Pyrite Gal Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Did anyone notice the trend in that good analysis of WM vs. most other backs in the league, that the productive backs were on teams with good OL's ? Wm will be fine once we get a better OL that can open holes and keep DT's off of WM. My own personal spin on what any football player or movie star says is I couldn't care one little bit. Everyone has an opinion and no matter what you say someone will take issue with it, so screw it ! Who cares what WM says, people shouldn't pay that much attention to what they say in the first place. Personally I'm to busy living my life to take offense about what Wm says. Just my 3 cents. Obviously a lot of folks think enough about the importance of WM's views that pro or con they have a reaction to what he says, For me its hard to care less about what he says and thus I am not offended by what he says. Since I do care about the Bills performance the fact that he has yet to produce a full 16 game explosive season is a matter that I care about, but the answer as far as that goes is that in managing his contract he has so little leverage that even if were not represented by a jerk whose players usually do not hold out it seems incredibly doubtful he would sit next year. The Bills show all signs to me of being in contractual drivers' seat. WM will have every fiscal incentive to have a big year next year in his FA year. If he doesn't thats a pain but one simply lets him walk. If he does produce at an elite RB level the Bills can either sign him long-term or tag him if they want. As long as WM does not cause any troubles for his fellow players (I see no sign of this) because I give no import whatsoever to WM's ramblings about the Bills overall fiscal status I am not offended by whatever he says about things be it about his baby mommas or whether the Bills stay or go. What I actually find somewhat surprising (though I guess I shouldn't since lots of folks love a good soap opera or derive pleasure from disliking someone) is that a number of folks seem to find such import in WM's ramblings before the media that they choose to be offended or endorse by what he says. As long as what he says has no crucial impact on his teammates I really could not care less what he says. Obviously some do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndZoneCrew Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 It's funny how sports works sometimes. A few years ago everyone in Buffalo was saying how Henry wasn't a good enough RB and Willis McGahee would be a star. A few years later Henry looks like a top 10 back on another team and the Bills look like they'll need to draft another RB in the next 2 years. I think that it was more Donahoe......I had no problem with Henry's production while he was here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Obviously a lot of folks think enough about the importance of WM's views that pro or con they have a reaction to what he says, For me its hard to care less about what he says and thus I am not offended by what he says. Since I do care about the Bills performance the fact that he has yet to produce a full 16 game explosive season is a matter that I care about, but the answer as far as that goes is that in managing his contract he has so little leverage that even if were not represented by a jerk whose players usually do not hold out it seems incredibly doubtful he would sit next year. The Bills show all signs to me of being in contractual drivers' seat. WM will have every fiscal incentive to have a big year next year in his FA year. If he doesn't thats a pain but one simply lets him walk. If he does produce at an elite RB level the Bills can either sign him long-term or tag him if they want. As long as WM does not cause any troubles for his fellow players (I see no sign of this) because I give no import whatsoever to WM's ramblings about the Bills overall fiscal status I am not offended by whatever he says about things be it about his baby mommas or whether the Bills stay or go. What I actually find somewhat surprising (though I guess I shouldn't since lots of folks love a good soap opera or derive pleasure from disliking someone) is that a number of folks seem to find such import in WM's ramblings before the media that they choose to be offended or endorse by what he says. As long as what he says has no crucial impact on his teammates I really could not care less what he says. Obviously some do. i swore to myself that i wouldn't say anything more about this, but i will add here that you seem to be endorsing the notion that fans should see players as automotons with varying degrees of functionality on the assembly line we call professional football. not surprisingly, that's not how the world works. since fans are rooting for real live human beings -- not simulated ones, a la madden -- they tend to become invested in what makes them human: their personalities as well as their ability to help the team win. lamenting this fact seems to me to be about as effective as spitting into the ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Obviously a lot of folks think enough about the importance of WM's views that pro or con they have a reaction to what he says, For me its hard to care less about what he says and thus I am not offended by what he says. Since I do care about the Bills performance the fact that he has yet to produce a full 16 game explosive season is a matter that I care about, but the answer as far as that goes is that in managing his contract he has so little leverage that even if were not represented by a jerk whose players usually do not hold out it seems incredibly doubtful he would sit next year. The Bills show all signs to me of being in contractual drivers' seat. WM will have every fiscal incentive to have a big year next year in his FA year. If he doesn't thats a pain but one simply lets him walk. If he does produce at an elite RB level the Bills can either sign him long-term or tag him if they want. As long as WM does not cause any troubles for his fellow players (I see no sign of this) because I give no import whatsoever to WM's ramblings about the Bills overall fiscal status I am not offended by whatever he says about things be it about his baby mommas or whether the Bills stay or go. What I actually find somewhat surprising (though I guess I shouldn't since lots of folks love a good soap opera or derive pleasure from disliking someone) is that a number of folks seem to find such import in WM's ramblings before the media that they choose to be offended or endorse by what he says. As long as what he says has no crucial impact on his teammates I really could not care less what he says. Obviously some do. Why do you care so much about what people think or say about Willis? You keep on expounding about this over and over again. Sorry if some people give a crap what their supposed "best runningback in football" says and does off the field. You can sweep it under the carpet all you want but players actions off the field sometimes DO have an impact on the team. It's called being a distraction. Tiki Barber's team began to tank when he started to open his mouth, McGahee tanked as soon as he said he was the best runningback in football. Our team tanked last season when the players started to yap it up to the media instead of pulling together. TO's team would have been much better off without the constant distraction he created. Willis is clearly a knucklehead. Granting an interview to penthouse? In a word, moronic. Saying the Bills moving to Toronto would be a good thing? A 10 on the moron scale. Getting less than 1000 yards this season? Simply priceless. Knocking up three diffrent women? Jackass. He's lost every last bit of his cache with the Bills fans that you're upset with who are embarassed and at the end of their rope with Willis. Get off the high horse because we're not going away anytime soon. In fact, the numbers will only increase as long as that moron stays here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShirley Posted January 12, 2007 Author Share Posted January 12, 2007 Why do you care so much about what people think or say about Willis? You keep on expounding about this over and over again. Sorry if some people give a crap what their supposed "best runningback in football" says and does off the field. You can sweep it under the carpet all you want but players actions off the field sometimes DO have an impact on the team. It's called being a distraction. Tiki Barber's team began to tank when he started to open his mouth, McGahee tanked as soon as he said he was the best runningback in football. Our team tanked last season when the players stated to yap it up to the media instead of pulling together. TO's team would have been much better off without the constant distraction of he created. Willis is clearly a knucklehead. Granting an interview to penthouse? In a word, moronic. Saying the Bills moving to Toronto would be a good thing? A 10 on the moron scale. Getting less than 1000 yards this season? Simply priceless. Knocking up three diffrent women? Jackass. He's lost every last bit of his cache with the Bills fans that you're upset with who are embarassed and at the end of their rope with Willis. Get off the high horse because we're not going away anytime soon. In fact, the numbers will only increase as long as that moron stays here. Thank-you.............anybody that doesn't take just a little offense to what he said, imo is not a die-hard Bills fan. I think an athlete owes just a little bit of loyalty to the city and the fans in which he plays. Not that anything out of that buffons mouth matters, but it was a clear slap in the face to the fans that have had to suffer through watching him play like a bumbling fool for three years, to say the Bills should move to Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 I think Ralph Wilson said it best when he said that the running back has been a disappointment. Not only is he a below average starting running back on the field, he is an embarassment off the field as well. I am not referring to the fact that he has fathered three kids with three different woman in the past year either. To deliberately "bite the hand that feeds you", by saying that if they were going to put a NFL team in Toronto they should just put the Bills there, is inexcusable. Many will argue that his comments were taken out of context and he was asked a hypothetical question, but it leaves no question as to what he really thinks of the city of Buffalo and its fans. As a season ticket holder, I would be sickened to spend my hard earned money to have to watch an average to below average ingrateful idiot with his level of class be rewarded with a huge contract in city that he just publicly embarrassed. I am fully confident that Marv and Ralph, realize that neither his talent level nor his character, are a good fit with what we are trying to build here in Buffalo. I have prepared a list of the running backs in this league that I would choose over Willis strictly based on performace, that prove that he is a below average back. RB's I would rather have: 1. Ronnie Brown 2. Maroney 3. Rudi Johnson 4. Maurice Jones-Drew 5. Joseph Addai 6. L.T. 7. Larry Johnson 8. Travis Henry 9. Julius Jones 10. Tiki Barber (retiring) 11. Brian Westbrook 12. Shaun Alexander 13. Frank Gore 14. Stephen Jackson 15. Edgerrin James 16. Thomas Jones 17. Clinton Portis 18. Deuce McAllister 19. Reggie Bush 20. Warrick Dunn RB's Willis is better than: 1. Cedric Houston or Leon Washington 2. Reuben Droughns 3. Corey Dillon 4. Jamal Lewis 5. Lamont Jordan 6. Tatum Bell or Mike Bell 7. Fred Taylor 8. Ron Dayne or Wali Lundy 9. Chester Taylor 10. Ahman Green 11. Kevin Jones 12. DeShaun Foster 13. Cadillac Williams 20 better than Willis and 13 he is better than puts him at a below average RB in the NFL. Very accurate--altho Fred taylor when healthy........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Thank-you.............anybody that doesn't take just a little offense to what he said, imo is not a die-hard Bills fan. I think an athlete owes just a little bit of loyalty to the city and the fans in which he plays. Not that anything out of that buffons mouth matters, but it was a clear slap in the face to the fans that have had to suffer through watching him play like a bumbling fool for three years, to say the Bills should move to Toronto. im a die hard bills fan. and a die hard buffalonian. but im not the least bit irked about what he said. cause i dont read into his words, or take them out of context, or overreact about basically nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 It's incredible. When Moulds came out and said Holcomb should be the stater, this entire board was ready to run him out of town because he "needed to keep his mouth shut." When Travis spoke out and said drafting Willlis McGahee was a "slap in the face," this whole board was ready to run him out of town because he "needed to keep his mouth shut." Both those players have been to the Pro Bowl and were very productive for their teams. When WM speaks up about where he thinks the Bills should be moved to, the board is rushing to his defense. Amazing... Dawgg, You talk as if the fans were responsible for running Moulds and Henry off to Houston and Tennessee. The year Travis spoke out, he actually performed badly. He never could accept another RB on the roster and elevate his play further. Eric Moulds had declining skills as evident with his performance with the Texans when he spoke out against JP and in favor of Holcomb. I don't see how McGahees comments have disrupted that Bills locker room unlike what those two guys actually said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Moulds was speaking on behalf OF the locker room and as the longest tenured veteran on the team. Travis was speaking out after Willis was drafted (a year removed from a Pro Bowl). Willis is talking after a sub par year filled with hype and inconsistent play. Dawgg, You talk as if the fans were responsible for running Moulds and Henry off to Houston and Tennessee. The year Travis spoke out, he actually performed badly. He never could accept another RB on the roster and elevate his play further. Eric Moulds had declining skills as evident with his performance with the Texans when he spoke out against JP and in favor of Holcomb. I don't see how McGahees comments have disrupted that Bills locker room unlike what those two guys actually said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 im a die hard bills fan. and a die hard buffalonian. but im not the least bit irked about what he said. cause i dont read into his words, or take them out of context, or overreact about basically nothing. It seems the only thing that irks you are Buffalo fans that have a negative attitude towards Willis' support on the team's possible move to Toronto. Die hard Bills fan and Buffalonian? That's a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yall Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Did anyone notice the trend in that good analysis of WM vs. most other backs in the league, that the productive backs were on teams with good OL's ? Wm will be fine once we get a better OL that can open holes and keep DT's off of WM. My own personal spin on what any football player or movie star says is I couldn't care one little bit. Everyone has an opinion and no matter what you say someone will take issue with it, so screw it ! Who cares what WM says, people shouldn't pay that much attention to what they say in the first place. Personally I'm to busy living my life to take offense about what Wm says. Just my 3 cents. I recall having a pretty crappy o-line in 2002 and 2003 as well. Yet, Travis Henry managed 1438 and 1356 yards in those season with 13 and 10 touchdowns respectively. I don't mean that to be a comparison of the two backs per se, but a good back can still flourish even with a poor offensive line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obie_wan Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Also, I guess players really like Toronto because it is a big city with big life styles...compared to Buffalo. The real question is can Toronto support a NFL team along with its CFL, NHL and NBA teams. they won/t support it any worse than Buffalo does. The ability to support corporate luxury boxes will by itself make Toronto a muchmore attractive location than Buffalo. Not to mention all of the blackouts that will be avoided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yall Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 they won/t support it any worse than Buffalo does. The ability to support corporate luxury boxes will by itself make Toronto a muchmore attractive location than Buffalo. Not to mention all of the blackouts that will be avoided. As much as I do not want this to happen, there is no question that Toronto could support a team. It's the 5th largest city in North America, behind NYC, LA, Mexico City, and (I think) Chicago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 I recall having a pretty crappy o-line in 2002 and 2003 as well. Yet, Travis Henry managed 1438 and 1356 yards in those season with 13 and 10 touchdowns respectively. I don't mean that to be a comparison of the two backs per se, but a good back can still flourish even with a poor offensive line. What were their respective rushing averages the year that they both played behind the same offensive line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yall Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 What were their respective rushing averages the year that they both played behind the same offensive line? 3.5 vs. 4.1 Kinda hard to compare that year though, due to the overall number of carries each guy got (90 vs. 284). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 As much as I do not want this to happen, there is no question that Toronto could support a team. It's the 5th largest city in North America, behind NYC, LA, Mexico City, and (I think) Chicago. metro Toronto is very large--about 5.5 million including hamilton---but ranks behind Dallas,Washington/Baltimore,San Francisco,philadelphia and Boston as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 you guys are all acting like he came out, grabbed the mic and said "this team should move to toronto! buffalo sucks!" he was asked about A team in toronto, and he first said that it would probably be a good idea. THEN his next comment about moving the Bills there had more to do with fan base and proximity. and you know he's right. you think buffalo is in trouble now, if they put a new team in toronto the bills would be gone within 5 years. should he have said what he said? probably not. but he wasnt thinking about what all the oversensitive people in buffalo would think. sorry some dude from miami who happens to work in buffalo isnt woried about your feelings. but he was thinking in terms of what would be good for the NFL, the people that pay him. not about you. im sure he'll consult you before the next press conference. i dont like the thought of the Bills moving. ever. but its not like Willis McGahee was the first one to suggest it, and its all going to be his doing if the team moves. you guys are on a witch hunt because none of us like the idea and now you have a face to tag onto that idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yall Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 metro Toronto is very large--about 5.5 million including hamilton---but ranks behind Dallas,Washington/Baltimore,San Francisco,philadelphia and Boston as well. Actually that isn't true. The city became the 5th largest in NA in the late 90's when the metro area incorporated/expanded into the surrounding areas. But don't take my word for it: http://www.toronto.ca/invest-in-toronto/tor_overview.htm edit: Also - http://www.mongabay.com/igapo/North_American_cities.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 you guys are all acting like he came out, grabbed the mic and said "this team should move to toronto! buffalo sucks!" he was asked about A team in toronto, and he first said that it would probably be a good idea. THEN his next comment about moving the Bills there had more to do with fan base and proximity. and you know he's right. you think buffalo is in trouble now, if they put a new team in toronto the bills would be gone within 5 years. should he have said what he said? probably not. but he wasnt thinking about what all the oversensitive people in buffalo would think. sorry some dude from miami who happens to work in buffalo isnt woried about your feelings. but he was thinking in terms of what would be good for the NFL, the people that pay him. not about you. im sure he'll consult you before the next press conference. i dont like the thought of the Bills moving. ever. but its not like Willis McGahee was the first one to suggest it, and its all going to be his doing if the team moves. you guys are on a witch hunt because none of us like the idea and now you have a face to tag onto that idea. By making that comment, Willis was being disloyal to the City of Buffalo and the fans of their beloved Bills. You're right, he clearly isn't worried about the "feelings" of Bills fans. I'm not worried about Willis' feelings either. I just think he should do what he does best and go f himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted January 12, 2007 Share Posted January 12, 2007 Actually that isn't true. The city became the 5th largest in NA in the late 90's when the metro area incorporated/expanded into the surrounding areas. But don't take my word for it: http://www.toronto.ca/invest-in-toronto/tor_overview.htm edit: Also - http://www.mongabay.com/igapo/North_American_cities.htm It says CITY population there. I specifically mentioned metro area.because city population means little. Boston--a huge metro area--has only 400,000 or so residents. Look at wikipedia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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