Tight End stat sheet as of Dec. 1

[BarleyNY]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Oh, boy.  Someone - cover1 I think - said he thought  Knox blocked well in this game.  He says so, but to me, all too often Knox just looks "lost in space" to me.  He can block OK - one on one, against an average to below average player.  But put him in a situation that requires quick reactions or against a top player and you get the Judon strip sack or that nasty sack vs. AZ. 

 

Or this - the stuffed Moss run prior to the INT in the Chargers game.  Knox winds up trying to block Bosa.  Oh, boy, Plan where you lose your Hat.

Now I'm not sure if he was supposed to be Dawkins guy from the start, but anyway, Knox engages and slows him down and here comes Dawkins:

Just as Bosa shoves Knox aside like an inconvenient lane divider, Dawkins gives Bosa a healthy pop and shoves him over to where Knox could reengage.  I don't think that's Dawkins job; I think he's supposed to help Knox, then take on the LB #56.  I also think Beasley was supposed to take on the CB, #25 but he might have had a role as an outlet receiver and needed to keep himself clean.  If he's supposed to block, that appears to be a Very Bad Angle and he's beaten before he starts.  (Keep in mind as I type this that my assessment of run blocking should be taken with a healthy salt shaker). 

The shove by Dawkins seems intended to allow Knox to recover, reset, and re-engage. 

Instead, Knox is unable to get Bosa's arm off his back, Bosa maintains leverage, and when Dawkins turns to take on the DB, Bosa easily shoots into the backfield and blows up Moss for a loss.  Contributing to the problem is Beasley standing kind of cluelessly right where Moss needs to go, watching Dion block what I think shoulda been his guy.

 

Now I can't tell you how that was supposed to work.  Was Dion supposed to stay on Bosa?  Was Bosa his guy in the first place?  Who was supposed to block the DB?  What was Beasley's assignment?  You need someone with a higher level of X's and O's run block scheme competence for that.

 

Seems to me if Moss got to the hole faster, it might have still been there.  But there's also a big 'ol steaming pile o' bad blocking keeping the hole from being there at the point where Moss arrives.  And clearly, if Knox coulda laid a bit better block on Bosa or if he could have gotten off and reset and stayed on it instead of being shed quickly like a particularly ugly Christmas sweater, play mighta gone somewhere.

 

 

I'm far from an expert at decoding run blocking as some here can attest from how often I sent up the "SOS!  WTF was that?" in 2018, and from the above.  But Daboll's run plays appear to me to frequently depend upon good TE blocking.  He's also been using a TE as a halfback surrogate at times this year.  I think a good blocking and pass-catching TE is a highly desired piece to Daboll.

 

Then there's the value a TE has as an outlet receiver.  KC's offense works as it does because defenses always have to devote resources to covering Kelce.

 

It seems to me that we put a fair amount of resources into the TE position.  The contract Kroft signed before 2019 is still top-15 both overall and in annual value. A 3rd round pick for Dawson Knox isn't "chopped liver".    Both are guys who have under-performed the Bills investment, and I don't think it's because we don't want to use TE.

 

I agree with you completely that even one quality TE effective in both blocking and pass catching would help.

 

 

That’s fair about us putting resources into the TE position and just not getting value out of them.  A third round pick for Knox was a very reasonable use of capital even if it hasn’t planned out quite as well as we’d have liked.  The Kroft contract was just throwing money and cap space away though.  I’ve hated that since the day we signed him.  I’m just happy they cut their losses by reworking his deal to get out of it after this season. 

 

I’m not really sure what benefit there is to having Lee Smith on the team either.  He does almost nothing but block and with the new rule this season requiring teams to have 8 active OL I don't see value in him taking up a roster space and $3M/year.  I’m sure Nseke, Dawkins or Williams could block better and manage to catch 2 or 3 passes every year.  Gilliam is our H-back.  He’s cheap, doesn’t get a lot of snaps and I honestly don’t have a read on him.   We obviously need a FB or H-back to fill that role though.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

3 hours ago, QLBillsFan said:

So the answer to out TE problem is to release our deep threat. This team is better when Brown is on the field. Certainly drafting a speedy rep can support but not time to move on from Brown. 

 

Not at all - In fact keep doing what you did in the last draft, keep mining for skill position talent. 

 

 

[TBBills]

Also have to realize if Josh wants to pass to his TEs... He might just love passing to WRs.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

8 hours ago, streetkings01 said:

Kelce and Waller are the only TE’s currently with 50 or more receptions......the need for a stud TE is so overblown. Unless your offense is designed around the TE the need for one is minimal. I’d rather find another WR to pair with Diggs and Davis, a capable TE and a stud RB.

Allen is not putting up 300-yards+ every week. And you can see the scenario where in the Playoffs he's stuck in the mid/high 100's passing the ball, looking for a playmaker. 

 

I think we all look at the Bills and conclude they need to do more work on the Offensive Line, get another Defensive Lineman or two, draft a Linebacker, another Cornerback, and possibly position yourself for a Safety. 

 

But Tight End is a black hole on this roster,  where you literally get no production from the position group.

 

Keep Knox, but Sweeney/Kroft are fringe targets, and Lee Smith is a borderline NFL player at this point. 

 

Interesting thought on an Elite RB added to the squad. As long as we don't add another broken veteran - Gore, Ivory, Tolbert, Yeldon.     

[Hampton Josh fan]

Tight end has been a black hole for us. I had lofty expectations for Knox and he has been a huge disappointment. Either due to  nagging injuries or just spotty play , he doesn't have any stand out talent in pass catching or blocking. Kroft is just pedestrian and the two other tight ends are offensive linemen. This is a definite need going forward. 

[DrDawkinstein]

8 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

What’s the rank in targets? We don’t throw to tight ends how high would you expect them to rank? 

 

Good point.

[machine gun kelly]

Fwiw, go to google, best TE’s for the 2021 draft.  They detail how this draft in 2021 is projected to be better than 2020, and 2019.  There are some excellent players there, and I know we could use several other positions, but if we had a generational TE, It would be worth it as a high pick.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

1 hour ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Allen is not putting up 300-yards+ every week. And you can see the scenario where in the Playoffs he's stuck in the mid/high 100's passing the ball, looking for a playmaker. 

 

I think we all look at the Bills and conclude they need to do more work on the Offensive Line, get another Defensive Lineman or two, draft a Linebacker, another Cornerback, and possibly position yourself for a Safety. 

 

But Tight End is a black hole on this roster,  where you literally get no production from the position group.

 

Keep Knox, but Sweeney/Kroft are fringe targets, and Lee Smith is a borderline NFL player at this point. 

 

Interesting thought on an Elite RB added to the squad. As long as we don't add another broken veteran - Gore, Ivory, Tolbert, Yeldon.     

That is kind of hard to evaluate at this point... the games hes had 150ish yards passing we've made a concerted effort to establish the run even if it wasn't really working.  I dont think they wanted josh dropping back to pass too much with bosa absolutely terrorizing our offensive line.  I think he's had a deep ball PI penalty in most of those games too. the difference between 175 passing yards and 220 is pretty huge optics wise when you're reading a stat sheet.

Even when considering only afc playoff squads there really isn't another team with a pass rusher like bosa.

Edited December 1, 2020 by Generic_Bills_Fan