leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: For probably the millionth time: The difference between the two is that Trump obstructed law enforcement. And you can easily prove intent with Trump. So no. Given the current facts, I would expect an indictment for Trump but not for Biden. Literally the entirety of Part 2 of the Mueller report AND the obstruction of the documents investigation are examples of Trump obstructing an investigation and refusing to cooperate with authorities. The ultimate resolution of Mueller was no obstruction, and an AG stating emphatically that what happened in this absurd spectacle based on lies and innuendo was that what happened to Trump should never, ever happen to a president again. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDHillFan Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Has everyone forgotten the existence of boxes? Like, do you think he had a document marked classified sitting on the passenger seat of his vette? Or does he have X-ray vision and can automatically detect that there’s a classified document in any room? If it comes out during the investigation that he knew about the documents, then that changes things. But you’re just speculating based on what you want to be true. THEY WERE IN BOXES!! Further illustrating your ignorance about classified info security. Carry on. 🤦 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 6 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Has everyone forgotten the existence of boxes? Like, do you think he had a document marked classified sitting on the passenger seat of his vette? Or does he have X-ray vision and can automatically detect that there’s a classified document in any room? If it comes out during the investigation that he knew about the documents, then that changes things. But you’re just speculating based on what you want to be true. Hunter vacuumed the carpet and smoked parm Cheese in an effort to get a buzz. could he have gotten his hands on them? and countless other questions. 8 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Has everyone forgotten the existence of boxes? Like, do you think he had a document marked classified sitting on the passenger seat of his vette? Or does he have X-ray vision and can automatically detect that there’s a classified document in any room? If it comes out during the investigation that he knew about the documents, then that changes things. But you’re just speculating based on what you want to be true. With every comment you prove you have no experience with anything classified. YES. with classified documents the possession, storage and disposal process is very well documented. from the sounds of it they were in boxes just sitting with other garage stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDHillFan Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 3 hours ago, redtail hawk said: not chaste but decent. he f'd up here and it will appropriately cost him. trump's indecent and leading others into indecency. he f's up all the time, often purposefully and it only occasionally costs him. I get it. life's not fair. but I don't cheer for cheaters. A decent man that refuses to acknowledge the existence of his young granddaughter. Interesting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: The ultimate resolution of Mueller was no obstruction, and an AG stating emphatically that what happened in this absurd spectacle based on lies and innuendo was that what happened to Trump should never, ever happen to a president again. This is absolutely false. Mueller specifically stated that Trump met the elements of obstruction multiple times but couldn’t be charged because he was president. He also stated that the proper remedy was impeachment. Try reading the actual report instead of a summary that was so misleading that Mueller complained to Barr about it. 3 minutes ago, JDHillFan said: THEY WERE IN BOXES!! Further illustrating your ignorance about classified info security. Carry on. 🤦 It’s bad that he had them! I’m just pointing out that one doesn’t automatically know everything that is on a room when they walk into it. I have boxes in my garage, I’m not 100% of everything that’s in them. 3 minutes ago, Chris farley said: Hunter vacuumed the carpet and smoked parm Cheese in an effort to get a buzz. could he have gotten his hands on them? and countless other questions. Questions that will be answered by the special counsel investigation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 15 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Has everyone forgotten the existence of boxes? Like, do you think he had a document marked classified sitting on the passenger seat of his vette? Or does he have X-ray vision and can automatically detect that there’s a classified document in any room? If it comes out during the investigation that he knew about the documents, then that changes things. But you’re just speculating based on what you want to be true. Oh, the excuse is "they were in boxes." 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, ChiGoose said: It’s bad that he had them! I’m just pointing out that one doesn’t automatically know everything that is on a room when they walk into it. I have boxes in my garage, I’m not 100% of everything that’s in them. you do when its classified and your job in ended. Destruction of classified documents is part of the entire classification process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDHillFan Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 (edited) 22 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: It’s bad that he had them! I’m just pointing out that one doesn’t automatically know everything that is on a room when they walk into it. I have boxes in my garage, I’m not 100% of everything that’s in them. For someone that tries to show him/herself as a superior thinker you really sh*t the bed with the “what about boxes” argument. No worries. It happens to all of us. Edited January 16, 2023 by JDHillFan Bed - not bad. Inexcusable. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Buffalo Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 30 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: For probably the millionth time: The difference between the two is that Trump obstructed law enforcement. And you can easily prove intent with Trump. So no. Given the current facts, I would expect an indictment for Trump but not for Biden. Literally the entirety of Part 2 of the Mueller report AND the obstruction of the documents investigation are examples of Trump obstructing an investigation and refusing to cooperate with authorities. So no crime actually committed by Trump, as I said cooperating with prosecutors is only a sign of innocence to someone who has already made a decision about guilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Buffalo Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 5 hours ago, Orlando Tim said: Cooperating with law enforcement is not a sign of innocence except to those who already have made their determination of guilt. Trump has always cooperated except when the media said he did not. @redtail hawk you actually believe that "cooperating with authorities" is a sign of innocence? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherpa Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 10 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: It’s bad that he had them! I’m just pointing out that one doesn’t automatically know everything that is on a room when they walk into it. I have boxes in my garage, I’m not 100% of everything that’s in them. You are digging deeper. You don't simply throw classified material in a box, and pack it like any moving item. Further, you are required that anyone who has access to it has appropriate security clearances, and depending on level, a need to know. This is gross negligence. It is this attitude that permeates the gov including Congress and their staffs, and it's exactly why we get less cooperation from the Brits and more specifically the Israelis in security and intel matters. There is a view that the US doesn't treat this stuff with anywhere near the level of importance that other countries do, and our porous history is embarrassing, and ultimately expensive if not dangerous. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 I marvel at the rabbit hole the media has taken you all down here. Biden is 'guilty' as all heck of possessing those documents...and everyone knows it. What isn't being discussed is what were the actual contents of the documents! Come on people! There aren't that many of them. Can we not have a select few classification cleared individuals (a couple of Senators from both political parties) take a serious look at the documents, in a conference room....together? Is that really too much to ask? If the documents are about security at the annual Easter Egg hunt then honestly, who cares? But, if the documents all point to Hunter, the Ukrainian or Chinese money scandals, then we have an entirely different story. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 17 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said: So no crime actually committed by Trump, as I said cooperating with prosecutors is only a sign of innocence to someone who has already made a decision about guilt. Cooperating with investigators is how you avoid charges when you are found to have things you shouldn’t 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 23 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: This is absolutely false. Mueller specifically stated that Trump met the elements of obstruction multiple times but couldn’t be charged because he was president. He also stated that the proper remedy was impeachment. Try reading the actual report instead of a summary that was so misleading that Mueller complained to Barr about it. Don’t be so presumptuous, and as you so frequently suggest, follow the facts. The conclusions rendered by AG Barr are quite clear and quite compelling. Those comments came after an objective and unbiased review of everything Russia related. Mueller’s concern and complaint(s) are of no value to me, he had so much time and effort invested in the hunt for Reds in the WH it was probably inevitable he would lose focus and objectivity. At least half the nation was absolutely convinced of DJTs Russian citizenship, and the pressure to find something, anything to justify time and expense must have been extraordinary. I think it’s time for you to remove the partisan blinders and recognize the damage that the Dems did to our system with that ginned up scandal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Callahan Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 18 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Cooperating with investigators is how you avoid charges when you are found to have things you shouldn’t Cooperating with investigators often incriminates yourself and provides evidence for said charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Once again, this entire topic cracks me up! If the Una-Bomber was found to have an expired library book entitled "How to Build a Bomb", many of you would be more interested in the $3.00 fine for the late fees, than the actual contents of the book. We're in a really sad place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 35 minutes ago, Chris farley said: Cooperating with investigators often incriminates yourself and provides evidence for said charges. Doing so without a lawyer, for sure. But if you are found to have classified documents you shouldn’t have and you wish to avoid charges, you hire a lawyer and you cooperate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: Doing so without a lawyer, for sure. But if you are found to have classified documents you shouldn’t have and you wish to avoid charges, you hire a lawyer and you cooperate. Did Trump have lawyers? Yes....check Were Trump's lawyers cooperating? Yes....check Next topic 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiGoose Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Did Trump have lawyers? Yes....check Were Trump's lawyers cooperating? Yes....check Next topic How is refusing to comply and then lying cooperating? Like honestly, a lot of people here seem to think not doing what you’re supposed to do and then lying to law enforcement is the same as cooperating and I cannot understand how people reach that conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 6 minutes ago, ChiGoose said: How is refusing to comply and then lying cooperating? Like honestly, a lot of people here seem to think not doing what you’re supposed to do and then lying to law enforcement is the same as cooperating and I cannot understand how people reach that conclusion. There have been countless interpretations by very informed people expressing their opinions on national television specifically relevant to the President's authority, etc here. The reason you cannot understand is because you are a partisan hack. (With all due respect.) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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