dib Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I didnt think Jauron had a reflection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 The Cleveland Browns were clearly a reflection of their head coach when they went 6-10 in 1991, 7-9 in both 1992 and 1993, and 5-11 in 1995. That Belichick guy must be such a dope! The LA Raiders were clearly a reflection of their head coach when they went a combined 8-12 in in 1988 and part of 1989. By the same token, the Denver Broncos were clearly a reflection of that same head coach when they went 8-8 in 1995, 6-10 in 1999, 8-8 in 2001 and 7-9 in 2007. I don't even need to look at anything more: that Shanahan guy obviously never accomplished anything! The Houston Oilers and Tennessee Titans were a reflection of their head coach when they went 1-5 under him in 1994, 7-9 in 1995, 8-8 in '96, '97 and '98, 7-9 in 2001, 5-11 in 2004, and 4-12 in 2005. That Jeff Fisher guy is such a loser! Great post, great thread! You're a genius! DICK JAURON IS FIFTY FREAKING EIGHT YEARS OLD!!! You're talking about men who were ON THE WAY UP the coaching ladder who gained the success because they were very good coaches. Dick Jauron is no longer a young man who is working his way up. He's currently working on his 8TH LOSING SEASON out of 9 in his career as a head coach. I think you guys have battered wife syndrome with this guy. He's a peach no matter what he does. Un-freaking-believable! :wub: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Theory aside....we've had plenty of arguments for winners/losers....there are other issues at hand. The players love Jauron and love playing for him. I doubt there is a guy in that locker room who wouldn't be upset if he was let go. Considering that he was the victim of a new GM in Chicago (and not really let go because of his performance), it seems that he's a very well-liked and well-respected man around the league. Because of this, I think it would take an Earth-shattering event to fire Jauron. He's here for a while, unless he leaves on his own. I think the biggest problem is that Jauron has a huge voice in the personnel department and with Russ Brandon having a business (non-football) background, it effectively makes Jauron the GM of this team. If you look at all of the coaches that simultaneously hold the GM title, they RARELY win on the field. Mike Holmgren was the GM in Seattle for a while. I believe he was no longer GM for the 2004 season (whether or not he resigned that or it was removed from his duties, I don't know) and the Seahawks went to the Superbowl a year later. Andy Reid in Philadelphia is another example. To me, the Eagles are underachieving. They have the talent to win, but aren't winning the game they need to win. I think Mike Sherman was doing the same in Green Bay after Ron Wolf left. There are other examples that I can't rattle off right now, but I've rarely seen a GM/coach consistently have a winner on the field. If the Bills had a GM that was a true football GM (someone in the Bill Polian or Ron Wolf mold) and let Jauron just coach the team, I'd bet we'd see more consistent winning results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eliteqb Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I think the biggest problem is that Jauron has a huge voice in the personnel department and with Russ Brandon having a business (non-football) background, it effectively makes Jauron the GM of this team. now that's a scary thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 The players love Jauron and love playing for him. I doubt there is a guy in that locker room who wouldn't be upset if he was let go. Considering that he was the victim of a new GM in Chicago (and not really let go because of his performance), it seems that he's a very well-liked and well-respected man around the league. Because of this, I think it would take an Earth-shattering event to fire Jauron. He's here for a while, unless he leaves on his own. They like him, they really like him. Well respected? Perhaps for his character but certainly not for his coaching prowess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 They like him, they really like him. Well respected? Perhaps for his character but certainly not for his coaching prowess. That's my point....he's well-liked enough and well-respected enough that it would be extremely difficult to fire him. That said, there's been a rumor of the extension, but has it officially been announced? If not, I'd have to imagine that his status is in jeopardy in January if they miss the playoffs after a 5-1 start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 That's my point....he's well-liked enough and well-respected enough that it would be extremely difficult to fire him. That said, there's been a rumor of the extension, but has it officially been announced? If not, I'd have to imagine that his status is in jeopardy in January if they miss the playoffs after a 5-1 start. He's paid to win games not win popularity contests. I'm doubtful Ralph will fire him (because of $$$) but unless he gets this team turned around fast he should be (IMO). The division was there for the taking and we have flopped badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 He's paid to win games not win popularity contests. I'm doubtful Ralph will fire him (because of $$$) but unless he gets this team turned around fast he should be (IMO). I'm not disagreeing with either point. I'm just saying the more well-liked someone is, the more difficult it is to fire him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEDuganWolcott Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Doesn't matter who the coach is when your have good personel on the field. Belichick fell ass backward into glory when Tom Brady emerged. Same with Dungy, everyone knew Peyton Manning was gonna be good. Holmgren doesn't have Favre anymore, there will NEVER be another Elway for Shannahan much less Jay Cutler. Dick Jauron flat out needs to find the strengths of this team and use them. I still believe Marshawn Lynch will be an explosive back if given enough opportunities and the O-line actually blocks for him. With agility being an issue for pass-blocking, Buffalo need to use the quick passing game to not only cut down on the shots taken by Trent, but to give the o-line a little confidence back. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I think the biggest problem is that Jauron has a huge voice in the personnel department and with Russ Brandon having a business (non-football) background, it effectively makes Jauron the GM of this team. If you look at all of the coaches that simultaneously hold the GM title, they RARELY win on the field. I agree fully... And it's going to be awfully hard to convince anyone who did not think Dead Dick deserved the HC Job in the 1st Place that He is qualified in any way to be the GM...And You're correct, when it comes to the Player-end of the GM Job, Jauron is in charge...He has final say on all Personnel matters...To be perfectly honest, with the CLEAR exception of his inability to address the Pass Rush effectively, I think Ol' Dead Dick has been a better GM than He has been a HC...That's not saying much but...Anyway... The Players may love the Guy, but that's another argument in itself...I really don't think it matters much if the Players like a HC...As long as they respect him and value his ability to out-coach, out-game plan, and out-prepare the other Team...On the subject of Belichick...Does anyone really think The Pats Players love the Guy? I mean...I can't imagine He puts on that surly act just for the Press...But they damn sure respect him and believe down to the last Man that He is going to come up with a Game Plan to defeat the other Team...The Pats Players certainly love the fact that Belichick can Game Plan with the best of em.' If they love Belichick it's because they love winning... This is where I think DJ simply does not match-up...Yes the Players like the guy...And yes they respect Jauron as a man because He is a decent man after all...But I don't think, deep down inside, things that don't get discussed till AFTER a HC is gone, that this Bills Team down to the last Player believes in Jauron's ability to consistantly put them in the right position (with the right Game Plan) to actually Win with any regularity...ESPECIALLY vs. the better Teams in The NFL..I think there is a doubt there that shows up against those better Teams in Games The Bills still could and even should win...There is doubt...You can see it on their faces...This Team has been told over and over again that if they work hard everything will come together...They work hard...REAL hard...Then they get out there vs. well Coached and well prepared Teams and get it handed to them...Then the Coaches come back on Monday and say..."Well we missed this, and We missed that...We just have to continue to work hard..." Then the Players blame themselves because they want to take responsibility...Then they go out and work harder...Then it happens again...How many time does it have to happen vs. the better Teams the Bills face before the Players start to doubt the Game Plans and Coaching in general? Does anyone think The Bills Players don't know their record vs. good Teams over the past few Years? And then Jauron has the balls to stand up after the San Diego Home Game and say that "No one was giving Us a chance to Win this game???" You're a 4-1 Team playing at Home and You think no one was giving You a chance to Win??? Bull...What He should say, and believe, is that it was a HOME Game and We expect to Win every Home Game...That's what good Teams do after all...You can only pull that underdog crap for so long before The Players start thinking their Coach is unsure who the favorite REALLY is... If The Bills miss the Playoffs again this Year I think the doubt in that Locker Room will be at an all time high and Ralphie Boy is going to have a HUGE problem on his hands...Because regardless of what the root causes are, if Jauron can't figure out a way to consistantly beat good Teams especially AT HOME, I think the doubt will become permanent... Just My opinion though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 DICK JAURON IS FIFTY FREAKING EIGHT YEARS OLD!!! You're talking about men who were ON THE WAY UP the coaching ladder who gained the success because they were very good coaches. Dick Jauron is no longer a young man who is working his way up. He's currently working on his 8TH LOSING SEASON out of 9 in his career as a head coach. I think you guys have battered wife syndrome with this guy. He's a peach no matter what he does. Un-freaking-believable! :lol: As long as he's finding ways to win games with seriously flawed personnel, he's the right Head Coach for this team. Maybe not the right General Manager, mind you, but the right guy to cook the meal. Dick Vermeil after 41 games with the Rams, ages 61-63...16 wins, 25 losses Dick Jauron after 41 games with the Bills, ages 56-58.......19 wins, 22 losses Worked out pretty well for St. Louis, if memory serves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WellDressed Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 What if your coach is a walking doughnut like Andy Reid?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eliteqb Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Is there any place in this topic for Peewee Herman????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 As long as he's finding ways to win games with seriously flawed personnel, he's the right Head Coach for this team. Maybe not the right General Manager, mind you, but the right guy to cook the meal. Dick Vermeil after 41 games with the Rams, ages 61-63...16 wins, 25 losses Dick Jauron after 41 games with the Bills, ages 56-58.......19 wins, 22 losses Worked out pretty well for St. Louis, if memory serves. That's about a stretch and a half... And btw...I know The Bills are not the most talented Team in The NFL...Not by a bit...But some Folks around here just don't buy the "seriously flawed personnel" garbage that is being spewed...Thurman Thomas does not believe it...I think He knows Football...But more than anything even Dead Dick does not believe it...That is assuming He was not lying before the Season when He said there would be no more excuses...That The Bills were ready to Win from this point on...That they would be expected to Win... This Team has enough Talent to be a Playoff Team...Sure it may be a one and out Playoff Team...But at this point who the hell cares?..Do they have a Head Coach that can get them to The playoffs? We'll see soon enough... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 That's about a stretch and a half... And btw...I know The Bills are not the most talented Team in The NFL...Not by a bit...But some Folks around here just don't buy the "seriously flawed personnel" garbage that is being spewed...Thurman Thomas does not believe it...I think He knows Football...But more than anything even Dead Dick does not believe it...That is assuming He was not lying before the Season when He said there would be no more excuses...That The Bills were ready to Win from this point on...That they would be expected to Win... This Team has enough Talent to be a Playoff Team...Sure it may be a one and out Playoff Team...But at this point who the hell cares?..Do they have a Head Coach that can get them to The playoffs? We'll see soon enough... If you think a defensive line where 3 of the 4 starters are Chris Kelsay, Ryan Denney and Kyle Williams, a secondary where a clueless rookie is forced in as the nickelback and the safeties are such lackluster players as Ko Simpson and Bryan Scott, an interior offensive line where 2 of the 3 starters are Duke Preston and Jason Whittle, a WR corps consisting basically of one guy, and a group of tight ends lead by Robert Royal doesn't make for seriously flawed personel...I don't know what to do with you. If these offensive and defensive lines aren't "seriously flawed" what the hell is? And yet, this team might still make the playoffs. But if they do, we'll know it has absolutely nothing to do with the coaching, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heels20X6 Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 If you think a defensive line where 3 of the 4 starters are Chris Kelsay, Ryan Denney and Kyle Williams, a secondary where a clueless rookie is forced in as the nickelback and the safeties are such lackluster players as Ko Simpson and Bryan Scott, an interior offensive line where 2 of the 3 starters are Duke Preston and Jason Whittle, a WR corps consisting basically of one guy, and a group of tight ends lead by Robert Royal doesn't make for seriously flawed personnel...I don't know what to do with you. If these offensive and defensive lines aren't "seriously flawed" what the hell is? And again we get into the chicken and egg argument. Who was responsible for building this team? Jauron, I believe, had a lot to say about how this team would look in 2008. His own words were ones that indicated that this team was ready to go, that there would be no more excuses and this franchise is eying a playoff birth. What you've listed above are the very "excuses" he didn't want to come out with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 And again we get into the chicken and egg argument. Who was responsible for building this team? Jauron, I believe, had a lot to say about how this team would look in 2008. His own words were ones that indicated that this team was ready to go, that there would be no more excuses and this franchise is eying a playoff birth. What you've listed above are the very "excuses" he didn't want to come out with. For the 3rd time, nobody is saying Dick Jauron is a good General Manager. If you want to go out and hire a real GM, I'm with you every step of the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 As long as he's finding ways to win games with seriously flawed personnel, he's the right Head Coach for this team. Maybe not the right General Manager, mind you, but the right guy to cook the meal. Dick Vermeil after 41 games with the Rams, ages 61-63...16 wins, 25 losses Dick Jauron after 41 games with the Bills, ages 56-58.......19 wins, 22 losses Worked out pretty well for St. Louis, if memory serves. Vermeil brought a track record of succes to STL. Jauron brings a track record of mediocrity to Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I don't buy into this bit that a coach has to spit on the sidelines and tear his headset off when there's a bad call an publicy berate players etc. For every successful coach like this I can name five that were successful and weren't. Bill Beliceck, Tony Dungy, Tom Landry, Bud Grant, Bill Callahan, Mike Holmgren, John Fox, the Giants coach, Andy Reid, Jack Siefert, Bill Walsh, Chuck Noll, ... The good coaches evaluate and acquire talent and figure out ways to find the other team weaknesses and capitalize on them. They also evaluate the talent they have and come up with ways to take advantage of that. Not sure if Dick's doing that or not. Too early to tell. I think maybe the biggest reason they'll try to keep Dick is because the Bill's have realized that swapping out coaches and QBs evey couple of years has been counter-productive. Can't say as I disagree with that. I say if we got 9-7 or better, Dick stays. Otherwise, go after Marty Schottenhiemer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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