Mile High Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 the question. Do you think the season is a wash? I realize that anything can happen to a football team on any given Sunday. But, do you really think that this team can make it to the playoffs with the oline, defensive play of late and Holcomb under the gun? My point is this: if we do not make the playoffs and keep Kelly in the whole year isn't that basically a push? Slowing down JP's prgress? My thoughts are we aren't going anywhere anyway this year so play JP and let him take his lumps. Are they seriously wasting their time with Kelly in there or is it just me? Anything less than a playoff appearance this year would be a huge disappointment, especially with the qb change. I have watched Holcomb and he's decent but long term I just don't see it. Thoughts? Put the kid back in..... After New England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 It may be a bit premature to throw in the towel when the team is just 3-4 and only 1/2 a game out of first place, but they do need to address the issues they haven't addressed in a while, namely the offensive and defensive lines. For now, w/ no ability to trade, there's little they can do except "coach up" the guys on the roster and hope for the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 the question. Do you think the season is a wash? I realize that anything can happen to a football team on any given Sunday. But, do you really think that this team can make it to the playoffs with the oline, defensive play of late and Holcomb under the gun? My point is this: if we do not make the playoffs and keep Kelly in the whole year isn't that basically a push? Slowing down JP's prgress? My thoughts are we aren't going anywhere anyway this year so play JP and let him take his lumps. Are they seriously wasting their time with Kelly in there or is it just me? Anything less than a playoff appearance this year would be a huge disappointment, especially with the qb change. I have watched Holcomb and he's decent but long term I just don't see it. Thoughts? Put the kid back in..... After New England. 485954[/snapback] I will repeat myself here, but the AFC East being so lousy this year is the last thing the Bills need. They actually have a shot at the playoffs this year, and at the very least be in the hunt, just cause the divison sucks so bad. My fear is that will lead into some sort of complacency and management will not see this team for what it really is, which is soft phsically, and especially on D old , and that major turnover needs to occur for us to contend for championships, not be in the playoff hunt with a sub.500 record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeRay Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 depends what you mean by a "wash". If you mean no playoffs, yes. But if you mean this season is just a "throw away" season and start giving significant time to the youngsters and clearing the path to the doorway for the high priced under producing vets like Teague, Williams, Villarial, Adams, etc., well, that's a little different because we were all sold that we were on the cusp of being a playoff team. We're not, and at this point I agree that we now should let the younger guys play and get ready to cut the vets loose after the season. I wouldn't have said this two weeks ago. But it's clear where this team is headed. If we go this route of playing the youngens and tossing the vets though, we are into another rebuild. I don't have a problem with another rebuild, but not with Donahoe still in this organization, even as ball boy. Because... if Donahoe is still here to begin his 3rd rebuild in 6 seasons, well, then if you continue to do what you did, you will continue to get what you got... and that is 29-42 and counting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 depends what you mean by a "wash". If you mean no playoffs, yes. But if you mean this season is just a "throw away" season and start giving significant time to the youngsters and clearing the path to the doorway for the high priced under producing vets like Teague, Williams, Villarial, Adams, etc., well, that's a little different because we were all sold that we were on the cusp of being a playoff team. We're not, and at this point I agree that we now should let the younger guys play and get ready to cut the vets loose after the season. I wouldn't have said this two weeks ago. But it's clear where this team is headed. If we go this route of playing the youngens and tossing the vets though, we are into another rebuild. I don't have a problem with another rebuild, but not with Donahoe still in this organization, even as ball boy. Because... if Donahoe is still here to begin his 3rd rebuild in 6 seasons, well, then if you continue to do what you did, you will continue to get what you got... and that is 29-42 and counting. 485986[/snapback] Sadly, deeray. I am starting to agree with you. I was a TD defender, but am at the breaking point. I just have not seen improvement in this team since the day Wade and Butler left town. However, I also must state I thought the Bills would be a good team this yaer, and I bought into this D based of off the last two years. I didn't buy into the fact they we were wipping on the dregs of the league last ytear.I also did not see them getting old this fast, but I also do not get paid $1M a year to see these thngs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanNC Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I'll admit things do look bleak. However, we were having this same conversation last year at this time with trashing the season, benching Beldsoe and letting JP develop when he came back from his injury. I'm of the mind that you don't move into developmental mode until you are mathematically eliminated from playoff contention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Avenger Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 Before the season started Donahoe said that this was not a rebuilding year and that the Bills would strive to get to the playoffs. He said having an inexperienced QB would not prevent us from reaching the post season - he expected JP to come up to speed quickly and be able to get us to the playoffs. Sounded great - we get the playoffs AND young QB who would come up to speed quickly and be able to lead an NFL team (think 2004 Steelers). Unfortunately, it doesn't look like those things aren't going to happen. JP's learning curve has been much steeper than anticipated. As a result, the playoffs are really out of reach with him behind center. The Bills have 2 options at this point - shoot for the playoffs or get Losman in there to continue his learning - it's pretty obvious you aren't going to be able to do BOTH things. As a Bills fan, I'd take either one of these things - a playoff appearance or a QB prepared to win in the future. What I fear is that when all is said and done we will end up with NEITHER thing - no playoffs, and a QB still as green as they come. That's when the season becomes a wash and that's when I get really upset as a fan. Kelly Holcomb taking us to 7-9 is an ugly thought. To me the choice is obvious - play JP and give up the idea of the post season. Call it throwing in the towel if you wish, but I see that the problems on this team go way beyond who's at QB, and consequently the playoffs aren't realistic (even with the Pats losing games). The sooner we realize this, the better off we'll be. I think many fans will be OK with getting JP some experience at the expense of some wins - I know I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Avenger Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I'll admit things do look bleak. However, we were having this same conversation last year at this time with trashing the season, benching Beldsoe and letting JP develop when he came back from his injury. I'm of the mind that you don't move into developmental mode until you are mathematically eliminated from playoff contention. 485997[/snapback] Are you OK then with waiting until week 12 or week 13 to get JP some playing time? I'm not. There needs to be a decision made prior to that - are we realistically trying to get to the playoffs or is it time we take some lumps and get the Kid some experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I will repeat myself here, but the AFC East being so lousy this year is the last thing the Bills need. They actually have a shot at the playoffs this year, and at the very least be in the hunt, just cause the divison sucks so bad. My fear is that will lead into some sort of complacency and management will not see this team for what it really is, which is soft phsically, and especially on D old , and that major turnover needs to occur for us to contend for championships, not be in the playoff hunt with a sub.500 record. 485968[/snapback] One of the reasons the Pats are at 3-3 is the schedule they have played.... Oakland, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, San Diego, Denver, Carolina.....All possible deep playoff teams except oakland.... Their schedule is getting better....they will get 6 shots at the rest of the mediocre AFC East.....that is at least 4 wins for them.... They have two more tough opponents in the Colts and the Bucaneers...Hoiwever both those games are at home and the game against the Bucs is Dec 17th.... The Bucs are I think 1 and **** in cold weather.....I don't see them losing that game to the Bucs.... Additionally they get to play the chiefs and saints..... I think of all the teams, the Pats have the easiset schedule remaining in the AFC East..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVJ Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 So if we make the playoffs its alright to leave Holcomb in there. I don't think so. This team ,as is...could never win a playoff game on the road against the Colts or Steelers. So screw the playoffs this year, and lets see if JPs our QB of the future. Just making the playoffs is not good enough for me. I have to get there with a team I see progress with and beleive has a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 Just making the playoffs is not good enough for me. Nor, apparently, is it good enough for TD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Coli Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 One of the reasons the Pats are at 3-3 is the schedule they have played....Oakland, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, San Diego, Denver, Carolina.....All possible deep playoff teams except oakland.... Their schedule is getting better....they will get 6 shots at the rest of the mediocre AFC East.....that is at least 4 wins for them.... They have two more tough opponents in the Colts and the Bucaneers...Hoiwever both those games are at home and the game against the Bucs is Dec 17th.... The Bucs are I think 1 and **** in cold weather.....I don't see them losing that game to the Bucs.... Additionally they get to play the chiefs and saints..... I think of all the teams, the Pats have the easiset schedule remaining in the AFC East..... 486007[/snapback] The Boston media thinks the Pats win all 6 games against their division opponents, and have a shot at "running the table" for the rest of the season. I hate them, but as far as the division goes, they could easily sweep it. I think their last two games are against Miami and the Jets. Jesus. (Note: They continually pronounce Losman's name wrong...including that idiot Smerlas) As for starting Losman, I was a vocal supporter of starting him last year, playoff run be damned. Let Holcomb get the beating of his lifetime this sunday, but start JPL the final eight games this year. This is not a playoff team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 One should not wish for debilitaing injury to any player (though I am pleased to see the Bills not the lights out on a key opponent and forcing him to the sideline for the rest of the game against the Bills). However. Tom Brady is playing so well and is so good that if he unfortunately is injured it is a little too much like catching lightening in a bottle for the Pats to figure that a move from Brady to their #2 would be just like their move from Bledsoe to Brady.. The fact remains that with the Bills a half game behind NE and NYJ and Miami as the competition that the Bills remain in the hunt big time because anything can happen and usually does in the NFL. It wasn't too long ago that only 1 NFL QB was able to start all 16 games in a season (Manning) and it is certainly possible that NE will run the table with NYJ, MI and our hapless Bills but not only is this unlikely it is not improbable at all that dame chance will have us facing a signficantly weakend Pats team over the rest of the season. This is not likely but is quite possible and thus reality makes it impossible to declare the season a wash already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 Unfortunately, this team is not ready for the playoffs. We kept saying that are pass defense was pretty good even though the run defense was lousy. Well, before Sunday, we haven't played one team that had much of a passing game. The Raiders showed just how bad we are as a total defense. Most of the teams we play here on out can both run the ball and pass. We are in a heap of trouble the rest of the season. I say we go the route the Giants did last year and put Losman in right away. Mularkey claimed JP has taken the high road and prepares every week like he's the starter. Well, let him start now. We know we are going to get crushed at NE on Sunday, so its not going to hurt him any. Let him learn how to handle something like this, right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East Brady Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I'll admit things do look bleak. However, we were having this same conversation last year at this time with trashing the season, benching Beldsoe and letting JP develop when he came back from his injury. I'm of the mind that you don't move into developmental mode until you are mathematically eliminated from playoff contention. 485997[/snapback] In the current salarycap NFL, mthematical elimination usually doesn't occur until week 15, even for teams with 2 wins. Its time to cut our loss's and move forward after the pats thump our butts this sunday night.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I say we go the route the Giants did last year and put Losman in right away. Mularkey claimed JP has taken the high road and prepares every week like he's the starter. Well, let him start now. We know we are going to get crushed at NE on Sunday, so its not going to hurt him any. Let him learn how to handle something like this, right now. 486041[/snapback] I'm all for JP starting, but not this week. It would be like throwing him to the wolves to put him back in there for a prime time game on the road against the Super Bowl champs. Let Holcomb go this weekend and unless the Bills pull off the huge upset put Losman back in coming off the bye week against KC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 the question. Do you think the season is a wash? I realize that anything can happen to a football team on any given Sunday. But, do you really think that this team can make it to the playoffs with the oline, defensive play of late and Holcomb under the gun? My point is this: if we do not make the playoffs and keep Kelly in the whole year isn't that basically a push? Slowing down JP's prgress? My thoughts are we aren't going anywhere anyway this year so play JP and let him take his lumps. Are they seriously wasting their time with Kelly in there or is it just me? Anything less than a playoff appearance this year would be a huge disappointment, especially with the qb change. I have watched Holcomb and he's decent but long term I just don't see it. Thoughts? Put the kid back in..... After New England. 485954[/snapback] Well here is my thought on that...Never in a hundred million years will you hear a Team admit to "A Re-Building Year" until well after that particular Year. Example "Well Last Year was more like a re-building/re-tooling year...etc." But it seems to me, even with the rosiest of rose-colored glasses, there is almost no way anyone could look at the way this Season has gone thusfar, and what remains on the Schedule this Season, and take away much hope for a turn around... Yes I know The Bills are only 3-4...I've watched ever Down this Year the same way I have for the Last 15 Years or so...The combined Record of the Teams the Bills have defeated this Season 4-15....All 3 Wins have come at Home and furthermore, in 2 out of the 3 Victories, the Visitors were within a TD in the 4th Quarter. Not really much to hang your Hat on... Would the Bills have lost one of those Games with JP at QB (vs The Jets or Miami)? Maybe...But seeing as though neither of those 2 teams is very good, does it not say something loud-and-clear about The Bills Talent/Team overall that either of those 2 Games could have been losses by replacing one Player...QB or not? Now due to the fact that Buffalo is only a half Game out of 1st Place in the Division with a HUGE Road Game coming up Sunday Night, I understand that you can't just scrap the Season now...But if in fact the Bills get their butts handed to them in NE the way I believe (note the word is believe...not hope...) they will, is their really any other option but to put JP in there and let him take his lumps for the remainder of 2005? To be honest the last thing I am looking forward to is seeing JP in there struggling again, or hearing the WR's answer questions about what is wrong with the Passing Game...But at some point in time the Bills HAVE to cut their losses (so-to-speak)...And if JP is as good as The Coaches continue to tell us he can be, then why would they hesitate at all? They gave the Vets what they wanted, they Played the Vet QB, and at the End of 4 weeks they will likely be 2-2 with Holcomb...A loss at NE almost HAS to lead to JP back as the Starter at QB...I just don't see where the Bills Coaches have much of a choice otherwise... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanone Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 One side of me is a realist and realizes the team stinks. The other half realizes that they play the games for a reason and anything can happen on any given Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted October 25, 2005 Share Posted October 25, 2005 I will repeat myself here, but the AFC East being so lousy this year is the last thing the Bills need. They actually have a shot at the playoffs this year, and at the very least be in the hunt, just cause the divison sucks so bad. My fear is that will lead into some sort of complacency and management will not see this team for what it really is, which is soft phsically, and especially on D old , and that major turnover needs to occur for us to contend for championships, not be in the playoff hunt with a sub.500 record. 485968[/snapback] The thing we all fail to remember is that this is a BUSINESS. If the bills get into a playoff game, that's that much more $$$ for Ralph from ticket sales, food sales, jerseys etc... Keep that in mind, TD is generating $$$ for Ralph which is what his whole position is about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mile High Posted October 25, 2005 Author Share Posted October 25, 2005 Unfortunately, this team is not ready for the playoffs. We kept saying that are pass defense was pretty good even though the run defense was lousy. Well, before Sunday, we haven't played one team that had much of a passing game. The Raiders showed just how bad we are as a total defense. Most of the teams we play here on out can both run the ball and pass. We are in a heap of trouble the rest of the season. I say we go the route the Giants did last year and put Losman in right away. Mularkey claimed JP has taken the high road and prepares every week like he's the starter. Well, let him start now. We know we are going to get crushed at NE on Sunday, so its not going to hurt him any. Let him learn how to handle something like this, right now. 486041[/snapback] Your right, and for people who compare say oh last years record was 0-4 at the start, it's time to wake up. I honestly thought we had a shot at Oakland. I was wrong. Our pass defense was ranked second going into the Oakland game giving up something like 130 yards a game. Statistically it ws a good match up. Is it Grey? One has to wonder..... Nate isn't the shut down corner people thought he was. I noticed shades of that when he couldn't cover Stallworth in the Saints game. This team is seriously in trouble. And I usually have a positve attitude about the Bills. There has to be some kind of a shake up soon. I saw no heart or guts in the game last week. It's like they are just there to collect a paycheck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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