Alaska Darin Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I know taxes are high. Hell, I hate paying them for sure. But every time I think of there being no school nurses in the budget, fewer DAs, longer waits for public services, it's seems like the sales tax increase would have been a good solution at least until we figured out a better long term solution. I have a feeling I'm going to see my property taxes go up now. So, I'm wondering if the argument against the sales tax is that we're over taxed already. If so, I'm down with that. But if I have to pay a little more to make sure our cops stay on the streets or there's a nurse at my kid's school, so be it IMHO. 266528[/snapback] Amazingly, it's never the administrators who suffer the wrath of budget cuts. Instead, it's something the populous can't live without. That probably has something to do with your line of thinking. They aren't using an emotional issue to cover their terrible management. Nah, that's not it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I'm so pissed off that when I tried to point out waste 7+ years ago nothing was done back then. Even being in the newspaper, on the radio with Gorski for 15 minutes, and being on Channel 7 (channel 2's Rich Kellerman blow me off), the waste still happened. One day I watched when the county workers put up the jim kelly signs on single metal poles . The next day they came back, and took the metal poles down, unscrewed the signs and reattached them to 2 poles, and put the pole up. In my business, I call it double touching, which doubles the work, but cost my fixed profit in half. I also heard how the county workers, while doing the jim kelly signs, stood around in front of my favorite bar BTI for 2 hours doing nothing 2x6 guys = waste. It all adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I moved to the area from the west coast about 5 years ago 266515[/snapback] People are moving to Erie County? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tux of Borg Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I think its a weak argument to say we'll have to lay off police officers and school nurses. Erie County employs a lot more people than that. To me that's just propaganda to scare people into accepting a tax increase. Too bad Erie Country couldn't hire Donald Trump. He could fire all the legislators while developing the water front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Too bad Erie Country couldn't hire Donald Trump. He could fire all the legislators while developing the water front. 267189[/snapback] Yeah, let's hire the only man in America who can't make money on a casino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie68 Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I moved to the area from the west coast ah, that explains a lot. so you're from the left coast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron C. Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 We had the Erie county Legislature with a staff of 90. That's NINETY! I don't know if Tony Blair has a staff that large. Niagara County gets by with 3 secretaries for the entire board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tux of Borg Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 Yeah, let's hire the only man in America who can't make money on a casino. 267208[/snapback] It was an overall business decision to get rid of the casinos. The casinos were on the way to getting out of debt. The problem was they incurred so much debt, it hindered Trump from taking on other big projects. So he cut the dead weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockpile Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 Amazingly, it's never the administrators who suffer the wrath of budget cuts. Instead, it's something the populous can't live without. That probably has something to do with your line of thinking. They aren't using an emotional issue to cover their terrible management. Nah, that's not it. 266786[/snapback] At our local school, teacher's salaries (including a raise) are placed on the austerity budget, while transportation of elementary school children was supplemental. So 5 year olds within one mile of the school should walk to kindergarten? The district just keeps having additional votes, moving a few numbers around, until panicky parents finally pass the BS budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 I know taxes are high. Hell, I hate paying them for sure. But every time I think of there being no school nurses in the budget, fewer DAs, longer waits for public services, it's seems like the sales tax increase would have been a good solution at least until we figured out a better long term solution. I have a feeling I'm going to see my property taxes go up now. So, I'm wondering if the argument against the sales tax is that we're over taxed already. If so, I'm down with that. But if I have to pay a little more to make sure our cops stay on the streets or there's a nurse at my kid's school, so be it IMHO. 266528[/snapback] The two answers you hear most: "cut spending" and "raise taxes" are both wrong because neither, on its own will do the job. You could cut all the discretionary spending in the world and it won't balance the budget. Military spending and entitlements on their own are big enough to sink us. Raising taxes certainly isn't an acceptable answer, on its own, either. Political reality 101 says: 1. Out of control gov't spending is any spending that doesn't benefit you. 2. The taxes you pay are always too high and the taxes others pay are always too low. 3. The electorate's appetite for government largesse will always exceed its willingness to pay for that largesse. 4. You will always win more votes by spending more money on your constituents no matter how it effects the budget. 5. You will always win more votes by cutting taxes whether those cuts are justified or not and regardless of the effect on the budget. 6. The party out of power that has no ability to balance the budget will always claim it can balance the budget. 7. The party in power that actually has the votes to balance the budget will always claim that the budget is balanced enough for now and will some day be totally balanced. 8. People are blind to the connection between the services they demand and the taxes they pay. 9. Convincing people that No. 8 is true will just pi$$ them off. 10. Everyone is for a balanced budget, no one is for losing their services or raising their taxes. 11. Blaming "government waste" implies that the budget can be painlessly balanced by simply suffocating this beast we call "government waste". Then we will live happily ever after. It is not true but it plays well on TV. 12. Increasing taxes on the wealthy implies that the budget can be painlessly balanced by simply getting a few more pennies from the rich who will hardly suffer a dent in their monthly ration of caviar. It is not true but it plays well on TV. ...and my personal favorite: 13. Economy of scale, a phenomena which allows us to prodcue more for less, is applauded by the same people who will have to work more for less to create that economy of scale. Okay, that one really isn't a budgetry Murphy's Law but I couldn't resist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 The two answers you hear most: "cut spending" and "raise taxes" are both wrong because neither, on its own will do the job. You could cut all the discretionary spending in the world and it won't balance the budget. Military spending and entitlements on their own are big enough to sink us. Raising taxes certainly isn't an acceptable answer, on its own, either. Political reality 101 says: 1. Out of control gov't spending is any spending that doesn't benefit you. 2. The taxes you pay are always too high and the taxes others pay are always too low. 3. The electorate's appetite for government largesse will always exceed its willingness to pay for that largesse. 4. You will always win more votes by spending more money on your constituents no matter how it effects the budget. 5. You will always win more votes by cutting taxes whether those cuts are justified or not and regardless of the effect on the budget. 6. The party out of power that has no ability to balance the budget will always claim it can balance the budget. 7. The party in power that actually has the votes to balance the budget will always claim that the budget is balanced enough for now and will some day be totally balanced. 8. People are blind to the connection between the services they demand and the taxes they pay. 9. Convincing people that No. 8 is true will just pi$$ them off. 10. Everyone is for a balanced budget, no one is for losing their services or raising their taxes. 11. Blaming "government waste" implies that the budget can be painlessly balanced by simply suffocating this beast we call "government waste". Then we will live happily ever after. It is not true but it plays well on TV. 12. Increasing taxes on the wealthy implies that the budget can be painlessly balanced by simply getting a few more pennies from the rich who will hardly suffer a dent in their monthly ration of caviar. It is not true but it plays well on TV. ...and my personal favorite: 13. Economy of scale, a phenomena which allows us to prodcue more for less, is applauded by the same people who will have to work more for less to create that economy of scale. Okay, that one really isn't a budgetry Murphy's Law but I couldn't resist. 268144[/snapback] LOL. Good stuff. Ain't politics grand.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obie_wan Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 It was an overall business decision to get rid of the casinos. The casinos were on the way to getting out of debt. The problem was they incurred so much debt, it hindered Trump from taking on other big projects. So he cut the dead weight. 267755[/snapback] no - he filed for bankruptcy so his creditors would pay for his mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweet baboo Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 no - he filed for bankruptcy so his creditors would pay for his mistakes. 268256[/snapback] and people hail him as some sort of genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper13 Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 The whole Erie County Budget mess is ridiculous because they just went and raised everyone's taxes anyways. They just reassesed my house and it's worth $47,000 more than it was yesterday so my property taxes will go up at least $150. In Amherst they raised the assessments even on the houses that are sinking and have cracked foundations. They get you no matter what. They went and cut stuff people actually use and need just to make taxpayers miserable so they can say "See, you should have just let us raise the sales tax". They cut the Auto Bureau to almost nothing yet the Auto Bureau brought in millions of dollars of year. These politicians are all idiots yet somehow they were elected to office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 At our local school, teacher's salaries (including a raise) are placed on the austerity budget, while transportation of elementary school children was supplemental. So 5 year olds within one mile of the school should walk to kindergarten? The district just keeps having additional votes, moving a few numbers around, until panicky parents finally pass the BS budget. 268008[/snapback] I don't know where you are, but every school district does that. It's a joke. Don't let me have my way and your kids can walk to school forever. Nice tactic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 I don't know where you are, but every school district does that. It's a joke. Don't let me have my way and your kids can walk to school forever. Nice tactic 268576[/snapback] They'll stop using it when it stops working... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 They'll stop using it when it stops working... 268598[/snapback] That's because the school board is all ex-teachers. There is no one rep'ing the taxpayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doyle Hargraves Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 3) Sheriff Galivan cannot cut his budget at all and do with less. Meanwhile, 1000 deputies and about a third make $100,000+. At the Ralph, how many even get out of their cars? ____________________________________________________________________ The reason all the duputies at the jail make $100,000+ is because of the overtime they pull. What difference does it make in the budget if some guys work more overtime than others? It is cheaper to pay overtime than it is to hire extra people with benefits in order to fully staff the jail. And those Sheriff Deputies at the Ralph are being paid by the Bills as a part time gig- Not the County. The scumbags who run the County will target the poor schomoes who actually do the work-...the people who got their jobs by taking civil service exams. The APPOINTED people who got their jobs by knowing somebody or blo$$$$ somebody will probably be minimumly affected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 And those Sheriff Deputies at the Ralph are being paid by the Bills as a part time gig- Not the County. I believe Erie County pays the Sheriffs, per the stadium lease agreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted March 10, 2005 Share Posted March 10, 2005 Next time you go to a game go to Southwestern & California. Check out the 2 sitting in their car at that corner sucking down coffee. They never move out of the car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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