John from Riverside Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Yeah I think Kiko would have done very well in our system......I dont think that had anything to do with it....I think it was trading an asset where we are strong to bring up a position where we are weak. I mean....its Shady McCoy for christ sake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 So you're disputing the assertion that Ryan didn't see Kiko as a fit for the defense? Why? um yes Doc. haven't you been reading what I posted. what Kelly said I will. It makes zero sense. Rex does not play a 3-4, he plays every possible defensive formation -- Kiko is EXTREMELY versatile, both against the pass and the run. Rex loves aggressive, instinctive players -- Kiko is very aggressive and instinctive. Rex loves guys that make plays and cause turnovers -- Kiko does that, Rex loves guys that have a nose for the ball and get to the ball quick. -- that's Kiko's greatest strength. There is zero chance he doesnt like or want Kiko. He just loved watching the Bills defense last year with Bradham and Brown, who have more size and one of the three would not be playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 If Kiko was that important, Ryan would have put up a much bigger fight for him. Instead the deal was done almost as soon as the Eagles asked for him. And that the defense improved immensely despite his absence and he's still recovering from his knee injury cant have escaped Ryan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) If Kiko was that important, Ryan would have put up a much bigger fight for him. Instead the deal was done almost as soon as the Eagles asked for him. And that the defense improved immensely despite his absence and he's still recovering from his knee injury cant have escaped Ryan. Doc. provide a link to a direct quote from Rex (and not speculation or AP copies from mainstream media outlets) to see if he A) did or did not like Kilo or B) offered him up as trade bait and I will admit I was wrong and you are right. OBVIOUSLY they did well w/o Kiko in 2014, so what harm were they doing by accepting the trade? http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2015/4/15/8419639/eagles-nfl-draft-picks-kiko-alonso-lesean-mccoy-trade-bills-rex-ryan-desean-jackson "Just do me a favor and look at our roster." The Eagles called back and told him, "Kiko Alonso." The straight-up deal—Alonso, a promising young linebacker who missed ’14 with an ACL tear, for McCoy, a two-time All-Pro running back—took 30 minutes, start to finish. Edited April 17, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 If Kiko was that important, Ryan would have put up a much bigger fight for him. Instead the deal was done almost as soon as the Eagles asked for him. And that the defense improved immensely despite his absence and he's still recovering from his knee injury cant have escaped Ryan. Huge difference between what you just said there and Ryan not wanting him, or not thinking there was a place for him on his defense. He could very well have loved Kiko, and said "Hell yes I'll trade him for Shady McCoy!" two seconds after being asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 They probably wanted pick 50 plus a mid or late rounder next year. Kiko a former second probably was valued at a second round pick. And in good negotiations you always ask for a little extra so they probably wanted a second and a pick next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snamsnoops Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 To me it talks about how much they think of Preston Brown Preston Brown was a BEAST in his rookie season.........and they probably expect him to get even better ^ and N. Bradham is a bad bad man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Doc. provide a link to a direct quote from Rex (and not speculation or AP copies from mainstream media outlets) to see if he A) did or did not like Kilo or B) offered him up as trade bait and I will admit I was wrong and you are right. OBVIOUSLY they did well w/o Kiko in 2014, so what harm were they doing by accepting the trade? http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2015/4/15/8419639/eagles-nfl-draft-picks-kiko-alonso-lesean-mccoy-trade-bills-rex-ryan-desean-jackson "Just do me a favor and look at our roster." The Eagles called back and told him, "Kiko Alonso." The straight-up dealAlonso, a promising young linebacker who missed 14 with an ACL tear, for McCoy, a two-time All-Pro running backtook 30 minutes, start to finish. There's no link for Ryan saying he wanted to keep Kiko or didn't want to keep him. What I'm saying is it's more believable that he saw the Bills did fine without him last year, he's coming off an injury, and is smaller than the LBers he prefers, and figured he was expendable if an offer came along. And the speed of the trade also suggests that Ryan didn't give it a moment's thought, as if he'd made up his mind awhile ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 There's no link for Ryan saying he wanted to keep Kiko or didn't want to keep him. What I'm saying is it's more believable that he saw the Bills did fine without him last year, he's coming off an injury, and is smaller than the LBers he prefers, and figured he was expendable if an offer came along. And the speed of the trade also suggests that Ryan didn't give it a moment's thought, as if he'd made up his mind awhile ago. the call came out of the Blue.. Whaley says look at the roster. Says he wants Kiko. the guys pour another glass and say yes we are thick at LB and Thin at RB. Done. i think that all there is to it. Whaley et all were probably whizzing themselves at this point anyways at a chance for McCoy. They would maybe given Brown or Bradham , but Kelly said kiko. someone on that patio was probably snickering too. saying idiot homer Chip Kelly wants to take that risk on the knees? let him have it. Not a statement about Kiko so much. maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 the call came out of the Blue.. Whaley says look at the roster. Says he wants Kiko. the guys pour another glass and say yes we are thick at LB and Thin at RB. Done. i think that all there is to it. Whaley et all were probably whizzing themselves at this point anyways at a chance for McCoy. They would maybe given Brown or Bradham , but Kelly said kiko. someone on that patio was probably snickering too. saying idiot homer Chip Kelly wants to take that risk on the knees? let him have it. Not a statement about Kiko so much. maybe. I'm not sure how thick the Bills were at LB versus RB. And at that point, Spiller returning was a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 I'm not sure how thick the Bills were at LB versus RB. And at that point, Spiller returning was a possibility. Doc they had two 3 down LBs already that they could move around and Kiko , and Spikes ?? I dont think they felt all that swell about Spiller ina Roman offense. just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah John Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 This looks like a fair trade to me. Two good players who probably aren't quite as valuable (I didn't say as good) as people think. McCoy is an excellent runner, but lots of guys are behind a great O line. Alonso is an excellent LB but has injury questions. I think we should look at Kiko as the Bills having struck a little gold there in the second round, but unless he plays for another six or eight years without the injuries slowing him down, the Bills probably moved him at the peak of his value. Alonso is also going into the third year of his contract. GMs look at rookies as a cheap way to fill out the roster, and trading a draft pick would have hurt the budget a lot for 2016-17, when the Bills have other contract issues to worry about. Which would have included Kiko if he was still here. I was looking forward to seeing Kiko in a RR defense, but I posted several times late last year whether we should consider diluting the defensive talent a little in order to beef up the offense. (I got slammed too.) Barring injuries (though why would we do that? they happen every year) we have a really good group of LBs now. Just not a lot of depth. The Bills needed to improve their offense and the Eagles needed to rebuild their defense. This all makes sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 Doc they had two 3 down LBs already that they could move around and Kiko , and Spikes ?? I dont think they felt all that swell about Spiller ina Roman offense. just a thought. They told Spikes they didn't think he was a 3-down LB and are only showing interest for depth and because his asking price is probably way down. Rivers was going to be, and eventually was, released. So basically the only proven guys you have are Bradham and Brown, and maybe Lawson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 They told Spikes they didn't think he was a 3-down LB and are only showing interest for depth and because his asking price is probably way down. Rivers was going to be, and eventually was, released. So basically the only proven guys you have are Bradham and Brown, and maybe Lawson. And there are only two or three spots. If Kiko stays, one very good player is on the bench at all times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 (edited) And there are only two or three spots. If Kiko stays, one very good player is on the bench at all times. Which may or may not reflect my point. I dont know what they thought. But i bet they get pretty got a little giddy when Kelly called. Butt hurt am I about Alonso. I was pretty excited to see these 3 plus Spikes wreak havoc. Edited April 19, 2015 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uffalo Ills Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Glad we saved #50. We can draft a 100 tackle LB any year whaley is our GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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