2-26: Mike Mayock's Pre-Combine Conference Call - Day Two Presser Added

[FeelingOnYouboty]

15 hours ago, joesixpack said:

 

Yes, God forbid we try and get a QB, and a quality one at that. That would just be horrible.

 

 

Some of our fans deserve to be in QB purgatory 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, BuffAlone said:

Yeah, I've watched some highlights (of Jackson). I agree he's fast, but thats all I see at this point.Im not sold on his instincts or football IQ. Maybe Im wrong...wouldn't be the first time lol

 

I had to find a highlight clip that only showed throws in order to be able to evaluate his running ability.  I recommend the Cover1 scouting report.  Hint: the color of the links may not be obvious, but the pic.twitter.mumble things are links to twitter feed .gifs

 

But in general this kind of opinion (common) has me shaking my GD head.  Kid threw 409 and 432 attempts last two years for 3542 and 3660 yds. 12% WR drops.  59% completions.  How on earth could he do that if "fast is all you see"?  And he did it in a Power 5 conference.

 

For scale comparison, Josh Rosen threw 452 attempts for 3756 yds - Rosen >>>> everyone else as a polished passing technician, but the point is, Jackson throws about the same # attempts for the same distance as a prospect who's "Mr Passing"?  "Mr Arm" Josh Allen So. year threw 373 attempts for 3200 yds

 

It's like Jackson's rushing abilities blind people to his passing.  Which I do understand, because I struggled watching film.

 

45 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I'm with you, but I also think supply and demand has some effect on the draft value of a player.  I think I can agree that Rudolph is probably a bit less talented physically than Rosen, Darnold, Allen and Jackson.  I also can agree that Mayfield might have better leadership traits.  However, I think it still comes down to:

If the Bills feel that Mason Rudolph can become a good long-term starter for them, I would think that makes him worth pick 21 or 22.  Waiting and taking the chance that they can get him in round 2 wouldn't make sense, unless they also felt that there was another one or two QBs also left that they think are as good as Rudolph (Mike White, Kyle Lauletta, for example).

 

Yes, especially given our picks in the 2nd round are also late

They could, I suppose, try to trade down in the 1st into the top of the 2nd.

But I agree, you only wait if there are 2-4 guys you feel have "separate but equal" gaps and would be happy with any one.

Edited February 27, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan

[whatdrought]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Isn't Josh Jackson a freshman?  I had no idea he was entering the draft.

 

Historically, if a team wants to draft a QB in the first 3 rounds and waits until they fall to exactly where they're slotted, they go home empty.

QB always get over-drafted.

 

I'm aware. I'm also not saying we should wait and hope someone falls. I'm actually 100% fine with trading up for one of top four depending on what we think they're worth. I simply mean that if Rudolph is in fact a 2nd round guy (which I really don't know either way, but I normally trust Mayock and have seen quite a lot of takes having him as a second) that reaching for him would be, I think, as bad as not taking QB at all in the first round. I would suggest, in that case, trading down and hoping to get either Rudolph or a similar guy in the second. 

I can't think of a time when someone panicking to take their guy and drafting him higher than his value dictated has ever worked out. Usually when we hear the term "QB's are worth more" it's used to justify things like taking Christian Ponder and Jake Locker in the top 15 or trading up for Johnny Manziel, or taking Mitch Trubisky in the top 5. 

I understand and completely agree that QB is the most valuable position and that as such, demands higher priority, but to completely ignore what a prospect is actually worth is not (historically) the way to go. 

 

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I had to find a highlight clip that only showed throws in order to be able to evaluate his running ability.  I recommend the Cover1 scouting report.  Hint: the color of the links may not be obvious, but the pic.twitter.mumble things are links to twitter feed .gifs

 

But in general this kind of opinion (common) has me shaking my GD head.  Kid threw 409 and 432 attempts last two years for 3542 and 3660 yds. 12% WR drops.  59% completions.  How on earth could he do that if "fast is all you see"?  And he did it in a Power 5 conference.

 

For scale comparison, Josh Rosen threw 452 attempts for 3756 yds - Rosen >>>> everyone else as a polished passing technician, but the point is, Jackson throws about the same # attempts for the same distance as a prospect who's "Mr Passing"?  "Mr Arm" Josh Allen So. year threw 373 attempts for 3200 yds

 

It's like Jackson's rushing abilities blind people to his passing.  Which I do understand, because I struggled watching film.

 

 

Yes, especially given our picks in the 2nd round are also late

They could, I suppose, try to trade down in the 1st into the top of the 2nd.

But I agree, you only wait if there are 2-4 guys you feel have "separate but equal" gaps and would be happy with any one.

 

 

I think the NFL is beginning to be burned out by good athletes who are only decent throwers and that creates a stigma against guys like Jackson. Now, I am not commenting on his ability to throw, you definitely know more about that than I do. So whether or not that stigma is fairly given, I'll let you decide, but I think there have been too many guys who can't actually be a passer first (our own dear Tyrod comes to mind) that people are starting to hesitate when they see terms like "explosive runner" or "makes things happen with his feet" 

I personally am fine with Jackson, if he throws the dang ball. I love Tyrod and love his improvisation skills, but I can't keep watching a Quarterback who can't seem to throw the ball. 

2 hours ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I'm with you, but I also think supply and demand has some effect on the draft value of a player.  I think I can agree that Rudolph is probably a bit less talented physically than Rosen, Darnold, Allen and Jackson.  I also can agree that Mayfield might have better leadership traits.  However, I think it still comes down to:

If the Bills feel that Mason Rudolph can become a good long-term starter for them, I would think that makes him worth pick 21 or 22.  Waiting and taking the chance that they can get him in round 2 wouldn't make sense, unless they also felt that there was another one or two QBs also left that they think are as good as Rudolph (Mike White, Kyle Lauletta, for example).

 

 

 

I agree. I think it will have to come down to the value that the Bills place on him. My biggest point is that I don't want the bills to say "well, this kid is a mid round two pick, but since all the other QB's are gone, we're gonna grab him at 21" 

Usually the teams at the back half of runs on any position end up over-drafting and paying the price later. 

Let's not forget that a bad 1st round QB is way more than a waste of a pick. It sets the team back at least 2-3 years (see E.J. Manual) 

 

Also, I haven't seen a whole lot about Rudolph that even suggests that he has distanced himself from the pack of 2nd tier QB's.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

https://nflcommunications.com/Pages/NFL-Network-Analyst-Mike-Mayock-2018-NFL-Scouting-Combine-Press-Conference----Audio.aspx

[26CornerBlitz]

[26CornerBlitz]

Mike Mayock's takeaways from Day 3 of combine

The 2018 NFL Scouting Combine kicked off Friday with offensive linemen and running backs and continued Saturday with quarterbacks, receivers and tight ends. Sunday was about defense.

 

The interior defensive linemen were the first act, and Mike Mayock broke the event down as only he can. Here's what the NFL Network draft analyst had to say about some of the draft's top prospects who participated in Indianapolis on Day 3.

 

• DAY 1: OL, RB
• DAY 2: QB, WR, TE

Edited March 4, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[John from Riverside]

On 2/26/2018 at 2:39 PM, Foxx said:

i suppose i could have guessed you'd like Jackson.......Tyrod 2.0.

Come on

[ndirish1978]

What was Irvin saying about not liking "the situation in Buffalo" yesterday? Did any of you catch that? It's on NFL.com when Denzel Ward is running his 40.

[billsredneck1]

On 2/26/2018 at 7:33 PM, OldTimer1960 said:

Every QB is drafted “too early”.

 

Seriously, with recognition that different positions are more or less important - and QB is almost universally recognized as THE most important position, how can you question drafting a QB early? 

 

What does the “BIG BOARD” mean?  How do draft analysts put together a top 50 (or 100 or ....)?  How do you compare QBs, DEs, OTs, DTs, CBs, Safeties, etc?  

 

I don’t look at the “BIG BOARD” for draft value.  Draft value is, at least partly determined by your team’s strengths and weaknesses.

Why?  Do you want them to trade for Foles?

 

i would not give much to get Foles - tops this year’s 3rd.

getting foles would be a dream come true...for me. if i had to i'd gladly give up 22.

[Boatdrinks]

On 2/26/2018 at 4:26 PM, whatdrought said:

 

 

I can't think of a worse way to follow our surprisingly good season last year than by drafting a QB too early.

The flip side of this has hurt the Bills in the past : waiting too long. Greggo and Co. " loved Drew Brees" in 2001. They didn't love him enough to pass on CB Nate Clements in round one though. What the heck, they had a high pick in round two so might as well get him there. He was only 6"1 or so. Clements was in Buffalo for one contract. 

[whatdrought]

2 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

The flip side of this has hurt the Bills in the past : waiting too long. Greggo and Co. " loved Drew Brees" in 2001. They didn't love him enough to pass on CB Nate Clements in round one though. What the heck, they had a high pick in round two so might as well get him there. He was only 6"1 or so. Clements was in Buffalo for one contract. 

 

Definitely goes both ways and can be just as dangerous either way. 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[26CornerBlitz]

COMBINE STANDOUTS

Who Impressed Mayock Today?

Derwin James, Denzel Ward and the defensive backs showed their potential with bursts of speed in the combine's final day. Read all of Mike Mayock's analysis from Day 4's best performances.