SCBills Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, gobills404 said: The Bills have allowed 19.5 ppg and 306 ypg since 2018. During that same time they allowed 25.4 ppg and 346 ypg in games that Edmunds missed. The defense has been objectively much worse without Edmunds since he was drafted. Like it’s not even up for debate. We also had a defense centered around Edmunds in the middle of it, with a backup who’s taken limited practice reps, filling in. I’ll be honest, MLB is the least of my concerns .. and I’m glad we’re not spending any legitimate money at that position. We won’t go as Bernard/Williams/Dodson goes. The DL and Secondary will define our defense … for better or worse. I believe, better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 On 6/14/2023 at 6:39 PM, billsfan89 said: A little over a month away from camp how are you feeling about the Bills 2023 roster compared to how you were feeling as a fan about the 2022 roster going into the season? Do you feel better, worse, or about the same? Breaking it down position by position group I will leave my thoughts below. Special Teams - Better in 2023 The Bills in 2022 had Bass as a kicker and Ariza as the punter and a strong overall group of ST specialists like Tyler Matakevich and T.Jones. The only hole on Special Teams was the returning game was not really all that great. Going into 2023 the Bills still have Bass and instead of Ariza they have Martin who is a vet punter still fairly young coming off a good season with the Bills replacing Ariza. The Bills no longer have T. Jones but they still have a ton of other specialists on the roster including Matakevich. The Bills also going into 2023 have Hines and Hardy as returners which represents a massive upgrade over the options they had going into 2022. Secondary - Even The Bills were really shaky at CB going into 2022. Tre was coming off a serious injury and likely to miss time and not come back to form. Elam was drafted in round 1 but still a rookie. Outside of T.Johnson there wasn't much stability. But the back end at safety induced more confidence going into 2022. Not only were Hyde and Poyer a year younger but they weren't coming off major injuries. Going into 2023 I like Tre to have a return to form and Elam, Benford, and Dane Jackson are all more experienced this season. But I am also less confident in Po and Hyde both a year older and Hyde coming off a serious injury and Po coming off a year where he was really banged up. The Bills do have better depth at safety with Hamlin getting some snaps and Rapp a solid vet backup. Overall even money for me. Linebacker - Worse in 2023 The Bills entered into 2022 with Milano and Edumonds two high-quality young LB's and Edumonds was entering into a contract year so extra motivation on him, the depth at LB was not really all that great. Going into 2023 Milano is still there but Edumonds is going being replaced by Klein a decent vet and a third-round pick in Dorian Williams. I know a lot of people on here weren't Edumonds fans and I agree with the decision not to resign him. But the Bills will likely see a decline in LB play unless Williams or another player on the roster overachieves. Defensive line - Even If it weren't for Von's injury I would rate 2023 as having an edge with the Poona Ford and Floyd additions. But despite getting a second quality NT and a nice vet pass rusher in Floyd Von coming off a serious injury causes a lot of concern. Feeling about equal, I think the Bills should have a top-quality D-line going into both 2022 and 2023. The defense overall - Slightly worse going into 2023 I liked the defense in 2022 to be the best defense if not at least a top 3 unit going into 2023. But with the likely decline of LB play I think the Bills defense may regress a bit but should still be a top 7-10 unit in the league and could easily be a top 5 unit. But I do think that the defense will feel the absence of Edumonds and there are some more holes going into 2023. Still, the defense should be a good unit. QB - Even Josh is still the franchise QB and the backups are of even quality. Not much to say here. RB - Better in 2023 I thought the Bills had a decent RB trio going into 2022. Cook as a second-round rookie, Singletary and Moss not super inspiring but not tragic either. 2023 the Bills have Cook with a year under his belt and swapped out Moss for Hines who is a much better more dynamic role player. The Bills then swap out Singletary and T.Jones for true power back in Harris and Murray. I think the Bills are much better situated at RB. WR- Even The Bills in 2022 had Diggs and not a lot else proven otherwise. Going into 2023 the Bills are in a similar spot. Davis disappointed in 2022 but going into 2023 the hope is that on a contract year with a full season under his belt as the WR2 maybe he can perform better. Hardy and Sheffield are nice adds to replace Mac and Kumerow but aren't major upgrades either. Shakir has a year under his belt but overall the feeling about the WR group is about the same as last season. TE - Better in 2023 Knox is still there and hopefully won't suffer personal tragedy which would impact anyone and then there is the addition on Kincaid who is far better than OJ Howard who entered into the mix at TE going into 2022. Just overall a lot more talent in the group with the addition of Kincaid. O-line - Better in 2023 The Bills in 2022 were heading into the season with their thinnest O-line group since 2018 and hoping to get a decent season out of Saffold at guard. 2023 they majorly upgraded the guard position getting a younger better-starting guard in Connor McGovern and the best guard in the draft in Torrence. In addition they brought in Edwards as more guard depth and Bates hopefully kicks back onto the bench. Queese is back again along with Snell who should provide some competition for Brown. Overall the O-line is just vastly better going into 2023. Offense overall- Better in 2023 With the addition of Kincaid, McGovern, Torrence and other smaller parts like Hines and Hardy the Bills have better offensive pieces around Josh by a significant margin. 2022 I had massive concerns about the O-line and O-line depth whereas in 2023 my only major concern about the O-line is who is Dawkins backup and whether could they find a better player to compete with Brown (Both of which were concerns entering into 2022). Kincaid adds what hopefully will be a quality weapon and the RB group looks better as well. Team overall - Even Even though component by component, I feel as though the 2023 Bills may be better than the 2022 Bills I had Super Bowl expectations going into 2022 and I have the same Super Bowl expectations in 2023. I do think that the Bills are in a position in 2023 to compete better as I think the offense has the tools to be more consistent and while I think the defense may not be as strong it will still be a very good unit overall. TLDR: Bills have a better ST and offense going into 2023 but the defense is not as good going into 2023 as it was in 2022. Agree with you everywhere except D line. I think they are better as more solid proven depth with Floyd and Ford. Miller missed a good chunk of last season too. Plus Groot, AJ and Basham all have another year under their belt and should be some improvement. Even if AJ and Basham are gone after this year and labeled a bust, would think there'd be some improvement even if small. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 37 minutes ago, SCBills said: We also had a defense centered around Edmunds in the middle of it, with a backup who’s taken limited practice reps, filling in. I’ll be honest, MLB is the least of my concerns .. and I’m glad we’re not spending any legitimate money at that position. We won’t go as Bernard/Williams/Dodson goes. The DL and Secondary will define our defense … for better or worse. I believe, better. If I am playing the Bills I am going to attack the middle of the field. Will be interesting to see how this plays out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobills404 Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 59 minutes ago, SCBills said: We also had a defense centered around Edmunds in the middle of it, with a backup who’s taken limited practice reps, filling in. I’ll be honest, MLB is the least of my concerns .. and I’m glad we’re not spending any legitimate money at that position. We won’t go as Bernard/Williams/Dodson goes. The DL and Secondary will define our defense … for better or worse. I believe, better. Yeah I’m not super worried either. Whoever the MLB is will have a tons of great players around them and I’m sure McD won’t put as much on their plate. I just think saying we’re better off without Edmunds is nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermes Posted June 16, 2023 Share Posted June 16, 2023 1 hour ago, gobills404 said: The Bills have allowed 19.5 ppg and 306 ypg since 2018. During that same time they allowed 25.4 ppg and 346 ypg in games that Edmunds missed. The defense has been objectively much worse without Edmunds since he was drafted. Like it’s not even up for debate. That's actually a pretty impressive statistical drop-off showing how much Edmunds does impact the defense. It will be interesting to see how the defense responds to his absence. A TD and 40 ypg is nothing to scoff at 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Posted June 19, 2023 Share Posted June 19, 2023 Feel better about the offense. I think the improvements on the line and Kincaid are meaningful improvements. Worse on the defense. Last year we started with a fully healthy Von Miller, Micah Hyde and Jordan Poyer, and an expecation that Tre White could come back to form. Now all four of those players are a year older and a question mark coming into the season. Feel neutral on coaching. McDermott's weaknesses as a coach are game day management. Its not clear to me how taking on double duty has HC and DC is going to help him improve his game day performances. On 6/16/2023 at 3:22 PM, Hermes said: That's actually a pretty impressive statistical drop-off showing how much Edmunds does impact the defense. It will be interesting to see how the defense responds to his absence. A TD and 40 ypg is nothing to scoff at In reality it means t the five games Edmunds missed since 2019 are not enough for a meaningful statistical comparsion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermes Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 (edited) On 6/19/2023 at 7:44 AM, Chaos said: In reality it means t the five games Edmunds missed since 2019 are not enough for a meaningful statistical comparsion. The issue is that if he did have a statistically significant number of games to compare then he would be considered injury prone. There's also loads of other contributing factors that would impact the data (i.e. what/if any other defensive starters also missed time, the strength of the offenses played during those games, how weather may have factored into games, etc.) It's just too hard to accurately quantify an individual players contribution to overall team performance. I look at it as a a big hit to the Bills defense but McDermott will change things up to scheme around losing Edmunds Edited June 20, 2023 by Hermes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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