Big Gun Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 (edited) Sancho had a 1:1 TD : Turnover ratio. He was worse than Foles. He took a 6-1 team and got them to 10-6. He's bad. Really bad. In 9 games Sanchez had 15 TDs(1 rushing), 11 ints, and 3 lost fumbles. In 8 games Foles had 13 TDs 10 ints and 3 lost fumbles. Maybe i'm missing something but it doesn't appear that Sanchez was worse as you say. Look, i'm not saying I want Sanchez on the Bills, i'm saying there wasn't a drop off if any from how Foles was performing to what Sanchez did this year. Maybe the Eagles agree with that and resign Sanchez and dangle Foles for trade, as they also have Matt Barkley waiting in the wings. If so, I hope Whaley jumps all over that. Wishful thinking. Edited December 31, 2014 by old school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 In 9 games Sanchez had 15 TDs(1 rushing), 11 ints, and 3 lost fumbles. In 8 games Foles had 13 TDs 10 ints and 3 lost fumbles. Maybe i'm missing something but it doesn't appear that Sanchez was worse as you say. Now you're just convincing me that I don't want either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Now you're just convincing me that I don't want either. Yeah, I hear ya, but Whaley has to do something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 That was the team and they still finished 10-6. Stats wise Sanchez performed ever so slightly better than did Foles this year. Agreed... I've always been a HUGE Sanchez-basher...I mean...I hated the guy...But I have to admit he impressed me this year...He went out, worked hard, and proved he's still a serviceable NFL QB...I'd still like to see him cut down on the INT's...Sometimes he just throws terrible passes that make you shake your head...But he did complete 64% of his passes in an Offense he just learned...The Bills could do worse than bringing him in to compete with EJ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 (edited) In 9 games Sanchez had 15 TDs(1 rushing), 11 ints, and 3 lost fumbles. In 8 games Foles had 13 TDs 10 ints and 3 lost fumbles. Maybe i'm missing something but it doesn't appear that Sanchez was worse as you say. Look, i'm not saying I want Sanchez on the Bills, i'm saying there wasn't a drop off if any from how Foles was performing to what Sanchez did this year. Maybe the Eagles agree with that and resign Sanchez and dangle Foles for trade, as they also have Matt Barkley waiting in the wings. If so, I hope Whaley jumps all over that. Wishful thinking. I decided to do a comparison exercise with Foles, Sanchez and Manuel using the numbers they produced in 2014. Since Manuel started only 4 games, I simply doubled the numbers to see where they would land in comparison to Foles and Sanchez's numbers: Foles - 13 TDs, 311 attempts, 59.9 completion %, 10 interceptions, 270 yards per game, 11.6 yards per completion, 81.4 QB rating, 9 sacks (8 games) Sanchez- 15 TDs (14 passing/1 rushing), 309 attempts, 64.1 completion %, 11 interceptions, 268.7 yards per game, 12.2 yards per completion, 88.4 QB rating, 23 sacks (9 games) Manuel - 12 TDs (10 passing/2 rushing), 262 attempts, 58 completion %, 6 interceptions, 209.5 yards per game, 11 yards per completion, 80.3 QB rating, 12 sacks (doubling stats of 4 games started) Now, 2 of these guys have offensive genius Chip Kelly coaching and calling plays for them and 1 of these guys has Nate Hackett. Think Manuel would be just as good as Foles or Sanchez if he were an Eagle? I definitely do. Edited December 31, 2014 by 1billsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 I decided to do a comparison exercise with Foles, Sanchez and Manuel using the numbers they produced in 2014. Since Manuel started only 4 games, I simply doubled the numbers to see where they would land in comparison to Foles and Sanchez's numbers: Foles - 13 TDs, 311 attempts, 59.9 completion %, 10 interceptions, 270 yards per game, 11.6 yards per completion, 81.4 QB rating, 9 sacks (8 games) Sanchez- 15 TDs (14 passing/1 rushing), 309 attempts, 64.1 completion %, 11 interceptions, 268.7 yards per game, 12.2 yards per completion, 88.4 QB rating, 23 sacks (9 games) Manuel - 12 TDs (10 passing/2 rushing), 262 attempts, 58 completion %, 6 interceptions, 209.5 yards per game, 11 yards per completion, 80.3 QB rating, 12 sacks (doubling stats of 4 games started) Now, 2 of these guys have offensive genius Chip Kelly coaching and calling plays for them and 1 of these guys has Nate Hackett. Think Manuel would be just as good as Foles or Sanchez if he were an Eagle? I definitely do. Honestly, I think he would do worse because the up tempo Kelly runs requires extremely fast decision making pre snap and within 1 or 2 seconds of the snap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumblefish Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 no one on the present roster, and just about anyone but Cutler and Bradford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 (edited) Honestly, I think he would do worse because the up tempo Kelly runs requires extremely fast decision making pre snap and within 1 or 2 seconds of the snap. I think you're wrong there, EJ always seemed much better in the hurry up because it didn't allow him to overthink. IMO Kelly would know what to do with Manuel's skills and both Foles and Sanchez would be on the bench if Manuel was there at the start of the season. Was it surprising to you how close those numbers were? Especially considering how by a large margin fans would rather have either of them instead of Manuel? Edited December 31, 2014 by 1billsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 I think you're wrong there, EJ always seemed much better in the hurry up because it didn't allow him to overthink. IMO Kelly would know what to do with Manuel's skills and both Foles and Sanchez would be on the bench if Manuel was there at the start of the season. Was it surprising to you how close those numbers were? Especially considering how by a large margin fans would rather have either of them instead of Manuel? Those numbers were close because they were extrapolated, and they don't reflect reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Those numbers were close because they were extrapolated, and they don't reflect reality. Ok, well here is the reality of the first four games... Foles - 6 TDs, 57.8 completion %, 4 interceptions, 82 QB rating (first 4 games) Manuel - 6 TDs (5 pass / 1 rush), 58 completion %, 3 interceptions, 80.3 QB rating (first 4 games) So extrapolating Foles' numbers would have been a great indicator of his season after eight games. Are you arguing that Manuel is much more horrible regardless of the numbers? You do know that Manuel has the giant handicap of being coached by Hackett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Ok, well here is the reality of the first four games... Foles - 6 TDs, 57.8 completion %, 4 interceptions, 82 QB rating (first 4 games) Manuel - 6 TDs (5 pass / 1 rush), 58 completion %, 3 interceptions, 80.3 QB rating (first 4 games) So extrapolating Foles' numbers would have been a great indicator of his season after eight games. Are you arguing that Manuel is much more horrible regardless of the numbers? You do know that Manuel has the giant handicap of being coached by Hackett. Thank you. Plus EJ played against the Bears, Dolphins, Chargers and Texans defenses. Foles played against the Jags, Colts, Redskins and 49ers. Both had 2-2 home away. Who had the tougher opponent. It's not even close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 (edited) Ok, well here is the reality of the first four games... Foles - 6 TDs, 57.8 completion %, 4 interceptions, 82 QB rating (first 4 games) Manuel - 6 TDs (5 pass / 1 rush), 58 completion %, 3 interceptions, 80.3 QB rating (first 4 games) So extrapolating Foles' numbers would have been a great indicator of his season after eight games. Are you arguing that Manuel is much more horrible regardless of the numbers? You do know that Manuel has the giant handicap of being coached by Hackett. Manuel was worse, yes. Please make sure you insert total yards in there. Unless you think a 173 yard game and a 322 yard game are "equal." Let's also get some number of attempts and number of completions in there, hmm? Maybe YPA? And completion percentage to WR's? You know, things besides the handful of stats that fit your argument. Edited December 31, 2014 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 He lost his job to Derek Carr. I'm not sure I'm interested. Maybe because Carr was the hot new 1st round draft pick had something to do with it? Other guys who have beaten out: Kurt Warner beat out by Trent Green Roger Staubach beat out by Craig Morton Kurt Warner beat out by Matt Lienert Doug Flutie beat out by Rob Johnson Nick Foles beat out by Michael Vick Tom Brady beat out by Drew Bledsoe May or may not mean anything. Basing your opinion on QBs based on what Tony Sporano would do seems dubious at best IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Maybe because Carr was the hot new 1st round draft pick had something to do with it? Other guys who have beaten out: Kurt Warner beat out by Trent Green Roger Staubach beat out by Craig Morton Kurt Warner beat out by Matt Lienert Doug Flutie beat out by Rob Johnson Nick Foles beat out by Michael Vick Tom Brady beat out by Drew Bledsoe May or may not mean anything. Basing your opinion on QBs based on what Tony Sporano would do seems dubious at best IMHO. He was a second rounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tintonfallsbillsfan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Locker Glennon ponder there no good choices only hunches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 (edited) Manuel was worse, yes. Please make sure you insert total yards in there. Unless you think a 173 yard game and a 322 yard game are "equal." Let's also get some number of attempts and number of completions in there, hmm? Maybe YPA? And completion percentage to WR's? You know, things besides the handful of stats that fit your argument. YPA is equal and Foles had more yards per game because he threw it 15-20 times more than EJ per game. So what stat are you down to now? Completion percentage to WRs?...LOL The numbers just don't back up your argument. These are real stats and we all know that Foles has the much better coach guiding him than does Manuel, that's not even close. Edited December 31, 2014 by 1billsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Aaron Rodgers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 YPA is equal and Foles had more yards per game because he threw it 15-20 times more than EJ per game. So what stat are you down to now? Completion percentage to WRs?...LOL The numbers just don't back up your argument. These are real stats and we all know that Foles has the much better coach guiding him than does Manuel, that's not even close. Well goodness, it's a good thing we'll never ask EJ to throw a lot. And yes. Completion percentage to WR's is a very fundamental stat that can dictate which QB inflates his numbers more with check-downs. It's also a prime example of EJ's ineptitude. I believe EJ's was 37%. Or how about passes completed +20 yards down the field. Your "real stats" will fool anyone without a basic understanding of how the QB position is played. Other than that, they are next to useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 He was a second rounder. Good point. But the rest of my postis still valid. Picking a QB based on what Tony Sparano does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2014 Share Posted December 31, 2014 Good point. But the rest of my postis still valid. Picking a QB based on what Tony Sparano does? Well that and the fact Houston traded him for peanuts. And that he sucked in Houston. But you're right. It wouldn't be the first time a bad QB decision was made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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