MrEpsYtown Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 29 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: This is ridiculous - most of the guys on your list are great players. Your argument is basically, "drafting a lineman high won't win you a SB." That's a weak argument. I have to respectfully disagree. Aside from a couple of elite players, a lot of those guys are busts. I listed 18 guys. Out of them Smith and Johnson are elite. That's two guys and they happen to be elite athletes. Matthews, Lewan, Stanley, Conklin, Scherff, and Nelson are very good to great. I can't call Nelson elite yet because it's too early, but he's probably is. But they all have some issues and, aside from Johnson, haven't won their teams anything. Out of that entire list, there is 1 super bowl winning lineman. Two if you count Chance Warmack on the Eagles, who btw is a massive bust and played 4 snaps in the big game. McClinchey has been ok. My main point is do not draft guards or right tackles in the top ten unless they are elite. Even then it may not help. Joe Thomas might be one of the best tackles of all time. He played on the same line with one of the best centers of all time in Alex Mack. That sure did the Browns a lot of good. Anthony Munoz's teams never won anything. The teams with with the highest graded lines this year, Steelers, Packers, Rams...none of them have a top ten drafted offensive linemen on their team. To me, it is a poor use of assets. Late first, to early second is where you get value with linemen. You have to find pieces that fit. Top ten picks are lottery tickets that should not be used to plug holes. If you want to plug holes, trade down. If Jonah Williams is a can't miss elite player, I'm good with it. But if there are question marks about him, it is a poor use of assets and not worth the risk. Again, this is simply my opinion and philosophy when it comes to the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 15 hours ago, NewDayBills said: I think he would be a Quenton Nelson caliber of G. He would also provide plenty of insurance in case Dion Dawkins went down. That entire left side would be solid. May not be there when we pick and it's still early on in the process but I would not be upset if he was the pick. I'd leave Dawkins at LT and Mills at RT. Center and RG would be our only weak spots on the OL. how about Dawkins at LG? Williams is an elite pass blocker and not the most rugged guy , so guard would be a big mistake. 14 hours ago, H2o said: I think Williams has been scouted by the Bills multiple times already as it has been noted in the College Football forum about them being at Bama games. I would plug him anywhere on the OL as well. Probably at RG the way the Cowboys did with Zack Martin from Notre Dame, a LT in college also. He is not a guard. If anything he also played right tackle and we could finally move on from Mills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 12 hours ago, NewDayBills said: I'm hoping our first three picks look like this: 1.) Jonah Williams, G 2.) Marquise Brown, WR 3.) LJ Scott, RB Have you seen him play? Why do you want him at guard?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 5 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: how about Dawkins at LG? Williams is an elite pass blocker and not the most rugged guy , so guard would be a big mistake. He is not a guard. If anything he also played right tackle and we could finally move on from Mills. And RT would be fine by me. The fact is he is that good of a player where you could plug him in on the OL anywhere except Center and he would be good. That's why I said like Zack Martin. Martin could have played LT or RT as well. The Cowboys put him at RG and he is an All Pro. Read an article a few years ago where Belicheat said they draft guys who could all play LT on their OL, but put them in various positions where they have all played well. Could be the system, could be the players, but it has worked for them. No one can argue that the OL needs an upgrade and good players are what it takes to do that. Williams is one no matter where he would get plugged in. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 5 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: how about Dawkins at LG? Williams is an elite pass blocker and not the most rugged guy , so guard would be a big mistake. He is not a guard. If anything he also played right tackle and we could finally move on from Mills. Dawkins has been great at LT and Mills is a starter in the NFL. That leaves LG and RG that could use a big time upgrade. I think Jonah could be an All Pro LG/RG. I think guard matters more than RT anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 20 hours ago, NewDayBills said: I'd take a flyer on Ryan Kalil. Good to have some age in there too. Especially since he is calling the blocking audibles. He has that Carolina connection as well. LT- Dion Dawkins LG- Jonah Williams C- Ryan Kalil RG- Wyatt Teller RT- Jordan Mills Pretty solid group of linemen. Keep Miller and Bodine as our backup. Good group of guys. Khalil is planning to retire I believe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 13 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said: I have to respectfully disagree. Aside from a couple of elite players, a lot of those guys are busts. I listed 18 guys. Out of them Smith and Johnson are elite. That's two guys and they happen to be elite athletes. Matthews, Lewan, Stanley, Conklin, Scherff, and Nelson are very good to great. I can't call Nelson elite yet because it's too early, but he's probably is. But they all have some issues and, aside from Johnson, haven't won their teams anything. Out of that entire list, there is 1 super bowl winning lineman. Two if you count Chance Warmack on the Eagles, who btw is a massive bust and played 4 snaps in the big game. McClinchey has been ok. My main point is do not draft guards or right tackles in the top ten unless they are elite. Even then it may not help. Joe Thomas might be one of the best tackles of all time. He played on the same line with one of the best centers of all time in Alex Mack. That sure did the Browns a lot of good. Anthony Munoz's teams never won anything. The teams with with the highest graded lines this year, Steelers, Packers, Rams...none of them have a top ten drafted offensive linemen on their team. To me, it is a poor use of assets. Late first, to early second is where you get value with linemen. You have to find pieces that fit. Top ten picks are lottery tickets that should not be used to plug holes. If you want to plug holes, trade down. If Jonah Williams is a can't miss elite player, I'm good with it. But if there are question marks about him, it is a poor use of assets and not worth the risk. Again, this is simply my opinion and philosophy when it comes to the draft. Lewan is elite too. That is 3 on your list. Lewan is better than Lane Johnson for my money. The rest I pretty much agree with the categories you have them in, though I'd say Eric Fisher after a dreadful first two seasons has come around and is a solid left tackle in KC. Not great by any means, but middle of the league solid. The Steelers example is a bit flawed too. They have spent two first rounders on that line... not top 10 picks because they have a proven franchise QB so never end up picking top 10! I agree that the top 10 is not the place you try and fill needs. It is the place you pick guys you think have elite potential. That is my view regardless of position. I would have no issue taking a OL there if he fitted my could be elite criteria. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 I'm not up on Jonah Williams, but that RT from Oklahoma looks intriguing. The way he was pulling from his tackle position was shades of House Ballard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 58 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: 6. Buffalo Bills: Jonah Williams, OT, Alabama With the top wide receiver off the board, the Bills go in another direction to help Josh Allen. Alabama OT Jonah Williams is viewed as the draft's top offensive tackle. Williams and Dion Dawkins give the Bills a young tackle combination to grow with their franchise quarterback. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 5 hours ago, NewDayBills said: Dawkins has been great at LT and Mills is a starter in the NFL. That leaves LG and RG that could use a big time upgrade. I think Jonah could be an All Pro LG/RG. I think guard matters more than RT anyways. Mills is a bum and putting Williams at guard is a waste of his talent. He doesn't have the size and strength for guard at this point. Trust me this kid is playing tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: Mills is a bum and putting Williams at guard is a waste of his talent. He doesn't have the size and strength for guard at this point. Trust me this kid is playing tackle. Of course he has the size and strength to play guard, the guy is 6'5 300lbs. That's not small. Bigger than Andy Levitre and he does a good job. Also, give me an All Pro OG over an All Pro RT every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Jonah can play any position on the line but center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Things Man Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 LT Williams LG Teller C Paradis RG Miller RT Dawkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmart128 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 On 11/17/2018 at 7:49 AM, H2o said: I think we have found our LG with Teller. We need a C, RG, and RT. I think Sirles can play either RG or RT. He played a bit in the last game. As well as Tellar and that was our best offensive line performance. Even when playing a decent Dline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 2 hours ago, NewDayBills said: Of course he has the size and strength to play guard, the guy is 6'5 300lbs. That's not small. Bigger than Andy Levitre and he does a good job. Also, give me an All Pro OG over an All Pro RT every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Jonah can play any position on the line but center. Why do believe he can't play center then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 2 hours ago, Bad Things Man said: LT Williams LG Teller C Paradis RG Miller RT Dawkins I think Miller is replaced as well, guy is not good. Like the addition of Paradis as well ,could come cheaper with the injury. Wouldn't mind one of those Wisconsin boys for the interior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: Why do believe he can't play center then? Should I believe that? Why would I believe that? Does he have experience there that I'm unaware of? The transition from LT to LG would be easier for him, center is a pretty intricate position, I'd much rather have an experienced veteran there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, NewDayBills said: Should I believe that? Why would I believe that? Does he have experience there that I'm unaware of? The transition from LT to LG would be easier for him, center is a pretty intricate position, I'd much rather have an experienced veteran there. if he can play guard he can play center. he is playing tackle , no question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Buffalo Barbarian said: if he can play guard he can play center. he is playing tackle , no question. That's completely bizarre. We'll just have to agree to disagree and that's fine too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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