY justification for his HOF induction is if he guarantees the existence of a NFL team in a small market like Buffalo However even now at 90yrs old he cannot publicly give us that assurance How great would his HOF speach have been if he used that platform to announce to all that he had somehow put a plan in place that will keep the team in Buffalo long after he is gone? t everyone has the right to their opinion, but some of your proported "facts" are off or misleading, thus stunting the thrust of your point. Butler, who was "fired" in December 2000, was fired because he refused to commit to a new contract and it was widely rumored that he was going to jump ship and go to San Diego anyway. Mr. Wilson wanted to re-sign Butler, but Butler refused to negotiate. "The ONLY justification for his HOF induction ..." i think not. you overlook numerous contributions, from his role in helping negotiate the framework of what proved to be the eventual AFL-NFL merger, and how it included the very important revenue-sharing clause. it was at Mr. Wilson's urging that the AFL negotiated a TV contract that allowed each team a $900,000 cut that caught the NFL off guard, and made the AFL a league to be reckoned with, thus forcing the merger. Mr. Wilson's role on numerous influential committees helped form the game that is being played today and also averted a major labor dispute in 1977, that could have set the league back by decades. i think you discount the role Mr. Wilson had in preserving the Bills, never mind establishing the team in Buffalo in the first place, a city that might not have had AFL or NFL for that matter without Ralph. and do you discount him too for turning down several offers to relocate the team, including one by Tex Schram, who offered to come up to Buffalo and help pack? i don't recall Polian bringing the Colts a Super Bowl in 1992. it's easy to play the pessimistic role and find fault. heck, we in the media get accused of that all the time. but what's your point and to what end are you trying to get to, especially when cherry-picking negative and sometimes erroneous "facts" to support your case and dismissing the positives. oh, and to your point in questioning ... "where is Indy & SanDiego?" check a map, the first is in Indiana, where they have a big car race on Memorial Day weekend, and the other's in southern California, just north of the Mexican border and where they have famous zoo. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts