The fastest way back to the playoffs

[BuffaloFan68]

I would rather not make the playoffs in 2017 & make a Super Bowl run in 2018 over making the playoffs in both years & being eliminated quickly.

Go Bills!!!!!

[Royale with Cheese]

 

No, I embrace Air Raid. It's just a type of spread offense. Mahomes is acknowledging what he hears.

 

Look, your viewpoint is perfectly valid. The scouting reports you showed me came from guys that talk to real NFL people. But here's where we differ. I look for opportunity. You are giving the viewpoint of the old boys network. These are scouts that watch a lot of prospects and come up with criteria that has worked for them in the past. Pro-Style offense, stay away from spread QB's was great advice back in the day. But it's 2017.

 

Very few college teams run pro-style offenses. Very few NFL teams do either! NFL teams now throw the ball in shotgun more than under center. They get rid of the ball quickly to a group of receivers after looking for mismatches. The college spread and the NFL offenses are converging. They are not the same yet but far closer than when Tim Couch was drafted.

 

NFL teams make the same mistakes over and over. Don't draft a short guy, don't draft a spread QB, don't draft a system QB.

 

The Air Raid issue you brought up will drop Mahomes from being what he should be, a top 5 pick. That's because NFL GM's come from a staid, conservative culture. No one wants to lose their job by innovating. It's why the Patriots are dominating. They think for themselves. Time for the Bills to do the same.

 

Mahomes is not just acknowledging what he hears, he knows the system he runs and knows the success rate it's produced. It's not a secret the Air Raid has bombed in the NFL. If he didn't think there was a difference between Air Spread and traditional spread...he would have stated that Air Raid QB's have struggled. He would have mentioned several spread QB's that were successful...but he didn't because they are different.

 

Sorry but every NFL team runs an NFL offenses. Some more complex, some less. Just because they are not under center as much and they are converging doesn't mean it's not an NFL offense. It's going to require QB's to go through progressions and not only presnap reads but post snap reads. They are still facing NFL defenses. It may have some college principles but it's it's much more complex...you're going to ask your pro QB to do more than a college QB. If a college offense at face value could be very successful in the NFL, more QB's would be much more successful. They're not because they're asked to do professional level reads, run a professional level offense, read an NFL defense etc....

 

The Patriots dominate because they have Brady and Belicheck. When you have the best QB and the best HC...you can take more risks because you've got a great foundation.

 

What makes Mahome a top 5 pick? His stats and strong arm? I think it takes more than that.

 

It's easy to point out all the misses from evaluators and GM's but they do have a lot of successes as well.

 

 

NFL.com analyst Bucky Brooks wrote earlier this season that he

has the physical traits NFL scouts look for. However, according to an AFC scout, concerns about his offensive transition are so great, "it's like he's playing a different sport."

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000768825/article/texas-techs-patrick-mahomes-intends-to-enter-2017-nfl-draft

 

Again, not saying he can't be successful but he's going to have to learn how to play QB in the NFL. The Air Raid offense is the most simple offense to run. He will have to sit and learn...he's not a day 1 starter. You can't ignore the history of Air Raid QB's, it's never had success in the NFL. Maybe Mahomes breaks that.

 

[bisonbrigade]

The fastest way back to the playoffs is ........................... There is none, been waiting since 1999

[jeffismagic]

 

 

No, I embrace Air Raid. It's just a type of spread offense. Mahomes is acknowledging what he hears.

 

Look, your viewpoint is perfectly valid. The scouting reports you showed me came from guys that talk to real NFL people. But here's where we differ. I look for opportunity. You are giving the viewpoint of the old boys network. These are scouts that watch a lot of prospects and come up with criteria that has worked for them in the past. Pro-Style offense, stay away from spread QB's was great advice back in the day. But it's 2017.

 

Very few college teams run pro-style offenses. Very few NFL teams do either! NFL teams now throw the ball in shotgun more than under center. They get rid of the ball quickly to a group of receivers after looking for mismatches. The college spread and the NFL offenses are converging. They are not the same yet but far closer than when Tim Couch was drafted.

 

NFL teams make the same mistakes over and over. Don't draft a short guy, don't draft a spread QB, don't draft a system QB.

 

The Air Raid issue you brought up will drop Mahomes from being what he should be, a top 5 pick. That's because NFL GM's come from a staid, conservative culture. No one wants to lose their job by innovating. It's why the Patriots are dominating. They think for themselves. Time for the Bills to do the same.

 

Mahomes is not just acknowledging what he hears, he knows the system he runs and knows the success rate it's produced. It's not a secret the Air Raid has bombed in the NFL. If he didn't think there was a difference between Air Spread and traditional spread...he would have stated that Air Raid QB's have struggled. He would have mentioned several spread QB's that were successful...but he didn't because they are different.

 

Sorry but every NFL team runs an NFL offenses. Some more complex, some less. Just because they are not under center as much and they are converging doesn't mean it's not an NFL offense. It's going to require QB's to go through progressions and not only presnap reads but post snap reads. They are still facing NFL defenses. It may have some college principles but it's it's much more complex...you're going to ask your pro QB to do more than a college QB. If a college offense at face value could be very successful in the NFL, more QB's would be much more successful. They're not because they're asked to do professional level reads, run a professional level offense, read an NFL defense etc....

 

The Patriots dominate because they have Brady and Belicheck. When you have the best QB and the best HC...you can take more risks because you've got a great foundation.

 

What makes Mahome a top 5 pick? His stats and strong arm? I think it takes more than that.

 

It's easy to point out all the misses from evaluators and GM's but they do have a lot of successes as well.

 

 

 

NFL.com analyst Bucky Brooks wrote earlier this season that he

has the physical traits NFL scouts look for. However, according to an AFC scout, concerns about his offensive transition are so great, "it's like he's playing a different sport."

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000768825/article/texas-techs-patrick-mahomes-intends-to-enter-2017-nfl-draft

 

Again, not saying he can't be successful but he's going to have to learn how to play QB in the NFL. The Air Raid offense is the most simple offense to run. He will have to sit and learn...he's not a day 1 starter. You can't ignore the history of Air Raid QB's, it's never had success in the NFL. Maybe Mahomes breaks that.

 

 

 

Where have I ever mentioned Mahomes stats? No, here is what I like:

 

Lightning Release (Great Plus Trait for Modern NFL)

Accuracy

Cannon Arm (Great Plus Trait in Cold Weather)

Pocket Presence

Accuracy Under Duress from Interior and Edge Pressure

Accuracy On The Move and on the run

Good NFL size

Maturity and Leadership

Field General Mentality

 

He checks all the boxes that I value

 

 

You really need to read up on Air Raid more. There is a lot more going on than you realize. Mahomes does go through progressions if his first read is not open, does manipulate safeties with his eyes, and does read defenses and makes checks at the line.

Edited March 17, 2017 by jeffismagic

[Alphadawg7]

It would be something at quarterback. The only way I see the Bills even making the playoffs next season is if their defense is a dominant #1 and doesn't choke away a big game or two, but actually wins that big game. I hope to eat my own words, but I'm afraid Taylor cannot win any game with his arm, and his legs will fail him soon enough. He will never be a game changing passer, if it hasn't happened already, and the Shades will be half a step slower each year from here on out.

 

They have to address quarterback this off season. Rolling with Taylor and allowing for Jones to develop is a plan, but not one that I think is going to produce a playoff spot this season or next. But, hey, what the hell do I know..

 

I totally understand your thinking, but let me show you facts that completely dispute what you just said and paint a much different picture of where we are at and what needs to happen to make the playoffs:

 

1. Passing Yards do NOT equal playoffs. Ask Drew Brees who has averaged 5000 yards per season the last 3 years and never won more than 7 games or made the playoffs. In fact, Brees, Rivers, Luck, Ryan, and Stafford have combined to make the playoffs just 3 times out of 15 tries the last 3 years.

2. In Tyrods 15 starts, we were the 5th highest scoring team in the NFL. Points are points, doesnt matter if you run or throw...each TD is worth 6 and we were the 5th best scoring team in the NFL with TT as our QB. And going into week 17 (when we sat TT), only the Falcons and Saints had scored more TD's than the Bills.

3. We scored all those points DESPITE not having our best WR for most the year, having the rest of our WR's hurt frequently, losing key OL for parts of the year, losing McCoy for a full game and most of 2 others, and switching OC's in week 2. Furthermore, TT had 3 different OC's in 3 straight seasons.

4. IN 15 games, TT led the Bills to 25 points or more TEN times.

5. We were the number 1 rushing attack in the NFL.

6. The 2 years with TT are the HIGHEST 2 years of Buffalo scoring in team history outside the first 3 SB years. Last years team was the 5th highest in Bills history in scoring, but if TT played week 17 likely would have finished THIRD in Bills history.

7. As the number 1 rushing attack, we also had the FEWEST pass ATTEMPTS in the NFL. If you don't throw it, you don't compile stats.

8. TT has an incredible TD:Turnover ratio

9. When Sammy got healthy after the bye week in 2015, the final 9 games of the season with TT he was one of the most productive WR's in the NFL showing what a healthy Sammy can do for TT and this offense, especially if TT trusts that WR.

10. We were a higher scoring team than most the teams in the playoffs under TT.

 

More about the D:

1. If you ignore the FLUKE shutout of the Patriots in week 4 that had No Brady, No Gronk, and No Jimmy but did have a 3rd string rookie QB with a hurt hand...the Bills defense in the other 15 games gave up an average of OVER 25 points per game, for 26th worst in the NFL.

2. Had Brady played week 4 and put up just 30 (he put up 41 on us a few weeks later) we would have been 28th in the NFL in points allowed over the full season.

2. Rex system clearly did not fit this defense.

3. We didn't have our best Safety and communicator in a complicated D most the season.

4. We lost BOTH our top 2 draft picks for half or all the season in Shaq and Rags.

5. We were missing our DL in Dareus for half the year.

6. We had other key injuries the D could not sustain.

7. We lost 8 games with TT and in those 8 games we lost by 6 points or less SIX times. Including having a big 3rd quarter lead against Oakland where the D gave up 4 straight TD drives late to Oak.

 

Now...when you average a score of 25+ points per game, that SHOULD be enough to win a lot of games. When you give up 25+ points per game you should lose a lot of games. We did BOTH.

 

Given we lost six games by 1 score or less, we clearly do not need to go from 26th worse defense to first ranked D to win more of those less than 1 score losses. Even a MODEST improvement of the D to middle of the pack would turn several of those 6 point or less losses into wins and that would equal the playoffs.

 

Now factor in, we "should" have a healthy Sammy to start the year, better WR's on the roster than last year behind him, both our top 2 picks last year healthy and ready to contribute on D, REX GONE, Dareus the whole year, already an upgrade at S, and whatever else we add in FA and the draft...and its quite easy to see that our path to the playoffs may be right in front of us THIS year. We were close the last 2 years, but the D was by far our biggest issue and just the change from Rex to McDermott will likely make a big difference.

 

We are on a much better path than people (who hate TT) realize. This false narrative about passing yards is just not factually correct. Yardage doesnt win games, scoring more points than the opponent wins game...and we were pretty good at scoring points and awful at preventing points.

 

GO BILLS

Edited March 17, 2017 by Alphadawg7

[Figster]

 

I totally understand your thinking, but let me show you facts that completely dispute what you just said and paint a much different picture of where we are at and what needs to happen to make the playoffs:

 

1. Passing Yards do NOT equal playoffs. Ask Drew Brees who has averaged 5000 yards per season the last 3 years and never won more than 7 games or made the playoffs. In fact, Brees, Rivers, Luck, Ryan, and Stafford have combined to make the playoffs just 3 times out of 15 tries the last 3 years.

2. In Tyrods 15 starts, we were the 5th highest scoring team in the NFL. Points are points, doesnt matter if you run or throw...each TD is worth 6 and we were the 5th best scoring team in the NFL with TT as our QB. And going into week 17 (when we sat TT), only the Falcons and Saints had scored more TD's than the Bills.

3. We scored all those points DESPITE not having our best WR for most the year, having the rest of our WR's hurt frequently, losing key OL for parts of the year, losing McCoy for a full game and most of 2 others, and switching OC's in week 2. Furthermore, TT had 3 different OC's in 3 straight seasons.

4. IN 15 games, TT led the Bills to 25 points or more TEN times.

5. We were the number 1 rushing attack in the NFL.

6. The 2 years with TT are the HIGHEST 2 years of Buffalo scoring in team history outside the first 3 SB years. Last years team was the 5th highest in Bills history in scoring, but if TT played week 17 likely would have finished THIRD in Bills history.

7. As the number 1 rushing attack, we also had the FEWEST pass ATTEMPTS in the NFL. If you don't throw it, you don't compile stats.

8. TT has an incredible TD:Turnover ratio

9. When Sammy got healthy after the bye week in 2015, the final 9 games of the season with TT he was one of the most productive WR's in the NFL showing what a healthy Sammy can do for TT and this offense, especially if TT trusts that WR.

10. We were a higher scoring team than most the teams in the playoffs under TT.

 

More about the D:

1. If you ignore the FLUKE shutout of the Patriots in week 4 that had No Brady, No Gronk, and No Jimmy but did have a 3rd string rookie QB with a hurt hand...the Bills defense in the other 15 games gave up an average of OVER 25 points per game, for 26th worst in the NFL.

2. Had Brady played week 4 and put up just 30 (he put up 41 on us a few weeks later) we would have been 28th in the NFL in points allowed over the full season.

2. Rex system clearly did not fit this defense.

3. We didn't have our best Safety and communicator in a complicated D most the season.

4. We lost BOTH our top 2 draft picks for half or all the season in Shaq and Rags.

5. We were missing our DL in Dareus for half the year.

6. We had other key injuries the D could not sustain.

7. We lost 8 games with TT and in those 8 games we lost by 6 points or less SIX times. Including having a big 3rd quarter lead against Oakland where the D gave up 4 straight TD drives late to Oak.

 

Now...when you average a score of 25+ points per game, that SHOULD be enough to win a lot of games. When you give up 25+ points per game you should lose a lot of games. We did BOTH.

 

Given we lost six games by 1 score or less, we clearly do not need to go from 26th worse defense to first ranked D to win more of those less than 1 score losses. Even a MODEST improvement of the D to middle of the pack would turn several of those 6 point or less losses into wins and that would equal the playoffs.

 

Now factor in, we "should" have a healthy Sammy to start the year, better WR's on the roster than last year behind him, both our top 2 picks last year healthy and ready to contribute on D, REX GONE, Dareus the whole year, already an upgrade at S, and whatever else we add in FA and the draft...and its quite easy to see that our path to the playoffs may be right in front of us THIS year. We were close the last 2 years, but the D was by far our biggest issue and just the change from Rex to McDermott will likely make a big difference.

 

We are on a much better path than people (who hate TT) realize. This false narrative about passing yards is just not factually correct. Yardage doesnt win games, scoring more points than the opponent wins game...and we were pretty good at scoring points and awful at preventing points.

 

GO BILLS

This is a very good post.

 

There is no substitute for good D in my humble opinion.

 

Do the Bills/Taylor need to get better throwing the football, of course they do, and Tyrod Taylor would probably be the 1st to agree.

 

On the other hand a good game manager that protects the football is something to build on in my humble opinion.

[BillsFan130]

Finding the right QB and coach is the only way. Got to pray that Tyrod takes a step forward this year, and Mcdermott knows what he's doing

[Maury Ballstein]

 

There is no substitute for good D in my humble opinion.

 

[jeffismagic]

Coach McDermott said that Tyrod Taylor was the right QB for the Buffalo Bills "at this time". That is not a ringing endorsement and leaves me a little bit of hope that the Bills finally start looking for the QB that will lead our franchise back to greatness.

 

Looking at the weak roster with tons of holes and no depth the Bills as presently put together are a 5-6 win team. The fastest way to dig out of this hole is to have 2 great drafts in 2017 and 2018 and to find the next great QB for the Bills.

 

 

Mommy Mommy!

 

What?

 

I keep going around in circles!

 

Shut up before I nail your other foot to the ground.

[BillsMedia]

Mahomes goes through progressions. But as to learning an NFL offense, he only has to play in a offense that shelters the QB more than any in the NFL. Hit some deep balls now and then. Hand off to Shady.

 

And unlike Tyrod, Mahomes can make every throw and the Bills can add the slant pattern to their offense.

 

Lost all credibility with this post alone. Mahomes has NEVER taken a snap in the NFL and he can make "every throw." Gosh i love the humor i find throughout these message boards I got a great laugh, you can't make this stuff up folks haha.

[jeffismagic]

 

Lost all credibility with this post alone. Mahomes has NEVER taken a snap in the NFL and he can make "every throw." Gosh i love the humor i find throughout these message boards I got a great laugh, you can't make this stuff up folks haha.

 

If you can barely read sentences in front of your face then who cares what you think is credible. I aim higher.

Edited March 17, 2017 by jeffismagic

[BillsMedia]

 

If you can barely read sentences in front of your face then who cares what you think is credible. I aim higher.

 

"And unlike Tyrod, Mahomes can make every throw and the Bills can add the slant pattern to their offense."

 

Seems like my reading is just fine.

[jeffismagic]

 

"And unlike Tyrod, Mahomes can make every throw and the Bills can add the slant pattern to their offense."

 

Seems like my reading is just fine.

 

You can play Frankenstein by piecing together statements from different threads but the phrase "make every throw" is a well-known scouting cliche used to evaluate prospective NFL QB's. Right now the Bills run an offense with a limited QB sheltered more than any other QB in the NFL who doesn't throw receivers open in the middle of the field. You may enjoy that but others do not.

 

And yes, thanks for the top notch point that Mahomes is entering the draft. I never would have guessed if you hadn't mentioned it. Guess what, real NFL teams scout college QBs and try to project them to the NFL. It would be nice if Buffalo joined the rest of the NFL and tried that as well.

[BillsMedia]

 

You can play Frankenstein by piecing together statements from different threads but the phrase "make every throw" is a well-known scouting cliche used to evaluate prospective NFL QB's. Right now the Bills run an offense with a limited QB sheltered more than any other QB in the NFL who doesn't throw receivers open in the middle of the field. You may enjoy that but others do not.

 

And yes, thanks for the top notch point that Mahomes is entering the draft. I never would have guessed if you hadn't mentioned it. Guess what, real NFL teams scout college QBs and try to project them to the NFL. It would be nice if Buffalo joined the rest of the NFL and tried that as well.

 

Different threads? check the 1st page but I understand how you feel right now trying to do anything you can to recover from your statement. What you said was he could make "EVERY" throw, yet he hasn't taken a snap to even show he can make a screen pass in the NFL. You're trying so hard and I admire that, I truly do. "Real NFL teams," interesting. Bills must be one of those fake NFL teams is what you're implying with that statement, now THIS is absolute gold. Love it.

[jeffismagic]

 

Different threads? check the 1st page but I understand how you feel right now trying to do anything you can to recover from your statement. What you said was he could make "EVERY" throw, yet he hasn't taken a snap to even show he can make a screen pass in the NFL. You're trying so hard and I admire that, I truly do. "Real NFL teams," interesting. Bills must be one of those fake NFL teams is what you're implying with that statement, now THIS is absolute gold. Love it.

 

If your point was that you object to the phrase "make every throw" start a thread on that. Other than that you haven't really made a point other than Mahomes is entering the NFL. So no one knows how these players will turn out until they are in the NFL. Guess we should just fire the GM and scouts and wait till they take some snaps on their team.

 

And your point that Mahomes can't throw a screen pass is even crazier, he was in an Air Raid offense. He did it a zillion times a game with touch and accuracy.

Edited March 17, 2017 by jeffismagic

[BillsMedia]

 

If your point was that you object to the phrase "make every throw" start a thread on that. Other than that you haven't really made a point other than Mahomes is entering the NFL. So no one knows how these players will turn out until they are in the NFL. Guess we should just fire the GM and scouts and wait till they take some snaps on their team.

 

We are praying for you, man. Hang in there this year.

Edited March 17, 2017 by BillsMedia

[Alphadawg7]

 

You can play Frankenstein by piecing together statements from different threads but the phrase "make every throw" is a well-known scouting cliche used to evaluate prospective NFL QB's. Right now the Bills run an offense with a limited QB sheltered more than any other QB in the NFL who doesn't throw receivers open in the middle of the field. You may enjoy that but others do not.

 

And yes, thanks for the top notch point that Mahomes is entering the draft. I never would have guessed if you hadn't mentioned it. Guess what, real NFL teams scout college QBs and try to project them to the NFL. It would be nice if Buffalo joined the rest of the NFL and tried that as well.

 

First off, anyone claiming Mahomes can make every throw is just over exaggerating. The correct phrasing would be, he has the ARM STRENGTH to make every throw...however, a lot of his "throws" wont work in the NFL and are not NFL type throws...hence why he isnt even considered the best QB in a draft where QB and Tackle are the two weakest positions. A QB who FREQUENTLY heaves off his back foot is going to find that does NOT work in the NFL even though he did it with great success in college. He has mechanics and foot work issues, other wise he would be the unanimous top QB in this draft rather than the one mostly ranked as 3rd or 4th behind Trubisky, Kizer, and Watson.

 

This class has very little separation in the top 4, so any one of them could go in any order, however, the overwhelming favorite to go first is Trubisky. And with all of them having major question marks to consider, its quite possible none of them go in the top 3 despite that the first 3 teams picking have a big need at QB.

 

Is Mahomes an intriguing prospect...sure...but all this nonsense absolute declerations of a kid who has never played a snap in the NFL, has a lot of fix before he does, and didn't even cease the top spot at his position in a weak class at that position is getting really over the top around here.

[jeffismagic]

 

We are praying for you, man. Hang in there this year.

 

Wow, way to get to 22 posts. 22 posts of nothing.

[BillsMedia]

 

First off, anyone claiming Mahomes can make every throw is just over exaggerating. The correct phrasing would be, he has the ARM STRENGTH to make every throw...however, a lot of his "throws" wont work in the NFL and are not NFL type throws...hence why he isnt even considered the best QB in a draft where QB and Tackle are the two weakest positions. A QB who FREQUENTLY heaves off his back foot is going to find that does NOT work in the NFL even though he did it with great success in college. He has mechanics and foot work issues, other wise he would be the unanimous top QB in this draft rather than the one mostly ranked as 3rd or 4th behind Trubisky, Kizer, and Watson.

 

This class has very little separation in the top 4, so any one of them could go in any order, however, the overwhelming favorite to go first is Trubisky. And with all of them having major question marks to consider, its quite possible none of them go in the top 3 despite that the first 3 teams picking have a big need at QB.

 

Is Mahomes an intriguing prospect...sure...but all this nonsense absolute declerations of a kid who has never played a snap in the NFL, has a lot of fix before he does, and didn't even cease the top spot at his position in a weak class at that position is getting really over the top around here.

 

Shhhh, don't tell Jeff he's in the zone.

[John from Riverside]

Well....im gonna just stick up for Jeff and say I actually like Mahomes

 

(ducks under desk)