Rico Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 and as a result, watch players "over-value" themselves and price there way out of buffalo......... a good GM is ahead of the curve and identifies players who will exceed expectations........he then locks them in at reasonable deals and does not let them get to free agency......if you wait, and he if lives up to your expectations, he's as good as gone.........see winfield and jennings as examples........ 262488[/snapback] Buh-bye AW, you were not missed last year.So long JJ, you won't be missed either. Now when someone like a Lee Evans or a Willis McGahee or a Nate Clements comes up, sure, try to extend them early. I wouldn't have extended Schobel for that $$$, but that's another player who performed on the field, & TD got it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 JJ stated he wanted out. Now he is. PW had an offer made to him that ws REASONABLE for someone of his age and position a year ago and turned it down. See ya. Mike Pucillo? Are you fugging kidding me? 262489[/snapback] JJ stated over and over again he wanted to come back.........bills never even talked to him after the offer in early summer......... PW turned down the LOWBALL offer (it contained a bonus 2M lower then what he ended up getting) and they ignored him as well, right up to free agency......... MP = marcus price.........who is another guy who has not heard from the bills at all.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 a good GM is ahead of the curve and identifies players who will exceed expectations........he then locks them in at reasonable deals and does not let them get to free agency262488[/snapback] EXCEED EXPECTATIONS? let's see...Pucillo. Uh, no, didn't exceed anything. Jennings? He didn't even MEET expectations, let alone exceed them. And Williams? Like the guy, but come on, he's not even the best DT on the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 JJ stated over and over again he wanted to come back.........bills never even talked to him after the offer in early summer......... PW turned down the LOWBALL offer (it contained a bonus 2M lower then what he ended up getting) and they ignored him as well, right up to free agency......... MP = marcus price.........who is another guy who has not heard from the bills at all.......... 262493[/snapback] Yes, by making statements to the Atlanta Journal saying he'd love to have his star shine elsewhere. Uh huh. That offer was NOT LOWBALL, it was appropriate for a 33 year old DT! See Sam Adams. Would I like to see Price stay? Yes, but if the management sees something they don't like about the guy, why would they throw jack his way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 EXCEED EXPECTATIONS? let's see...Pucillo. Uh, no, didn't exceed anything. Jennings? He didn't even MEET expectations, let alone exceed them. And Williams? Like the guy, but come on, he's not even the best DT on the club. 262496[/snapback] again, your confused regarding pucillo.......i was talking about marcus price....... in regards to jennings, you had higher expectations then "starting LT" for a 3rd round pick? i think your setting the bar too high there........ williams was an important cog in the #2 defense.......he certainly met his expectations this year......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 Yes, by making statements to the Atlanta Journal saying he'd love to have his star shine elsewhere. Uh huh. That offer was NOT LOWBALL, it was appropriate for a 33 year old DT! See Sam Adams. Would I like to see Price stay? Yes, but if the management sees something they don't like about the guy, why would they throw jack his way? 262504[/snapback] jennings had an interview in the buffalo news right after the season stating he would love to remain a bill, felt good about what they were building, and that he wanted to finish the job here.......he also talked about much he liked working with jim mcnally.......he wanted to be here, and they never even called him....... the offer was lowball......like i said, he got 2M more guaranteed........sam adams contract is outdated (2 years old -- many other comparable DT's have signed since then)....... in regards to price, your right management shouldn't try to resign him if they see something wrong with him.......but management isn't always right and i'm allowed to disagree with them.......the point is he is another UFA who the bills have made no effort to resign......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 again, your confused regarding pucillo.......i was talking about marcus price....... in regards to jennings, you had higher expectations then "starting LT" for a 3rd round pick? i think your setting the bar too high there........ williams was an important cog in the #2 defense.......he certainly met his expectations this year......... 262508[/snapback] typed that before your response. "Starting LT" is a bit of a misnomer when he missed a whole scad of games over his career. But that's just it. he was a part-time DT, in a rotation. I could see if he played every down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 jennings had an interview in the buffalo news right after the season stating he would love to remain a bill, felt good about what they were building, and that he wanted to finish the job here.......he also talked about much he liked working with jim mcnally.......he wanted to be here, and they never even called him....... the offer was lowball......like i said, he got 2M more guaranteed........sam adams contract is outdated (2 years old -- many other comparable DT's have signed since then)....... in regards to price, your right management shouldn't try to resign him if they see something wrong with him.......but management isn't always right and i'm allowed to disagree with them.......the point is he is another UFA who the bills have made no effort to resign......... 262518[/snapback] So, then Jennings must be full of shite because prior to that interview, he publicly stated he wanted out. Good for Pat. And good for us. I NEVER want to return to the Butlerian days of overspending for aging players who are becoming decreasingly effective. Yes, that's your right, but I think I'll take the word of someone who handles the issue on a daily basis over that of someone who posts on a message board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 many have said that mcgee would make a better FS then CB due to him getting caught in the pivot and "losing his man" in space......... i would rather have clements, winfield, milloy, and mcgee......... 262235[/snapback] McGee's size and tackling issues would be a major liability at FS at this point of his career. He may make the switch at a future point, but I find it hard to justify your proposed secondary would have been superior to what the Bills had. Plus, it's nice to argue in a vacuum that Bills should have resigned Winfield to a cap hit of about twice the amount that Vincent commanded, and ignore the impact on the other spots on the team. If Bills signed Winfield in the previous year, you don't know if you have the cap space to get Villareal, and you almost certainly wouldn't be able to keep both Clements and Winfield. If you had a choice of the two, which one would you keep? Of course, you also don't address the Bills cap situation in '03 and whether TD actually had the room for Winfield's extension. Getting back to the Jennings dead horse, he is a left tackle, but not a franchise left tackle, and does not deserve a franchise LT money. Please tell me how much better he is than Bob Whitfield, Stockar McDougle, Matt Willig, Victor Riley, or Pork Chop Womack? They're all available, and will cost a lot less than JJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like A Mofo Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 Getting back to the Jennings dead horse, he is a left tackle, but not a franchise left tackle, and does not deserve a franchise LT money. Please tell me how much better he is than Bob Whitfield, Stockar McDougle, Matt Willig, Victor Riley, or Pork Chop Womack? They're all available, and will cost a lot less than JJ. 262533[/snapback] I could not agree more. Good post as always GG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 I could not agree more. Good post as always GG. 262537[/snapback] but hey! Why not throw the Bling at a guy who's probably goign to miss a third of the games this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 What's the point of paying out the wazoo, only to lose in the first round of the playoffs? 262388[/snapback] the point is getting to watch an enjoyable regular season that ends with a possibly exciting playoff game of which no one knows the outcome until afterwards. call me crazy, but as a fan that is far more preferable than suffering through a dreary7-9 season (buffalo's average this millenium). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 McGee's size and tackling issues would be a major liability at FS at this point of his career. He may make the switch at a future point, but I find it hard to justify your proposed secondary would have been superior to what the Bills had. Plus, it's nice to argue in a vacuum that Bills should have resigned Winfield to a cap hit of about twice the amount that Vincent commanded, and ignore the impact on the other spots on the team. If Bills signed Winfield in the previous year, you don't know if you have the cap space to get Villareal, and you almost certainly wouldn't be able to keep both Clements and Winfield. If you had a choice of the two, which one would you keep? Of course, you also don't address the Bills cap situation in '03 and whether TD actually had the room for Winfield's extension. Getting back to the Jennings dead horse, he is a left tackle, but not a franchise left tackle, and does not deserve a franchise LT money. Please tell me how much better he is than Bob Whitfield, Stockar McDougle, Matt Willig, Victor Riley, or Pork Chop Womack? They're all available, and will cost a lot less than JJ. 262533[/snapback] gerry, i agree that he's not a franchise LT, but have did you watch bob whitfield last year (03)? he was hands down the worst starting tackle in the league. on an unrelated topic and not directed at you, let's not exaggerate the injury-proneness of JJ. He's played in 52 out of 64 games since he's been here, and has never missed more than 5 games/season. honestly, for the nfl that's not that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 You guys can rip TD a new one, for all I care. He's not a Deity in my eyes. Just back it up with some intelligent ideas regarding aquiring/keeping players and fitting their salaries within the framework of the cap. 262123[/snapback] Here? On this board?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 on an unrelated topic and not directed at you, let's not exaggerate the injury-proneness of JJ. He's played in 52 out of 64 games since he's been here, and has never missed more than 5 games/season. honestly, for the nfl that's not that bad. 262669[/snapback] and how many of those games did he leave with an injury? Just because he started them doesn't mean he finished them. The guy has that rep for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 and how many of those games did he leave with an injury? Just because he started them doesn't mean he finished them. The guy has that rep for a reason. 262678[/snapback] i would venture to guess 3 or 4 at most. no more than that. again, let's not exaggerate (a pronounced tendency among posters here). he missed one game this past season. that's very solid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 i would venture to guess 3 or 4 at most. no more than that. again, let's not exaggerate (a pronounced tendency among posters here). he missed one game this past season. that's very solid. 262681[/snapback] Which is no surprise, since it was a contract year. I distinctly remember Ruben Brown screaming at him on the sideline for this very thing. It's not a fallacy and it won't surprise me at all if "Hangnail" Jennings makes regular appearances in the Bay Area now that he has a fat contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 i would venture to guess 3 or 4 at most. no more than that. again, let's not exaggerate (a pronounced tendency among posters here). he missed one game this past season. that's very solid. 262681[/snapback] It's hard to say what is exaggerated and what isn't. This last year, for example, he started and played against the jets with a slight concussion and got schooled by Abraham for three sacks I think. He even admitted that he was foggy and he probably shouldn't have played at all. That is officially a game started but in actuality was a game missed due to injury. He's had a lot of nagging and significant injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 and how many of those games did he leave with an injury? Just because he started them doesn't mean he finished them. The guy has that rep for a reason. 262678[/snapback] i just did some checking. in three seasons, mike williams has played in 42 out of 48 games (average of 14 per season). in four season, jennings played in 52 out of 64 (13 per season). Since 1999, trey teague has played in 78 out of 96 games (13 per season). villarrial has played in 132 out of 144 games (just under 15/season). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2005 Share Posted March 4, 2005 Which is no surprise, since it was a contract year. I distinctly remember Ruben Brown screaming at him on the sideline for this very thing. It's not a fallacy and it won't surprise me at all if "Hangnail" Jennings makes regular appearances in the Bay Area now that he has a fat contract. 262688[/snapback] no offense, but this is argument by anecdote, meaning taking one example (of which none of us really know what was said) and extrapolating that into a defining element of one's character. i don't buy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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