I didn't see this posted, Bills sign Safety Tre Herndon

[The Jokeman]

20 hours ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

https://www.si.com/nfl/bills/news/transactions-tre-herndon-bills-fill-safety-need-signing-former-jaguars-starter-releasing-tight-end

 

My guess is the Bishop continued injury plague was the reason.

I threw it in the Week 2 discussion as wasn't sure it fully warranted it's own thread. I think he crossed paths with Ryan Nielsen in Jacksonville and New Orleans. Solid add at this point. 

[HamptonBillsfan]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

What is it about him that makes you so convinced he will fail?

It’s just when I hear a guy is not great at the point of attack against the run and is suspect at tackling, like all the scouting reports say, along with being injured, it smells like a 1st round reach.

[GunnerBill]

17 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

It’s just when I hear a guy is not great at the point of attack against the run and is suspect at tackling, like all the scouting reports say, along with being injured, it smells like a 1st round reach.

 

So basically it is a gut feel based on reading scouting reports?

[HamptonBillsfan]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

So basically it is a gut feel based on reading scouting reports?

That and the reviews on his training camp performance have been not  glowing and then he suffers the injury that limits his development. This is my opinion based on the information available.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

That and the reviews on his training camp performance have been not  glowing and then he suffers the injury that limits his development. This is my opinion based on the information available.

 

He practiced for about 5 days before getting hurt... and while I agree the reports weren't glowing they weren't terrible either. There is a ton more information available..... 32 starts worth of game film from the University of Kentucky. And this is not saying you are only allowed to be positive..... but I'm not surprised you get push back on such a strong negative opinion (to the point of saying you will stop posting if you are wrong) based on reading a few scouting reports and 5 days of training camp his rookie year. 

[HamptonBillsfan]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He practiced for about 5 days before getting hurt... and while I agree the reports weren't glowing they weren't terrible either. There is a ton more information available..... 32 starts worth of game film from the University of Kentucky. And this is not saying you are only allowed to be positive..... but I'm not surprised you get push back on such a strong negative opinion (to the point of saying you will stop posting if you are wrong) based on reading a few scouting reports and 5 days of training camp his rookie year. 

I hope I’m wrong.

[warrior9]

41 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

It’s just when I hear a guy is not great at the point of attack against the run and is suspect at tackling, like all the scouting reports say, along with being injured, it smells like a 1st round reach.

Guess who's scouting report this is: 

 

Weaknesses

Finesse cornerback with relatively slender frame. Physicality and play strength a concern from slot. Big-bodied slot targets will post him up in space and drive him off the line in run game. Tackles when necessary, but doesn't seek out contact. Less technique-oriented and more grabby from slot. Finished career with just six interceptions despite extensive playing time. Early anchor from off coverage caused struggles opening hips when receivers would stem and go. Recovery-quick but not recovery-fast. Texas Tech speedster Jakeem Grant gave him all kinds of vertical work in 2015 Texas Bowl.

[HamptonBillsfan]

5 minutes ago, warrior9 said:

Guess who's scouting report this is: 

 

Weaknesses

Finesse cornerback with relatively slender frame. Physicality and play strength a concern from slot. Big-bodied slot targets will post him up in space and drive him off the line in run game. Tackles when necessary, but doesn't seek out contact. Less technique-oriented and more grabby from slot. Finished career with just six interceptions despite extensive playing time. Early anchor from off coverage caused struggles opening hips when receivers would stem and go. Recovery-quick but not recovery-fast. Texas Tech speedster Jakeem Grant gave him all kinds of vertical work in 2015 Texas Bowl.

Who’s 

[Sierra Foothills]

19 hours ago, Walking Tall said:

Bishop needs to ride off into the sunset with Spector.

 

In your scenario do you see them on separate horses or the same horse? Side saddle?

 

17 hours ago, Logic said:

Just to be clear, all the griping in this thread is directed toward Bishop, who returned to practice today and practiced in full, right?

 

Just to play devil's advocate, isn't it possible that Bishop returned to practice sooner than he would have had McDermott not expressed his frustration?

 

30 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

That and the reviews on his training camp performance have been not  glowing and then he suffers the injury that limits his development. This is my opinion based on the information available.

 

Hairston was injured on day 6 of training camp. He had as many good moments as he had learning moments.

 

13 minutes ago, warrior9 said:

Guess who's scouting report this is: 

 

Weaknesses

Finesse cornerback with relatively slender frame. Physicality and play strength a concern from slot. Big-bodied slot targets will post him up in space and drive him off the line in run game. Tackles when necessary, but doesn't seek out contact. Less technique-oriented and more grabby from slot. Finished career with just six interceptions despite extensive playing time. Early anchor from off coverage caused struggles opening hips when receivers would stem and go. Recovery-quick but not recovery-fast. Texas Tech speedster Jakeem Grant gave him all kinds of vertical work in 2015 Texas Bowl.

 

Tre White?

 

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

I’m all for some comic relief on this board with the heightened sensitivity shown when someone offers up some objectivity on the negative side of a draft choice or FA acquisition. Since your cynical approach to accepting what is the collective opinion of scouts that do this stuff for a living, is belittling the messenger, what are you willing to do if Hairston is a liability? With your history of taking yourself really seriously, I’m sure you’ll just go into denial mode.

The world isn’t made of black and white.  There’s plenty of grey.  Most rookies who haven’t played a down yet are seen in the grey area. They could be good. They good be bad or they could be in between.  
 

All of your statements are stated as absolutes.  Hancock IS already better than Bishop. Hairston and Bishop ARE stains on Beane.  Your feelings about these players ARE THE TRUTH.  
 

I don’t claim to KNOW anything about any of these guys except that they are both great athletes with speed (something our secondary hasn’t had).  I don’t know much about either kid as a person and what’s in their heart and head.  Yet somehow….you know it all.  And it’s funny.  

 

15 hours ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

Hancock is already better than Bishop. Bishop is soft and injury prone and he’s often out of position. Hairston and Bishop are a stain on Beane and his scouting department. I’m terribly sorry if that disappoints fans who can’t handle the truth. Explain what you like about Bishop and then think of the criticism leveled against Hairston at training camp and then he gets seriously injured. If he turns out to be a good pro I’ll stop posting.

 

 

[Starr Almighty]

I guessing we are throwing a party before cut downs to thank the guys. Hence we needed some extra Tre's .

[HamptonBillsfan]

2 minutes ago, NewEra said:

The world isn’t made of black and white.  There’s plenty of grey.  Most rookies who haven’t played a down yet are seen in the grey area. They could be good. They good be bad or they could be in between.  
 

All of your statements are stated as absolutes.  Hancock IS already better than Bishop. Hairston and Bishop ARE stains on Beane.  Your feelings about these players ARE THE TRUTH.  
 

I don’t claim to KNOW anything about any of these guys except that they are both great athletes with speed (something our secondary hasn’t had).  I don’t know much about either kid as a person and what’s in their heart and head.  Yet somehow….you know it all.  And it’s funny.  

 

 

Your response indicates you’re  an individual that can make a solid argument about a topic that only calls for conjecture, so you’re absolutely right calling Hancock a better prospect at this stage is just a feeling.. The reason people make these declarations is they have an OPINION based on the information available and feel justified for the purposes of this potpourri of ideas, throwing it out for public consumption. I don’t agree that the statements you referenced are made as absolutes. It’s just what these social media platforms consist of. If you are offended by anything that comes across as highly charged opinions, you are in the wrong business as a regular contributor  on this board. The majority of posters seem to express opinions as fact.

[HamptonBillsfan]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

The world isn’t made of black and white.  There’s plenty of grey.  Most rookies who haven’t played a down yet are seen in the grey area. They could be good. They good be bad or they could be in between.  
 

All of your statements are stated as absolutes.  Hancock IS already better than Bishop. Hairston and Bishop ARE stains on Beane.  Your feelings about these players ARE THE TRUTH.  
 

I don’t claim to KNOW anything about any of these guys except that they are both great athletes with speed (something our secondary hasn’t had).  I don’t know much about either kid as a person and what’s in their heart and head.  Yet somehow….you know it all.  And it’s funny.  

 

 

When I said some fans can’t handle the truth, I was referring mainly to Bishop. He has been mostly a disappointment and has underperformed his draft selection. Hairston, was not a highly regarded corner by scouting operations and we took in the 1st round. He was not considered a first rounder with his performance in college. 

[gonzo1105]

38 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

When I said some fans can’t handle the truth, I was referring mainly to Bishop. He has been mostly a disappointment and has underperformed his draft selection. Hairston, was not a highly regarded corner by scouting operations and we took in the 1st round. He was not considered a first rounder with his performance in college. 

 

I agree with you that to this point that Bishop has been disappointing mostly due to injury and not being able to overtake Hamlin last year as a rookie but a lot of that has to do with system. I hope he takes the leap as I was incredibly high on him coming out of the draft and believe that he has a great deal of potential. A future Bishop/Hancock tandem would be awesome for the next decade and makes a lot of sense in the SS/FS fit more than Rapp/Bishop. I think that might be the idea to be honest as Rapp is on an easily manageable contract after this year where the Bills would save close to 3.5 million while taking on only a 600,000 cap hit.

 

As for Hairston I don't think anyone could make any opinion on his career to this point though its not great that he got hurt and will miss a lot of reps much like Bishop did last year. I think it is arguable whether Hairston should have been a first round pick. I think he should have been. He has the ability to play both man and zone coverage which is a very valuable trait to the Bills right now. Add in the fact that the Bills had to get extremely more athletic in their secondary and it led to Hairston being the pick with a big need to boot. Good news is they drafted Dorian Strong as well who has looked very solid as a rookie and they have Hancock and brought in quite a bit of insurance in White/Jackson. How good will they be, who knows but the Bills did protect themselves at least in the short team. 

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

Your response indicates you’re  an individual that can make a solid argument about a topic that only calls for conjecture, so you’re absolutely right calling Hancock a better prospect at this stage is just a feeling.. The reason people make these declarations is they have an OPINION based on the information available and feel justified for the purposes of this potpourri of ideas, throwing it out for public consumption. I don’t agree that the statements you referenced are made as absolutes. It’s just what these social media platforms consist of. If you are offended by anything that comes across as highly charged opinions, you are in the wrong business as a regular contributor  on this board. The majority of posters seem to express opinions as fact.

offended?  lol.  I asked you to keep posting even if you’re wrong.  I find your posts humorous.  

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

When I said some fans can’t handle the truth, I was referring mainly to Bishop. He has been mostly a disappointment and has underperformed his draft selection. Hairston, was not a highly regarded corner by scouting operations and we took in the 1st round. He was not considered a first rounder with his performance in college. 

Pretty sure every Bills fan sees Bishop as a disappointment so far.  Not everyone has already claimed him to be a bust.  
 

Regarding Hairston, what “scouting operations” do you speak of.  Nearly all of them had him as a late 1st early - 2nd rd pick.  My go-to is Dane Brugler.  I think he puts in the most time and I respect his opinion more than most.  He had Hairston as a 1st-2nd rd pick, 4th best corner in the draft behind Hunter, Barron and Johnson.  
 

regarding the bolded, funny how you just make stuff up with these generalized statements.  “He was not considered a first rounder with his performance in college”.  As if there is a council deciding these things.  Some had him as a first.  Some didn’t.  But pretend that the council in your head is real.  

[HamptonBillsfan]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

offended?  lol.  I asked you to keep posting even if you’re wrong.  I find your posts humorous.  

Oh so that passive aggressive cynicism is you finding the posts amusing. I’m happy to review Hairston’s performance relative to his draft selection with you and the rest of the board halfway through the season. He’s slight, injury prone and had problems tackling in college. The guys on ESPN and NFL Network didn’t think he was the best cb  pick when we drafted.  The council in my head feels like our secondary needs a better corner to cover the top receivers with the teams on our schedule. 

[HamptonBillsfan]

3 hours ago, gonzo1105 said:

 

I agree with you that to this point that Bishop has been disappointing mostly due to injury and not being able to overtake Hamlin last year as a rookie but a lot of that has to do with system. I hope he takes the leap as I was incredibly high on him coming out of the draft and believe that he has a great deal of potential. A future Bishop/Hancock tandem would be awesome for the next decade and makes a lot of sense in the SS/FS fit more than Rapp/Bishop. I think that might be the idea to be honest as Rapp is on an easily manageable contract after this year where the Bills would save close to 3.5 million while taking on only a 600,000 cap hit.

 

As for Hairston I don't think anyone could make any opinion on his career to this point though its not great that he got hurt and will miss a lot of reps much like Bishop did last year. I think it is arguable whether Hairston should have been a first round pick. I think he should have been. He has the ability to play both man and zone coverage which is a very valuable trait to the Bills right now. Add in the fact that the Bills had to get extremely more athletic in their secondary and it led to Hairston being the pick with a big need to boot. Good news is they drafted Dorian Strong as well who has looked very solid as a rookie and they have Hancock and brought in quite a bit of insurance in White/Jackson. How good will they be, who knows but the Bills did protect themselves at least in the short team. 

Well presented, optimistic post. I’m hoping Hairston knows that in our defense he has to stick his nose into the fray in run support without going on the IR. Let him look like Benford and Tre when bringing down a 260 lb TE and start changing my tune.

[NewEra]

10 hours ago, NewEra said:

Keep posting even if he becomes all pro.  You’re obviously some sort of scouting prodigy. We need you here.  Please don’t go!  
 

We could use some laughs.

 

29 minutes ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

Oh so that passive aggressive cynicism is you finding the posts amusing. I’m happy to review Hairston’s performance relative to his draft selection with you and the rest of the board halfway through the season. He’s slight, injury prone and had problems tackling in college. The guys on ESPN and NFL Network didn’t think he was the best cb  pick when we drafted.  The council in my head feels like our secondary needs a better corner to cover the top receivers with the teams on our schedule. 

I thought my post was relatively easy going.  
 

Regarding the bolded, we have Christian to cover the top receivers on each team.  We just need someone that can avoid getting get farmed and come up with a big play in the playoffs.  Hairston has that ability imo.  
 

I agree that his build and penchant for injury gives reason to worry.  That was my one gripe about the pick. Not talent and ability.  He’s not a rail thin kid.  He’s put a good build on himself since the college season ended. 
 

Bottom line- the jury is still out.  Calling players busts in August of their rookie year is for amateurs imo

[warrior9]

23 hours ago, HamptonBillsfan said:

Who’s 

Tre White.. turned out to be an All Pro. Max will be fine.