Nancy Pelosi's Planned Trip To Taiwan Has China Up In Arms. (Should she stay or should she go?)

[Irv]

1 hour ago, ALF said:

 

At least trying to send China a message to let Taiwan remain a independent country.

 

Uhhhhhh.  Isn't that what the State Department is for?  <Repeat The Line>

[ALF]

9 hours ago, Irv said:

 

Uhhhhhh.  Isn't that what the State Department is for?  <Repeat The Line>

 

China has vowed to annex Taiwan by force if necessary, and has advertised that threat by flying warplanes near Taiwanese airspace and holding military exercises based on invasion scenarios. It says those actions are aimed at deterring advocates of the island’s formal independence and foreign allies — principally the U.S. — from coming to its aid, more than 70 years after the sides split amid civil war.

 

A visit by Pelosi would “severely undermine China’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, gravely impact the foundation of China-U.S. relations and send a seriously wrong signal to Taiwan independence forces,” Foreign Ministry spokesperson Zhao Lijiang said at a daily briefing.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/20/china-threatens-strong-measures-if-pelosi-visits-taiwan.html

 

I don't think the US and its allies can stop the military takeover of Taiwan by China . The world is too dependent on Chinese exports and chips from Taiwan. The US is trying everything short of war to keep Taiwan free.

[Irv]

14 hours ago, ALF said:

 

China has vowed to annex Taiwan by force if necessary, and has advertised that threat by flying warplanes near Taiwanese airspace and holding military exercises based on invasion scenarios. It says those actions are aimed at deterring advocates of the island’s formal independence and foreign allies — principally the U.S. — from coming to its aid, more than 70 years after the sides split amid civil war.

 

A visit by Pelosi would “severely undermine China’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, gravely impact the foundation of China-U.S. relations and send a seriously wrong signal to Taiwan independence forces,” Foreign Ministry spokesperson Zhao Lijiang said at a daily briefing.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/20/china-threatens-strong-measures-if-pelosi-visits-taiwan.html

 

I don't think the US and its allies can stop the military takeover of Taiwan by China . The world is too dependent on Chinese exports and chips from Taiwan. The US is trying everything short of war to keep Taiwan free.

 

Demented Biden strikes again.  What a mess. 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

14 hours ago, ALF said:

 

China has vowed to annex Taiwan by force if necessary, and has advertised that threat by flying warplanes near Taiwanese airspace and holding military exercises based on invasion scenarios. It says those actions are aimed at deterring advocates of the island’s formal independence and foreign allies — principally the U.S. — from coming to its aid, more than 70 years after the sides split amid civil war.

 

A visit by Pelosi would “severely undermine China’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, gravely impact the foundation of China-U.S. relations and send a seriously wrong signal to Taiwan independence forces,” Foreign Ministry spokesperson Zhao Lijiang said at a daily briefing.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/20/china-threatens-strong-measures-if-pelosi-visits-taiwan.html

 

I don't think the US and its allies can stop the military takeover of Taiwan by China . The world is too dependent on Chinese exports and chips from Taiwan. The US is trying everything short of war to keep Taiwan free.

And how does a 82 year old socialite/politician visiting Taiwan going to accomplish that goal?  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Her body her choice 

[ALF]

48 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

And how does a 82 year old socialite/politician visiting Taiwan going to accomplish that goal?  

 

China will eventually take Taiwan just like Hong Kong. No way the US goes to war with China. Political posturing at this point when you have no leverage against China , see tariffs. I just don't want to see Taiwan destroyed by a war they can't win with China. I'm more concerned with Putin, he does have leverage with nat gas over Europe.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

27 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

China will eventually take Taiwan just like Hong Kong. No way the US goes to war with China. Political posturing at this point when you have no leverage against China , see tariffs. I just don't want to see Taiwan destroyed by a war they can't win with China. I'm more concerned with Putin, he does have leverage with nat gas over Europe.

I may have missed an earlier point—you see her trip to Taiwan as a dog n pony show, largely irrelevant in the grand scheme? 

[ALF]

6 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I may have missed an earlier point—you see her trip to Taiwan as a dog n pony show, largely irrelevant in the grand scheme? 

 

Not irrelevant , just stating the US position wanting Taiwan to remain free. If China takes Taiwan relations with the US will be poor but no war with the US.

[Irv]

Maybe she,(it) (he) will be incinerated by a surface-to-air-missile.  <Repeat The Line>  That would be really sad.  😢  Why doesn't Dopey Biden go over if it's so important?  Oh.  I forgot.  It's Dopey Biden.  He's only good at boot-licking adversaries.  What a mess.  

 

 

Edited July 29, 2022 by Irv

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 hours ago, ALF said:

 

Not irrelevant , just stating the US position wanting Taiwan to remain free. If China takes Taiwan relations with the US will be poor but no war with the US.

Maybe. Japan would come next… 

[ALF]

7 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Maybe. Japan would come next… 

 

If China attacked Japan or S Korea that would be going way too far , China is not that crazy. I think the US and allies would try to deter that by bringing both those countries into NATO and hope that works. A conventional war between the US and China would be catastrophic , a nuclear one would be the end.

[All_Pro_Bills]

This is what 40 years of "engagement", most favored nation trade status, encouraging US businesses to set up shop in China and transfer proprietary technology to their government sponsored enterprises, allowing CCP to influence domestic media, sports, entertainment, cultural, political, and social elites, and other actions beneficial to the Chinese government and party members has produced. 

Everyday low prices at Walmart and iPhones from Apple in the hand and back pocket of every American, and sneakers from Nike, and NBA exhibitions and TV broadcast contracts didn't lead to the development of democracy and freedom in China.  It created a powerful and dangerous authoritarian global adversary that oppresses and persecutes its own people with the aim of spreading their influence around the world.  Who could have seen that coming?  Like, almost everybody. 

And today, we're witnessing a scenario where a delegation to Taiwan led by the 3rd highest ranking US government official is being threatened by the Chinese government.  Like most US government arrangements around the world for the past 40 years a host of policy and strategy miscalculations have painted us into a corner with no good options available. 

One big advantage for China is their leadership thinks strategically and long term.  You don't have to be a brutal authoritarian regime to employ this approach.  Obviously, our leadership doesn't think that way at all.  China likely foresaw and planned for this day and such a situation.  For our side everything appears to be a surprise.  There's a lesson in there somewhere.

[Irv]

44 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

This is what 40 years of "engagement", most favored nation trade status, encouraging US businesses to set up shop in China and transfer proprietary technology to their government sponsored enterprises, allowing CCP to influence domestic media, sports, entertainment, cultural, political, and social elites, and other actions beneficial to the Chinese government and party members has produced. 

Everyday low prices at Walmart and iPhones from Apple in the hand and back pocket of every American, and sneakers from Nike, and NBA exhibitions and TV broadcast contracts didn't lead to the development of democracy and freedom in China.  It created a powerful and dangerous authoritarian global adversary that oppresses and persecutes its own people with the aim of spreading their influence around the world.  Who could have seen that coming?  Like, almost everybody. 

And today, we're witnessing a scenario where a delegation to Taiwan led by the 3rd highest ranking US government official is being threatened by the Chinese government.  Like most US government arrangements around the world for the past 40 years a host of policy and strategy miscalculations have painted us into a corner with no good options available. 

One big advantage for China is their leadership thinks strategically and long term.  You don't have to be a brutal authoritarian regime to employ this approach.  Obviously, our leadership doesn't think that way at all.  China likely foresaw and planned for this day and such a situation.  For our side everything appears to be a surprise.  There's a lesson in there somewhere.

Great job Biden.  What a mess.  

[Tiberius]

 

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, Irv said:

Great job Biden.  What a mess.  

In this case you are more correct than ever. Talk about a huge unforced error by the entire Administration. While in the midst of a “war in Europe”, the Biden nitwits just got the Chinese to say that they’d shoot down a plane carrying the Speaker of the House. Way to go Brandon! 

[Albwan]

On 7/29/2022 at 1:11 AM, ALF said:

 

China has vowed to annex Taiwan by force if necessary, and has advertised that threat by flying warplanes near Taiwanese airspace and holding military exercises based on invasion scenarios. It says those actions are aimed at deterring advocates of the island’s formal independence and foreign allies — principally the U.S. — from coming to its aid, more than 70 years after the sides split amid civil war.

 

A visit by Pelosi would “severely undermine China’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, gravely impact the foundation of China-U.S. relations and send a seriously wrong signal to Taiwan independence forces,” Foreign Ministry spokesperson Zhao Lijiang said at a daily briefing.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/20/china-threatens-strong-measures-if-pelosi-visits-taiwan.html

 

I don't think the US and its allies can stop the military takeover of Taiwan by China . The world is too dependent on Chinese exports and chips from Taiwan. The US is trying everything short of war to keep Taiwan free.

They might win a war if they show up in pink camos, the enemy might double over lol'ing.

Nah, just kidding... it would be an epic ass kicking.

[TSOL]

We are portraying china to be this big bad wolf these days. But China is a mess. They overcount their population to make themselves seem more powerful than they are. Half of their population are third world indigenous people. Their environment is utterly destroyed, like one entire province has no wildlife and their water is glowing green from their rampant abuse of the environment in the name of manufacturing. 

 

 

Yes, they manufactory and produce and have alot more money than we do because of it,  But that's at the expense of their population, treating human beings as a commodity. 

 

 

Why do you think we don't want to produce any of these modern convienence in our own country? Stop buying their crap, the china problem is each and every one of us as individuals, it's our fault. We want these environmentally destructive shiney plastic modern convienence and we don't want to deal with the repercussions of how they are produced, well, we are giving China all our money for TV's  and  lith ion lawnmowers and they are using that money to build hypersonic aircraft carrier killer missiles.  

 

Blame Biden or pelosi all you want. It's YOUR fault this is happening. 

 

Stop buying their crap. Buy an old lawnmower at a garage sale and tune up the motor yourself, it'll be fine. 

[Tiberius]

17 minutes ago, TSOL said:

We are portraying china to be this big bad wolf these days. But China is a mess. They overcount their population to make themselves seem more powerful than they are. Half of their population are third world indigenous people. Their environment is utterly destroyed, like one entire province has no wildlife and their water is glowing green from their rampant abuse of the environment in the name of manufacturing. 

 

 

Yes, they manufactory and produce and have alot more money than we do because of it,  But that's at the expense of their population, treating human beings as a commodity. 

 

 

Why do you think we don't want to produce any of these modern convienence in our own country? Stop buying their crap, the china problem is each and every one of us as individuals, it's our fault. We want these environmentally destructive shiney plastic modern convienence and we don't want to deal with the repercussions of how they are produced, well, we are giving China all our money for TV's  and  lith ion lawnmowers and they are using that money to build hypersonic aircraft carrier killer missiles.  

 

Blame Biden or pelosi all you want. It's YOUR fault this is happening. 

 

Stop buying their crap. Buy an old lawnmower at a garage sale and tune up the motor yourself, it'll be fine. 

On top of what you said, how long can their screwed up system last. They allow no freedom of thought or expression that contradicts the party line and they are really just an ethnic group, the Hans. Freedom is necassary for creativity and innovation and if China wants to dominate other areas is has to allow creative freedom or they will not be able to compete in an economy largely based on creative ideas. They do long stronger now, but I just can't see how this system survives the changes that are going to happen in the world economy. 

[TSOL]

7 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

On top of what you said, how long can their screwed up system last. They allow no freedom of thought or expression that contradicts the party line and they are really just an ethnic group, the Hans. Freedom is necassary for creativity and innovation and if China wants to dominate other areas is has to allow creative freedom or they will not be able to compete in an economy largely based on creative ideas. They do long stronger now, but I just can't see how this system survives the changes that are going to happen in the world economy. 

 

 

As long as we keep buying their garbage. 

 

We are like crack addicts with their shiney new plastic crap 

Edited July 30, 2022 by TSOL

[SoCal Deek]

6 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

On top of what you said, how long can their screwed up system last. They allow no freedom of thought or expression that contradicts the party line and they are really just an ethnic group, the Hans. Freedom is necassary for creativity and innovation and if China wants to dominate other areas is has to allow creative freedom or they will not be able to compete in an economy largely based on creative ideas. They do long stronger now, but I just can't see how this system survives the changes that are going to happen in the world economy. 

Keep your shirt on. We’re all going to die in eight years.