2018 Bills draft QB Mason Rudolph - CBS Sports

[Mountain Man]

12 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

....interesting....Drafttek had Bflo going OL/DL or DL/OL with the two 1sts and taking Falk in the 2nd at #43.............

 

That's about 9 rounds too early for Falk

[Mark Vader]

22 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

Just a hunch on my part- but I don’t think scouts will think too highly of him considering he was benched twice, and plays in a gimmick offense against, mostly, weaker competion.  I also don’t see a leader of men with Luke Falk...his body language often appears lethargic and indifferent when he is playing...not impressed at all...but then again, who really knows about these guys...just my two cents.

Which is why I think it is smart of him to go to the Senior Bowl.

 

Everyone will be there to assess him.

[CLTbills]

On 12/17/2017 at 12:58 PM, Andy1 said:

I think they are targeting Rudolph too. The kid definitely has lots of talent and is a very good prospect. No-one knows how any of them will be at the next level. Id be happy with him. They need to take a shot at some QB in this draft. I think there are fewer unknowns about Rudolph than many of the other prospects. 

Just makes me nervous. I'm not saying the kid should be penalized because of the conference he plays in, but he plays against big 12 defenses. They'd make my 2 year old look good. 

 

Although by my own logic, I should be skeptical, too, about Baker Mayfield. But I LOVE that guy. I don't know. Maybe it's just the eye test. 

Edited December 19, 2017 by CLTbills

[The Now Moment]

On 12/17/2017 at 2:12 PM, Buffalo Barbarian said:

The same reason Dashawn Watson is the only good QB from Clemson, it's about the player actually being a good player regardless of the system.

Actually, Houston designed an offense that is very similar to Clemson's.  It is not a common NFL system.  He went to the perfect team that had a college coach in Bill O'brien who is familiar with college systems.  Not saying he wouldn't be good on another team but...who knows?

 

System certainly can make a difference, especially for a rookie QB.  Personally, I think his familiarity with that type of playbook helped Watson play as well as he did.  

 

Not much of a fan of Rudolph.  He doesn't have a big arm.  Watching his out route passes to the sideline...some of them look like they are big time ducks that make it there because he's playing against college players.  To me, he is the opposite prospect of Allen.  Allen has all the physical tools, mobility, can throw on the run, huge arm, didn't have any talent around him and wasn't as productive at a small school.  Rudolph is more stationary, doesn't show great ability to throw on the run, doesn't have a big arm, had great talent around him and was highly productive at a big time school.  

 

I think Rudolph would be a mistake.  System, players around him, lack of arm strength...not a high prospect in my eyes

[Victory Formation]

23 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said:

Actually, Houston designed an offense that is very similar to Clemson's.  It is not a common NFL system.  He went to the perfect team that had a college coach in Bill O'brien who is familiar with college systems.  Not saying he wouldn't be good on another team but...who knows?

 

System certainly can make a difference, especially for a rookie QB.  Personally, I think his familiarity with that type of playbook helped Watson play as well as he did.  

 

Not much of a fan of Rudolph.  He doesn't have a big arm.  Watching his out route passes to the sideline...some of them look like they are big time ducks that make it there because he's playing against college players.  To me, he is the opposite prospect of Allen.  Allen has all the physical tools, mobility, can throw on the run, huge arm, didn't have any talent around him and wasn't as productive at a small school.  Rudolph is more stationary, doesn't show great ability to throw on the run, doesn't have a big arm, had great talent around him and was highly productive at a big time school.  

 

I think Rudolph would be a mistake.  System, players around him, lack of arm strength...not a high prospect in my eyes

Think Rudolph is a lot better than you give him credit for. His arm is better than Jackson's and Mayfield's but you don't hear anybody criticizing them. Rosen and Darnold aren't any more mobile than Rudolph. Granted, you see Darnold and Rosen make throws into tight windows and you wonder how the hell some of these throws are humanly possible but I have seen Rudolph make throws where you just wonder how the hell he fit that in there, albeit not with the same consistency as Darnold and Rosen but enough to where I think Rudolph can be developed.

[The Now Moment]

1 hour ago, NewDayBills said:

Think Rudolph is a lot better than you give him credit for. His arm is better than Jackson's and Mayfield's but you don't hear anybody criticizing them. Rosen and Darnold aren't any more mobile than Rudolph. Granted, you see Darnold and Rosen make throws into tight windows and you wonder how the hell some of these throws are humanly possible but I have seen Rudolph make throws where you just wonder how the hell he fit that in there, albeit not with the same consistency as Darnold and Rosen but enough to where I think Rudolph can be developed.

That's just my opinion of him and I have had the pleasure to watch many games from each of these QBs.  I don't listen to the "experts" as much as others do, I watch for myself and come up with my own opinion and I don't see a franchise QB there right now.  While he can surely develop, where he is right now...he's far away from that and seems to have a lower ceiling than the other prospects.  Rosen and Darnold are clearly more consistent if you watch them game to game.  Even with Darnold's inconsistent moments this year, he's shown a much higher skillset potential than Rudolph.  I've watched him try to make NFL throws and a lot of them look like ducks that sneak by the college athlete.  Darnold and Rosen show zip when making those NFL type throws and do a nice job at manipulating safeties and linebackers with their eyes.  

 

I'm just not a fan of him.  He reminds me of the classic college QB that doesn't have the abilities that translate to the NFL based on the attributes I stated in the previous post.  Doesn't mean he can't develop into a franchise QB but right now...I see too many similarities to failed QBs.  For his sake, I hope I'm wrong.  

 

I am not a huge fan of Jackson or Mayfield either.  Both of those guys have potential but there are major questions in their games when it comes to transitioning their abilities to the NFL. I'm not interested in Jackson's running ability as the potential to be injured as a running QB is extremely high in this league now.  There are so many recent examples.  I'm looking for a pass first QB.  Mayfield has big question marks around him.  How is he gonna fair in the NFL where guys are bigger and faster and hit harder?  He's a tiny guy with not the best arm.  Can he take a hit from a guy like Suh and get up and keep playing?  I have questions...we will know more once the bowl games/interview process/senior bowl/combine is over.  

[Victory Formation]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said:

That's just my opinion of him and I have had the pleasure to watch many games from each of these QBs.  I don't listen to the "experts" as much as others do, I watch for myself and come up with my own opinion and I don't see a franchise QB there right now.  While he can surely develop, where he is right now...he's far away from that and seems to have a lower ceiling than the other prospects.  Rosen and Darnold are clearly more consistent if you watch them game to game.  Even with Darnold's inconsistent moments this year, he's shown a much higher skillset potential than Rudolph.  I've watched him try to make NFL throws and a lot of them look like ducks that sneak by the college athlete.  Darnold and Rosen show zip when making those NFL type throws and do a nice job at manipulating safeties and linebackers with their eyes.  

 

I'm just not a fan of him.  He reminds me of the classic college QB that doesn't have the abilities that translate to the NFL based on the attributes I stated in the previous post.  Doesn't mean he can't develop into a franchise QB but right now...I see too many similarities to failed QBs.  For his sake, I hope I'm wrong.  

 

I am not a huge fan of Jackson or Mayfield either.  Both of those guys have potential but there are major questions in their games when it comes to transitioning their abilities to the NFL. I'm not interested in Jackson's running ability as the potential to be injured as a running QB is extremely high in this league now.  There are so many recent examples.  I'm looking for a pass first QB.  Mayfield has big question marks around him.  How is he gonna fair in the NFL where guys are bigger and faster and hit harder?  He's a tiny guy with not the best arm.  Can he take a hit from a guy like Suh and get up and keep playing?  I have questions...we will know more once the bowl games/interview process/senior bowl/combine is over.  

I'm with you on Darnold, Rosen, Jackson and Mayfield. We will have to disagree on Rudolph, I will state for the record that I am also a fan of Josh Allen but when I say I don't like Mayfield and Jackson, I mean that I don't want them in the first, I would roll the dice on them in round 2.

[The Now Moment]

2 minutes ago, NewDayBills said:

I'm with you on Darnold, Rosen, Jackson and Mayfield. We will have to disagree on Rudolph, I will state for the record that I am also a fan of Josh Allen but when I say I don't like Mayfield and Jackson, I mean that I don't want them in the first, I would roll the dice on them in round 2.

Agreed on Mayfield and Jackson.  Rudolph just has to show me more.  He has the potential but just not what I'm looking for in arm strength.  He hasn't taken a lot of snaps under center, he's had great college receivers who've inflated his numbers by their run after the catch abilities and I've seen a ton of screens from him.  He doesn't excite me as much as the others.  I hope for his sake I'm wrong but I don't see a guy that can lead an offense right now.  I see a guy that has relied on his system and great players around him to shred less than stellar defenses with decent throws that are lacking zip.  Again, hopefully he proves me wrong for his sake.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

3 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

Actually, Houston designed an offense that is very similar to Clemson's.  It is not a common NFL system.  He went to the perfect team that had a college coach in Bill O'brien who is familiar with college systems.  Not saying he wouldn't be good on another team but...who knows?

 

System certainly can make a difference, especially for a rookie QB.  Personally, I think his familiarity with that type of playbook helped Watson play as well as he did.  

 

Not much of a fan of Rudolph.  He doesn't have a big arm.  Watching his out route passes to the sideline...some of them look like they are big time ducks that make it there because he's playing against college players.  To me, he is the opposite prospect of Allen.  Allen has all the physical tools, mobility, can throw on the run, huge arm, didn't have any talent around him and wasn't as productive at a small school.  Rudolph is more stationary, doesn't show great ability to throw on the run, doesn't have a big arm, had great talent around him and was highly productive at a big time school.  

 

I think Rudolph would be a mistake.  System, players around him, lack of arm strength...not a high prospect in my eyes

I agree about Rudolph.

 

I wouldn't say O'Brien is a college coach. He is a Bellicheck guy who ran a prostyle offense at Penn st and made Hackenberg look great. However he is smart enough to adapt his offense to Watson . Hopefully when we draft Mayfield we do the same thing.

 

 

2 hours ago, NewDayBills said:

Think Rudolph is a lot better than you give him credit for. His arm is better than Jackson's and Mayfield's but you don't hear anybody criticizing them. Rosen and Darnold aren't any more mobile than Rudolph. Granted, you see Darnold and Rosen make throws into tight windows and you wonder how the hell some of these throws are humanly possible but I have seen Rudolph make throws where you just wonder how the hell he fit that in there, albeit not with the same consistency as Darnold and Rosen but enough to where I think Rudolph can be developed.

 

No his arm is not better than Mayfield nor is he a good of a runner.

 

 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

1 hour ago, Buffalo30 said:

That's just my opinion of him and I have had the pleasure to watch many games from each of these QBs.  I don't listen to the "experts" as much as others do, I watch for myself and come up with my own opinion and I don't see a franchise QB there right now.  While he can surely develop, where he is right now...he's far away from that and seems to have a lower ceiling than the other prospects.  Rosen and Darnold are clearly more consistent if you watch them game to game.  Even with Darnold's inconsistent moments this year, he's shown a much higher skillset potential than Rudolph.  I've watched him try to make NFL throws and a lot of them look like ducks that sneak by the college athlete.  Darnold and Rosen show zip when making those NFL type throws and do a nice job at manipulating safeties and linebackers with their eyes.  

 

I'm just not a fan of him.  He reminds me of the classic college QB that doesn't have the abilities that translate to the NFL based on the attributes I stated in the previous post.  Doesn't mean he can't develop into a franchise QB but right now...I see too many similarities to failed QBs.  For his sake, I hope I'm wrong.  

 

I am not a huge fan of Jackson or Mayfield either.  Both of those guys have potential but there are major questions in their games when it comes to transitioning their abilities to the NFL. I'm not interested in Jackson's running ability as the potential to be injured as a running QB is extremely high in this league now.  There are so many recent examples.  I'm looking for a pass first QB.  Mayfield has big question marks around him.  How is he gonna fair in the NFL where guys are bigger and faster and hit harder?  He's a tiny guy with not the best arm.  Can he take a hit from a guy like Suh and get up and keep playing?  I have questions...we will know more once the bowl games/interview process/senior bowl/combine is over.  

 

Mayfield's arm is fine, not sure what you are seeing there. He is not tiny just short his LT Tackle is 6'7" and plays well in the pocket. The players in college are the size of NFL players just not as good which is something all draftees have to deal with.

 

 

[The Now Moment]

29 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

I agree about Rudolph.

 

I wouldn't say O'Brien is a college coach. He is a Bellicheck guy who ran a prostyle offense at Penn st and made Hackenberg look great. However he is smart enough to adapt his offense to Watson . Hopefully when we draft Mayfield we do the same thing.

I said he was familiar with college offenses as he played against them while coaching Penn State.  That probably gives him a little advantage over a guy who has only coached at the NFL level

[The Now Moment]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Mayfield's arm is fine, not sure what you are seeing there. He is not tiny just short his LT Tackle is 6'7" and plays well in the pocket. The players in college are the size of NFL players just not as good which is something all draftees have to deal with.

 

 

He's 5'11".  That is tiny.  Also, I'm not talking about the height of his lineman.  I'm talking about the NFL size of defensive lineman and linebackers and guys that are gonna hit him in the mouth.  Can he take a hit like some of the bigger QBs.  These defenders in the NFL are faster and bigger and can hit harder.  Can he handle that for his size.  I have the same questions about the very thin Lamar Jackson.  These guys like to run outside the pocket and take hits.  Look how many QBs have been injured in recent years by doing this.  I think I have the right to have questions about that.  

 

Also, Mayfield has an okay arm.  It's not stellar.  That's not my issue with him though

[Buffalo Barbarian]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said:

He's 5'11".  That is tiny.  Also, I'm not talking about the height of his lineman.  I'm talking about the NFL size of defensive lineman and linebackers and guys that are gonna hit him in the mouth.  Can he take a hit like some of the bigger QBs.  These defenders in the NFL are faster and bigger and can hit harder.  Can he handle that for his size.  I have the same questions about the very thin Lamar Jackson.  These guys like to run outside the pocket and take hits.  Look how many QBs have been injured in recent years by doing this.  I think I have the right to have questions about that.  

 

Also, Mayfield has an okay arm.  It's not stellar.  That's not my issue with him though

 

Until they measure him you don't know he's 5'11". For his height he is a solidly built and isn't considered thin. Honestly not concerned about his size he can play.

 

Defenders aren't bigger and just a smidge faster, he will be fine. All rookies have to deal with better players in the NFL.

[The Now Moment]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Until they measure him you don't know he's 5'11". For his height he is a solidly built and isn't considered thin. Honestly not concerned about his size he can play.

 

Defenders aren't bigger and just a smidge faster, he will be fine. All rookies have to deal with better players in the NFL.

Players most certainly are bigger.  Look at Oklahoma's defensive line and tell me that the NFL doesn't have bigger players.  On average, the NFL has bigger, stronger players who hit harder.  Many college teams have really small defensive players.  

 

Mayfield isn't a perfect player.  He has lots to prove.  I'm not the biggest fan at this moment.  That could change leading up to the draft.  

[Acantha]

2 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Until they measure him you don't know he's 5'11".

Yep.  I've heard a couple people that have been close to him in person say they won't be surprised if he measures in at 5'10.

 

The combine is everything for Mayfield's draft position.  5'11 will probably cause him to fall some (without Russell Wilson's success it would drop him a lot), and his hand size could drop him more.  5'10, he'll probably drop out of the 1st round.

[Victory Formation]

11 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

I agree about Rudolph.

 

I wouldn't say O'Brien is a college coach. He is a Bellicheck guy who ran a prostyle offense at Penn st and made Hackenberg look great. However he is smart enough to adapt his offense to Watson . Hopefully when we draft Mayfield we do the same thing.

 

 

 

No his arm is not better than Mayfield nor is he a good of a runner.

 

 

I'm not anti-Mayfield, I'm just not sure if I would go for him in the first. If he was there in the second? I'd be interested quite possibly but a lot can change between now and the draft, maybe he rises, maybe he falls.

Edited December 20, 2017 by NewDayBills

[PaattMaann]

I have zero faith in Dennison being able to adapt a passing offense to fit the skills of his QB...he didn't do it with TT (or with our running game for the first half of the year either) so why would we with Mayfield/Jackson?

[Buffalo Barbarian]

21 hours ago, Acantha said:

Yep.  I've heard a couple people that have been close to him in person say they won't be surprised if he measures in at 5'10.

 

The combine is everything for Mayfield's draft position.  5'11 will probably cause him to fall some (without Russell Wilson's success it would drop him a lot), and his hand size could drop him more.  5'10, he'll probably drop out of the 1st round.

 

I hope he is 5'6"

 

 

 

 

 

 

12 hours ago, NewDayBills said:

I'm not anti-Mayfield, I'm just not sure if I would go for him in the first. If he was there in the second? I'd be interested quite possibly but a lot can change between now and the draft, maybe he rises, maybe he falls.

 

After this post season I'm expecting him to rise.

 

 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

23 hours ago, Buffalo30 said:

Players most certainly are bigger.  Look at Oklahoma's defensive line and tell me that the NFL doesn't have bigger players.  On average, the NFL has bigger, stronger players who hit harder.  Many college teams have really small defensive players.  

 

Mayfield isn't a perfect player.  He has lots to prove.  I'm not the biggest fan at this moment.  That could change leading up to the draft.  

 

The players from college to NFL are pretty comparable in size there might be a 10 pound difference of D-line on average with the back 7 being the same. That's not that big of a difference where Mayfield can't handle. The biggest difference is the players are a lot better and this will be the biggest adjustment for him.

 

 

[The Now Moment]

4 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

The players from college to NFL are pretty comparable in size there might be a 10 pound difference of D-line on average with the back 7 being the same. That's not that big of a difference where Mayfield can't handle. The biggest difference is the players are a lot better and this will be the biggest adjustment for him.

 

 

I guess we will just have to wait and see.