John from Riverside Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 My son will have gone through the public school system every year....and will be a senior next year. He pretty much had to in order to play on the school sports teams and have a chance at a scholarship to go to college. We are taking my daughter a different route....a couple of things: - My daughter has never been a great student...shoot she has never been an average student. Too many distractions with other kids.....too much drama....too much time in the counselor's office for this and for that. I didn't know until just yesterday but early in this school year (8th grade) her school counsilor RECOMMENDED home school to my wife but never bothered to tell me. - My daughter will not be going to college....not on a academic scholarship or a athletic scholarship....she is not inclined in either of those areas......what she does great is sing, perform, and promote her church....those are her passions and what she does well. - Things have taken off so well in this area that she is going to start getting really busy with those things. Music CD nearly finished and will be spending the summer traveling to various churches, promotions, and singing at several functions at the various indian reservations we have in our area and possibly as far as Amsterdam. "Little Spirit" as she has been named by the local tribes put in the work last summer promoting and now things are going to pick up. This will extend past summer and into what would be the next academic school year as a freshman. My brother has the connections to really make things take off for her beyond that. - Her uncle (manager, promoter, singing coach, practically 3rd parent is convinced that if she goes to regular academic school she is going to totally lose focus on the plan they have set forth and my wife and I are convinced based on the things went in school for her this year. She is just too much of a mother hen to her friends and cant stay out of the drama. It affects her in other things. - So we decided this week that we are going home school with her for all of the above reasons. But I have concerns as well. I dont want her to do any type of program where she does not have regular access to teachers. My wife and I are just not going to be of much help....I am gone workign way too much and my wife barely finished high school herself. They have a program where they pick their work up from the continuation school and they have regular tutoring every day during certain hours.....we were thinking about going with that. I know that a lot of childhood performing prodigies did home school because they were on the road too much.....but eventually I do hope she goes back someday and pursues her education when she has money and time. I have conflicting emotions on all of this because I went to regular school myself and she is going to miss things that go on in regular school. Her friends all go to her church and so it isn't like she will be alienated but it still wont be the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Info Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Have you considered private school? I was curious and noticed there were a few in and around Hemet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 just keep in mind the social aspect that you are not exposing her to anymore. I would recommend seeing a family counselor, psychologist, psychiatrist, licensed/clinical social worker etc..... before deciding that route, perhaps she has something inside preventing her from succeeding in school. there is no 'home' working so she needs to deal with the distractions be they on her own or through the help of medication etc..... just my $.02...good luck...i have a child i have been struggling with his entire life and am exploring options to help him get through his education Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 (edited) My son will have gone through the public school system every year....and will be a senior next year. He pretty much had to in order to play on the school sports teams and have a chance at a scholarship to go to college. We are taking my daughter a different route....a couple of things: - My daughter has never been a great student...shoot she has never been an average student. Too many distractions with other kids.....too much drama....too much time in the counselor's office for this and for that. I didn't know until just yesterday but early in this school year (8th grade) her school counsilor RECOMMENDED home school to my wife but never bothered to tell me. - My daughter will not be going to college....not on a academic scholarship or a athletic scholarship....she is not inclined in either of those areas......what she does great is sing, perform, and promote her church....those are her passions and what she does well. - Things have taken off so well in this area that she is going to start getting really busy with those things. Music CD nearly finished and will be spending the summer traveling to various churches, promotions, and singing at several functions at the various indian reservations we have in our area and possibly as far as Amsterdam. "Little Spirit" as she has been named by the local tribes put in the work last summer promoting and now things are going to pick up. This will extend past summer and into what would be the next academic school year as a freshman. My brother has the connections to really make things take off for her beyond that. - Her uncle (manager, promoter, singing coach, practically 3rd parent is convinced that if she goes to regular academic school she is going to totally lose focus on the plan they have set forth and my wife and I are convinced based on the things went in school for her this year. She is just too much of a mother hen to her friends and cant stay out of the drama. It affects her in other things. - So we decided this week that we are going home school with her for all of the above reasons. But I have concerns as well. I dont want her to do any type of program where she does not have regular access to teachers. My wife and I are just not going to be of much help....I am gone workign way too much and my wife barely finished high school herself. They have a program where they pick their work up from the continuation school and they have regular tutoring every day during certain hours.....we were thinking about going with that. I know that a lot of childhood performing prodigies did home school because they were on the road too much.....but eventually I do hope she goes back someday and pursues her education when she has money and time. I have conflicting emotions on all of this because I went to regular school myself and she is going to miss things that go on in regular school. Her friends all go to her church and so it isn't like she will be alienated but it still wont be the same. The Berean stores have excellent home schooling kits. Call them. http://www.berean.com/books.asp?mymode=1&a...p;catname=Books But to home school, you or your wife must be home to give the instruction. I would not be concerned about your wife's education. She is an adult and mother of her child. But you simply cannot home school if you also want others to tutor...if you or wife won't be there instructing the child, it goes against the main idea. Home schooling is anything but convenient, and to do it properly, to teach your child well and effectively, a parent has to commit to the job, full-time. There is no other possibility. EDIT: after reading subsequent posts - seems that "shared" home schooling exists, and works. I apologize, John, for shooting off my mouth. Edited May 6, 2009 by stuckincincy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Send her to a convent until she's 40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 just keep in mind the social aspect that you are not exposing her to anymore. I would recommend seeing a family counselor, psychologist, psychiatrist, licensed/clinical social worker etc..... before deciding that route, perhaps she has something inside preventing her from succeeding in school. there is no 'home' working so she needs to deal with the distractions be they on her own or through the help of medication etc..... just my $.02...good luck...i have a child i have been struggling with his entire life and am exploring options to help him get through his education I agree. I'm not a parent, but it seems to me that professional advice outside of a single public school counselor should be sought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajzepp Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 John: I work with a lady who is very experienced in home care. If you'd like me to see if she'd be willing to discuss it with you, send me a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 I know a lot of home schoolers and home school parents. I am usually against it due to the lack of "social education." But starting home-schooling in 8th grade (as opposed to much earlier) doesn't seem like it will cause those same lack of social skills problems. I would check out if there are home schooling associations in the area--i.e., might allow your daughter to be taught by other parents who are knowledgable in certain areas and give her an opportunity for more social interaction. Good points, and thank you for them. I added an edit to my previous post to John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 The Berean stores have excellent home schooling kits. Call them. http://www.berean.com/books.asp?mymode=1&a...p;catname=Books But to home school, you or your wife must be home to give the instruction. I would not be concerned about your wife's education. She is an adult and mother of her child. But you simply cannot home school if you also want others to tutor...if you or wife won't be there instructing the child, it goes against the main idea. Home schooling is anything but convenient, and to do it properly, to teach your child well and effectively, a parent has to commit to the job, full-time. There is no other possibility. EDIT: after reading subsequent posts - seems that "shared" home schooling exists, and works. I apologize, John, for shooting off my mouth. Its ok cinci....I am not offended.....kind of looking for different viewpoints at this point. Counciling has been going on all year in an attempt to figure out what the school disconnect is. It was actually councilors that recommended it. I actually share the same concerns that you pointed out. The last thing I want to have happen is my daughter come to me or my wife for help.....and we look at her and shrug our shoulders. The thing is....I am really starting to think that her time is school is flat out wasted....her grades are BAD and she seems to have some sort of problem with nearly every teacher she has but when when I take time to go and talk to the teachers they just love Ashlee....she is just a drifter......its funny because the few teachers that she has been able to do well in their classes actually allowed her to sit there with her ipod and headphones while doing her work......then no problems with distractions....grades picked up immediately....etc. But I understnd that to do that for one you have to do that for all so it just isnt possble in a overcrowded community school. I would be comfortable with a setting where she gets her homework but goes to one on one with teachers regularly which seems to be the case. It is also flexible that allows her to take care of HER business. There will be times when she will be on the road for weeks at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 Send her to a convent until she's 40 And then there is that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 Have you considered private school? I was curious and noticed there were a few in and around Hemet. We have considered it.....but.....financial situation isnt so hot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 The thing is....I am really starting to think that her time is school is flat out wasted....her grades are BAD and she seems to have some sort of problem with nearly every teacher she has but when when I take time to go and talk to the teachers they just love Ashlee....she is just a drifter......its funny because the few teachers that she has been able to do well in their classes actually allowed her to sit there with her ipod and headphones while doing her work......then no problems with distractions....grades picked up immediately....etc. But I understnd that to do that for one you have to do that for all so it just isnt possble in a overcrowded community school. I'd just say to keep in mind that she's only in 8th grade. These kind of patterns don't necessarily hold true, especially in a period of so many changes for a child. If all it takes is an ipod to get her to focus in, that can be something that can be worked with. But I'm not a professional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasjute Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 - My daughter will not be going to college....not on a academic scholarship or a athletic scholarship....she is not inclined in either of those areas......what she does great is sing, perform, and promote her church....those are her passions and what she does well. John, What about exploring music study in college? If she is talented there is a good chance she can get a good talent-based music scholarship. Depending on the school her grades will still have to meet some minimum standards, but if the grades are good enough to just get accepted, then the scholarship $$$ most often goes to the kids with the musical talent irrespective of academic record. Just as with athletes, music schools want to attract the best singers to strengthen their programs. She's got at least 3 good years left to explore this option and think about some specialized training to help prepare her for a college audition, etc... If she's not inclined to get classical training (which is always helpful no matter what you sing) she might look into a school with a strong musical theater program. It could also help her pick up some important skills (maybe teaching or arts management, perhaps even some recording) that will help her survive financially and continue to pursue her dreams without abandoning music together, waiting tables, etc... I know it is a little off-topic from your original question, but I wouldn't give up on college just because she wants to do music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 John, What about exploring music study in college? If she is talented there is a good chance she can get a good talent-based music scholarship. Depending on the school her grades will still have to meet some minimum standards, but if the grades are good enough to just get accepted, then the scholarship $$$ most often goes to the kids with the musical talent irrespective of academic record. Just as with athletes, music schools want to attract the best singers to strengthen their programs. She's got at least 3 good years left to explore this option and think about some specialized training to help prepare her for a college audition, etc... If she's not inclined to get classical training (which is always helpful no matter what you sing) she might look into a school with a strong musical theater program. It could also help her pick up some important skills (maybe teaching or arts management, perhaps even some recording) that will help her survive financially and continue to pursue her dreams without abandoning music together, waiting tables, etc... I know it is a little off-topic from your original question, but I wouldn't give up on college just because she wants to do music. I think this def might be a option in the future. I am actually hoping that being away from school for a while will make her realize what she is missing....and reaquire her interest in it later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I'd just say to keep in mind that she's only in 8th grade. These kind of patterns don't necessarily hold true, especially in a period of so many changes for a child. If all it takes is an ipod to get her to focus in, that can be something that can be worked with. But I'm not a professional. John, What about exploring music study in college? If she is talented there is a good chance she can get a good talent-based music scholarship. Depending on the school her grades will still have to meet some minimum standards, but if the grades are good enough to just get accepted, then the scholarship $$$ most often goes to the kids with the musical talent irrespective of academic record. Just as with athletes, music schools want to attract the best singers to strengthen their programs. She's got at least 3 good years left to explore this option and think about some specialized training to help prepare her for a college audition, etc... If she's not inclined to get classical training (which is always helpful no matter what you sing) she might look into a school with a strong musical theater program. It could also help her pick up some important skills (maybe teaching or arts management, perhaps even some recording) that will help her survive financially and continue to pursue her dreams without abandoning music together, waiting tables, etc... I know it is a little off-topic from your original question, but I wouldn't give up on college just because she wants to do music. im on track with both of these posts. school/college/life doesnt have to revolve around math and science and history. i wouldnt limit her potential based on her behavior through middle school. this is probably the craziest time in her life, in all aspects. not sure if i would set her future path based on how she is behaving at this age. from what youve described, ive known LOTS of more "troubled" girls at that age who went on to level out. just my two cents. and i grew up with parents who were head of Special Ed. departments and I went to school for teaching. good luck. and i sincerely mean that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodBye Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 One of my sisters did home schooling when she was in high school. From what I remember they do have people available to help if she has questions. For the social part they do have field trips and other outings with other home schooled kids. I can't remember the name of the school she used but I can find out if you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In space no one can hear Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 John: Have you considered asking the school district to do some Psycho/Educational Assessment testing? When the psychological and educational testing are included in an overall assessment of a person it is called a psycho/educational assessment. Psycho/educational assessments help document the information processing dysfunctions or strengths of the students being tested . The info would be helpful to the school she is enrolled in and would also help anyone working with her in a home school situation. You might have to press for this, as so many districts try to limit spending money. I don't like the school just suggesting home schooling. I would want to hear from them how they WILL provide the best environment possible to ensure her success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dib Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Where will she go for the Home coming dance? Do you help her with homework now? If you dont what makes you think you can home school her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fischer Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Not to set off a firestorm, but have you tested her for ADD? I'm not one to hand out drugs to every kid who doesn't perform well but we resisted with our intelligent and unfocused second daughter in 6th grade and the results are pretty remarkable. She was a C and C+ student before and A-student now. Same kid, same personality, same kind of craziness but she now focuses in class and on her work. It certainly doesn't work for every kid but I'm glad we tried that before putting her in a very expensive private school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I know a few of my friends do it. Personally, I do not agree with it John. Part of going to school is your grades & learning how to study etc.. but just as important imo is developing the social skills. Kids for the most part want to be around other kids. Especially at that age, they dont want to be around their parents for social activities. Some of my fondest memories are of me hanging out with my friends at school. I would think twice about this. I never got really good grades in school but I somehow got into Syracuse, graduated from there in 4 & 1/2 years & then went on to get my masters at canisius. In my 6 + years of college I had 3 or 4 A's in that time. Everything else was mostly B's & a few C's. I plugged thru it. It was a grind but you do what you have to do. To say that your daughter is not going to college when she is only in 8th grade, I think your being pretty shortsighted & maybe not giving your daughter enough credit. Couple times I wanted to drop out of college & my dad & mom were always there for me telling me to stick with it, & they know I could do it. What kind of message are you going to be sending to your daughter if you tell her that we are taking you away from your friends, home schooling you, because we do not think you are a good enough student? What if the music thing does not work out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 No disrespect John and I really don't know your situation but it just sounds like she is a 15 year girl being a 15 year old girl. You have a boy that's getting ready to be a senior let him take her under his wing for a year and see how she does. That's what older siblings are for. To be honest it sounds like she just needs a little discipline from you and your wife to keep her on the right track. I knew a couple of kids that were home schooled and when they went to college it was bad, that obviously doesn't hold true for everyone but being social won't just help her in college but in the job market years down the road. Best of luck. She will be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjeff215 Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I've two kids, one is two and one is just about eight. That's enough experience to know that they really go through some serious phases. It's hard to know what they'll be interested in three months from now, let alone four or five years ahead. You said your daughter is in eighth grade. That's middle school territory. Consider that it's one of the most difficult times for a kid. Also remember that at the end of this school year, she'll (probably?) be going into a new school. She's struggling with finding an identity, fitting in, and pleasing you and other authority figures all at the same time. I don't mean any disrespect, but she's far to young for the "no college" decision. Far to young. When I was in eighth grade, I couldn't wait to be done with school so I could become a punk musician. When I was a junior in high school, I was hunting medical schools. I wound up going the computer science route. My grades were god awful in middle school, simply because I was too young to care about them. Also, remember that any change in the school habit is going to throw her for a loop. She'll miss friends, routines, and the experience. Probably much like moving away, though slightly more frustrating as everyone she's known since around elementary school are still right up the road. Lastly, seriously weigh her chances of success in the music business. Sure, she's great. I'm sure she's probably absolutely wonderful. The problem is, there are a lot of other absolutely wonderful young singers out there. Very very few of them make a living doing it. Quite honestly, I'd put as much focus as I could on the school work and leave the music as a secondary. Statistically speaking, she's going to have to rely on that education more than the musical talent. If she's really into it, she can go forward with a music education, get involved in school orchestra, and really find her niche that way. That gives you more of a symbiotic relationship between the two; one doesn't have to suffer for the other. I hope that helps. If nothing else, it puts my spin on it! (All that said, there's nothing wrong with home schooling at all in my opinion. There are groups you can join to keep the social aspect up and get involved in sports. It's a big decision, though.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Whatever you decide to do, you need to go ahead with the assumption that the music career is NOT going to pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I think you can get away home schooling a child up to first or second grade. After that unless you have a degree in education you should leave it to the professionals. Never mind the social interaction aspect. Kids need to be around other kids to learn social skills too. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 John: Have you considered asking the school district to do some Psycho/Educational Assessment testing? When the psychological and educational testing are included in an overall assessment of a person it is called a psycho/educational assessment. Psycho/educational assessments help document the information processing dysfunctions or strengths of the students being tested . The info would be helpful to the school she is enrolled in and would also help anyone working with her in a home school situation. You might have to press for this, as so many districts try to limit spending money. I don't like the school just suggesting home schooling. I would want to hear from them how they WILL provide the best environment possible to ensure her success. That jumped out at me too. Something isnt right about that. I would suggest going out and talking to different counselors abo0utt this and no offense to anyone on the board but we are far from experts in this field. If she is only in middle school it may just be that shes in middle school. I hated every minute of my middle school years and eventually transfered to a private school and it was the best thing to nhappen to me. You mentioned earlier the financial situation isnt so hot, many private schools have scholorship programs. They would require her to keep a minimum GPA at the very least but it is something you should explore. And there are many schools out there that have alot to do with the arts and that may be exactly what she needs. Home-Schooling to me, i dont know i just dont like the idea of it. Its hard to teach people especially members of your own family anything much less chemistry for example. Recently i had a 5th grade cousin come up to me asking for help on his math homework and i couldnt do it. I guess all im sayign is keep all your options open and you dont have to make a decison until the fall so dont decide anything yet Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In space no one can hear Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I've two kids, one is two and one is just about eight. That's enough experience to know that they really go through some serious phases. It's hard to know what they'll be interested in three months from now, let alone four or five years ahead. You said your daughter is in eighth grade. That's middle school territory. Consider that it's one of the most difficult times for a kid. Also remember that at the end of this school year, she'll (probably?) be going into a new school. She's struggling with finding an identity, fitting in, and pleasing you and other authority figures all at the same time. I don't mean any disrespect, but she's far to young for the "no college" decision. Far to young. When I was in eighth grade, I couldn't wait to be done with school so I could become a punk musician. When I was a junior in high school, I was hunting medical schools. I wound up going the computer science route. My grades were god awful in middle school, simply because I was too young to care about them. Also, remember that any change in the school habit is going to throw her for a loop. She'll miss friends, routines, and the experience. Probably much like moving away, though slightly more frustrating as everyone she's known since around elementary school are still right up the road. Lastly, seriously weigh her chances of success in the music business. Sure, she's great. I'm sure she's probably absolutely wonderful. The problem is, there are a lot of other absolutely wonderful young singers out there. Very very few of them make a living doing it. Quite honestly, I'd put as much focus as I could on the school work and leave the music as a secondary. Statistically speaking, she's going to have to rely on that education more than the musical talent. If she's really into it, she can go forward with a music education, get involved in school orchestra, and really find her niche that way. That gives you more of a symbiotic relationship between the two; one doesn't have to suffer for the other. I hope that helps. If nothing else, it puts my spin on it! (All that said, there's nothing wrong with home schooling at all in my opinion. There are groups you can join to keep the social aspect up and get involved in sports. It's a big decision, though.) mcjeff215: Very thoughtful reply with many excellent points to ponder. I am a former SPED Teacher and School Administrator. Currently I work in business, but still tutor a few students because it is so rewarding to help to turn around their academic success (and teachers perceptions of a students limitations) Quick story: For years I was a teacher administrator for a school in Chicago for kids kicked out of the Chicago school system. We can start with the premise that to get kicked out of the Chicago school system can take some effort right? Well, we had an assortment of learning disabled, emotionally disturbed and conduct disordered students. But we also would get kids that somehow fell through the cracks because they never had anyone advocate for them and help unlock their potential. Currently one of my former students at that school I had in his 8th grade year came to our school with a long rap sheet of "problems"- is in the Doctoral Program for Psychology at The University of Chicago. He had many teachers (and The Principal) believe in him and help him gain self awareness of why he "behaved" a certain way and he learned how to make better choices. He was also taught in a way that addressed his strengths/weaknesses specific to his learning style. I would say the moral of the story is that no one expected him to graduate from high school, much less college or with an advanced degree. Dont put limits on a students potential. What he did get at our school was a group of teachers and administrators committed to seeing him succeed. My number one belief in education is that each student at our school gain the belief that "It matters that they are there" that the school is not whole or complete unless they are a part of it. John: seek out staff at your daughters school that are willing to believe in her and advocate for her and don't be afraid to DEMAND that the school provide an environment that ensures her success. It's their responsibility and unfortunately many just don't take it seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 Hey guys....just saw some of the responses...... - I didn't throw this out there yesterday......but one of the things that is factoring into our equation is she barely made it out of middle school as it is.....She was suspended 3 times for fighting this year and barely avoided a fourth. One of them was with a boy. She isn't doing to hot at the social interaction part as it is. - Second....we are not talking about a C- student here who we would like to see get A's......D's and F's folks.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Hey guys....just saw some of the responses...... - I didn't throw this out there yesterday......but one of the things that is factoring into our equation is she barely made it out of middle school as it is.....She was suspended 3 times for fighting this year and barely avoided a fourth. One of them was with a boy. She isn't doing to hot at the social interaction part as it is. - Second....we are not talking about a C- student here who we would like to see get A's......D's and F's folks.... in all honesty, she sounds exactly like most of the girls i knew in middle school at west seneca east back in the early 90s. they all settled down once they got into high school. for the most part. dont jump the gun because your daughter isnt "perfect". lots of kids struggle at this age. ESPECIALLY girls. dont get me wrong, something should be done. but i dont know about anything as drastic as pulling her out of school completely. sounds like, at this point, she would have problems whether she was in school or not. the only difference will be that she'll be fighting with you and your wife instead of the teachers/students. there are bigger issues at hand here. i dont mean to imply there is anything wrong with your daughter, other than she is a typical adolescent girl. possibly the worst creatures on the planet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In space no one can hear Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Hey guys....just saw some of the responses...... - I didn't throw this out there yesterday......but one of the things that is factoring into our equation is she barely made it out of middle school as it is.....She was suspended 3 times for fighting this year and barely avoided a fourth. One of them was with a boy. She isn't doing to hot at the social interaction part as it is. - Second....we are not talking about a C- student here who we would like to see get A's......D's and F's folks.... Switching her to home schooling is not "striking at the root of the problem" You need to address the underlying issues that are causing the surface behavior/acting out. A full scale Psycho/educational assessment should be completed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 in all honesty, she sounds exactly like most of the girls i knew in middle school at west seneca east back in the early 90s. they all settled down once they got into high school. for the most part. dont jump the gun because your daughter isnt "perfect". lots of kids struggle at this age. ESPECIALLY girls. dont get me wrong, something should be done. but i dont know about anything as drastic as pulling her out of school completely. sounds like, at this point, she would have problems whether she was in school or not. the only difference will be that she'll be fighting with you and your wife instead of the teachers/students. there are bigger issues at hand here. i dont mean to imply there is anything wrong with your daughter, other than she is a typical adolescent girl. possibly the worst creatures on the planet. It has been a long time since I was in middle school but I did not know any girls that got into fights, especially with boys. John, I guess my final advice(not that you really care what I think) I really do not believe in home school, however with that being said, you know your daughter as well as anyone, if you & your wife think it is the right thing to do then make the decision, make the best situation possible for your daughter, & once you made that decision, do not 2nd guess yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 It has been a long time since I was in middle school but I did not know any girls that got into fights, especially with boys. one of my funniest memories from middle school was my friend chris getting his butt beat by a girl outside of ice skating at west seneca rink. we were in 8th grade. it wasnt the only example. it definitely happens. most of the girls in my school at the time were constantly in detention for mouthing off to teachers, fighting with each other, vandalizing, smoking in the bathroom, etc. the list could go on and on. there isnt one that didnt turn out "alright". maybe not doctors or professional singers. but at least happy moms (which is a fulltime job itself). the "worst" one of the group from my grade, is a successful sales rep now. my overall point is, the school isnt the main problem that needs to be addressed. as InSpace pointed out, there are bigger issues that should be addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjeff215 Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 Hey guys....just saw some of the responses...... - I didn't throw this out there yesterday......but one of the things that is factoring into our equation is she barely made it out of middle school as it is.....She was suspended 3 times for fighting this year and barely avoided a fourth. One of them was with a boy. She isn't doing to hot at the social interaction part as it is. - Second....we are not talking about a C- student here who we would like to see get A's......D's and F's folks.... I can tell you some stories. I graduated High School in 1997 (Hamburg). Some of the girls coming up were just as bad as the boys. There's really no differentiation. Smoking, hitting the bong, drinking, mouthing off... you name it. It wasn't isolated to either one of the sexes. Fights as well. Middle school is usually harder than high school. It's the transition from childhood to real adolescence. In other words, you still really want to hug your daddy when you get home, but you don't want your friends to know that. You're describing my middle school career. Early high school for that matter. I just about failed everything. I was blowing off classes in 7th and 8th grade. I was a total bastard. They did just about everything to "fix" me. Scared straight programs, NYS mandated alcohol classes, extracurricular activities, you name it. I was quite a bit worse than your average middle school kid. Two things made me get it. Well, three. First, I finally understood I wasn't "special." I couldn't just do whatever it was that I wanted to. After high school, there was no path laid out for me. If I didn't address it, I'd be delivering pizza at 40. Second, there were a couple people in my life that I really just didn't want to disappoint. People other than my parents. And third? Everyone grows out of it. In middle school, everyone laughs when you zing a spitball across the front of the room. In high school? Your peers look at you like you're some kind of freak. All in all, none of what "they" did helped. I had to learn it on my own. I'm still that way and my wife hates it. She'll give me advice all day long, but I won't act on it until I've learned for myself. I guess there's no real advice buried in there, rather a reassurance that even the biggest troublemakers turn out okay. It's really your call. I wouldn't do it myself. I don't know nearly enough about child psychology, education, or subject specifics. I can tell her to read a chapter and write a paper, but I'm kidding myself if I remember the first thing about Chemistry,Martin Luther, or The Reconstruction. I'd get her involved in school music programs, coach her toward the right group of friends, and work with the school to give her the best shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp000085 Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 As a public school teacher, I am 98% against home schooling, leaving the 1% for folks who want to isolate their children for legitimate religious reasons and 1% for the medically fragile. I'll make my advice short and sweet. Public Law 94-142 states that all children should be afforded a free and appropriate education in their least restrictive environment. If she's struggling academically and/or socially, talk to the school about getting her tested. You are her best advocate in the schools. Know that the school is required by law to screen children and determine if further testing is necessary. Get a psych consult. If she's diagnosed with anything, and I mean ANYTHING, the school, by the IDEA mandate is required to service her appropriately and up to your standards. According to your statement, I am 100% against home schooling in your situation. I am also 100% convinced that you should be worried about your daughter. However, rather than pull her entirely, have her tested, see what comes up, and then go from there. Again, the school is required to set up an meeting, devise an individualized educational plan and implement it. The burden is on you to start the process, and once its rolling, the burden is on the schools to implement it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 As a public school teacher, I am 98% against home schooling, leaving the 1% for folks who want to isolate their children for legitimate religious reasons and 1% for the medically fragile. I'll make my advice short and sweet. Public Law 94-142 states that all children should be afforded a free and appropriate education in their least restrictive environment. If she's struggling academically and/or socially, talk to the school about getting her tested. You are her best advocate in the schools. Know that the school is required by law to screen children and determine if further testing is necessary. Get a psych consult. If she's diagnosed with anything, and I mean ANYTHING, the school, by the IDEA mandate is required to service her appropriately and up to your standards. According to your statement, I am 100% against home schooling in your situation. I am also 100% convinced that you should be worried about your daughter. However, rather than pull her entirely, have her tested, see what comes up, and then go from there. Again, the school is required to set up an meeting, devise an individualized educational plan and implement it. The burden is on you to start the process, and once its rolling, the burden is on the schools to implement it. Corp....if only it was that simple. I have been working with Ashlee's school for the last two years on various issues......none of it has been met to my satisfaction. I am not blaming the teachers....but in my opinion the public school system flat out sucks.......the teachers are just overwhelmed....too overwhelmed to give my daughter the separate attention she needs. She is a number in a sea of numbers....and trying to talk to her school about issues unless I go in there in person (really hard to do all the time as I have to pay the bills) is very frustrating...... We decided that we are going to try this for a year and see how it works out.....we have a found a plan where she gets her homework every week but has access to one on one tutoring Monday thru Friday and also has a support group where he has activities with other home schooled kids......I have also set her up for the testing that was recommended above. If she does well over this next year we will stick with it.....if we dont see improvement we might reenroll her back into public school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 in all honesty, she sounds exactly like most of the girls i knew in middle school at west seneca east back in the early 90s. I am sorry for the tangent... You went to East? There is your problem right there... Let alone the girls being wild bohemians... I went to West (1986)... Sorry John, I don't have much advice... Mine are 11 and 7... And send them to a Catholic school, my son is constantly scoring in the 99 %tile when taking standardized tests and he gets straight A's... The only think I worry about is that maybe private school may be stifling him... I always heard that private school (especially at the high school level where we plan to send him) is more benefited towards students who struggle or lack the academic discipline. I would maybe look into the private school think more John... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted May 8, 2009 Share Posted May 8, 2009 Does she watch alot of TV? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 I am a huge home-school hater and proponent. The religious.isolationist folks dominate the home-schooling scene and give it a bad name. But if you think your school system sucks and you have both the abundance of energy and knowledge that can help your kid, go for it. But here's the thing. You have to work hard to make home-schooling work. As in, turn the world into your classroom. Going to teach science? Go to a museum or call a college professor who will happily show you the edge of science. Going to teach history? Read about it in some books--not texts-- AND VISIT THE SITES. Basically, you have to turn the world and a world of experts into your classroom. You'd be shocked at how many experts would love to talk to a kid about what they do. But that means you're going to work your ass off to provide this education and it won't be cheap. If all you plan on doing is assigning homework and teaching from a book, good luck. You will be giving her the same crappy education that bores her already. The social aspects would have to be backfilled with a million other activities. Enroll her in group music classes at a local community college. Make her pick 3 "classes" on any topic through local communities. Tell her that if she is going to do the homeschooling, she has to do 10 hours of volunteer work at the charity of her choosing. When the time is right, make her get a job. All of these things will get her plenty of exposure socially. Moreover, the social lab that is high school (where she's about to be) is A.W.F.U.L for many kids and making it though it--though most people will tell you is an important part of growing up--can leave deep scars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 I agree. I'm not a parent, but it seems to me that professional advice outside of a single public school counselor should be sought. I agree as well. This is a big decision and you have given a number of pluses and minuses. You certainly are not making the decision lightly, and it sounds as if your daughter has a lot going for her...not the least of which is loving and caring parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 But here's the thing. You have to work hard to make home-schooling work. As in, turn the world into your classroom. All parents should be doing that no matter what! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp000085 Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Corp....if only it was that simple. I have been working with Ashlee's school for the last two years on various issues......none of it has been met to my satisfaction. hire a lawyer... seriously. The school system will start to work with you when they know you mean business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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