YoloinOhio Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Reading is tough. Whoops. Lol. I should have been more clear. It's early. OK, not really. Oof. I believe in k-9's schtick and EJ Manuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 What said makes no sense because you dont have a fricken clue in what we have in EJ Manuel going into his second year without even a full season yet.... What is interesting is there were parts of last season that EJ actually played WELL......but even if he had played horribly it still would of held true that you cant judge him from his rookie season.... It is also true that people comparing him to the great QBs of the league also have no idea and are just hoping that he is that good....we should all be hoping his is that good because the bills are all in on EJ Manuel You know what I know? There are more busts than SB winners. Thus EJ has a better chance of being a bust than an SB winner. By the way, why did EJ not play a full season yet? What happens if it repeats and he plays 9 or 10 games next year? If he has 6 injuries in 2 years? Do we still say, "whelp, we don't know what we have in him yet, onward to the 2016 season!" If EJ misses more than 2 games next year, I am done with him. Not, "I don't believe in him" done, more like, "I want him off the team" done. And I believe he will get hurt again. And then what? Thad Lewis as the starter while we lose half of our stars to free agency? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 In answer to the original question, I believe in EJ. While he had some bad games like Tampa Bay and Pittsburgh, he also had several good games where he looked like THE MAN. Up until the first injury, we were 2-2 with good games by EJ vs NE, Carolina, and Baltimore. He looked good vs Cleveland and looked like he was on the verge or leading us to another win. But we all know what happened. In those early games too, he and fellow rookie Robert Woods were working together very well. He brought us back in comebacks vs Carolina and the Falcons twice save for fumbles by SJ and Chandler. He looks to be clutch and a leader which are very important qualities for a QB. The wild card is the injuries, but since I'm being optimistic, I'm rolling with those being flukes and it won't even be a problem going forward. E J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 You know what I know? There are more busts than SB winners. Thus EJ has a better chance of being a bust than an SB winner. ... Once again, a bit shortsighted. There is a vast gap between bust and SB winner. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 You know what I know? There are more busts than SB winners. Thus EJ has a better chance of being a bust than an SB winner. By the way, why did EJ not play a full season yet? What happens if it repeats and he plays 9 or 10 games next year? If he has 6 injuries in 2 years? Do we still say, "whelp, we don't know what we have in him yet, onward to the 2016 season!" If EJ misses more than 2 games next year, I am done with him. Not, "I don't believe in him" done, more like, "I want him off the team" done. And I believe he will get hurt again. And then what? Thad Lewis as the starter while we lose half of our stars to free agency? Chan....and I say this with with any malice towards you at all. If you get so tied up in wither EJ is gonna be here or not be prepared to be dissapointed. You dont just throw away 1st round pick QB's........there is an investment there and the bills are going to look for any and all ways to make that investment succeed. By hasnt played a full season......he started off strong.....and got hurt.....then came back.....and didnt play as well. Such is the life of an NFL ROOKIE...but the fact of the matter is a season is 16 games. And EJ did not play a full 16 yet (and for that matter...missed a portion of training camp to boot) And this "great or bust" thing.....you dont know..and even when you try to use the percentages of NFL QB's not becoming franchise QB's you STILL dont know.....EJ might end up being just "good" I think he deserves the chance to see just how high his celing goes based off periods of playing well last year AND his physical abilities which are off the charts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Once again, a bit shortsighted. There is a vast gap between bust and SB winner. GO BILLS!!! Shortsighted doesn't change the numbers. It's not like you can disagree with my presumption. Odds are odds. Chan....and I say this with with any malice towards you at all. If you get so tied up in wither EJ is gonna be here or not be prepared to be dissapointed. You dont just throw away 1st round pick QB's........there is an investment there and the bills are going to look for any and all ways to make that investment succeed. By hasnt played a full season......he started off strong.....and got hurt.....then came back.....and didnt play as well. Such is the life of an NFL ROOKIE...but the fact of the matter is a season is 16 games. And EJ did not play a full 16 yet (and for that matter...missed a portion of training camp to boot) And this "great or bust" thing.....you dont know..and even when you try to use the percentages of NFL QB's not becoming franchise QB's you STILL dont know.....EJ might end up being just "good" I think he deserves the chance to see just how high his celing goes based off periods of playing well last year AND his physical abilities which are off the charts. He deserves to be on the roster for 2014. I have never said he didn't. Maybe I'm being hasty, but this year is my make-or-break year. Not year 3. Especially if he's set back by more injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Shortsighted doesn't change the numbers. It's not like you can disagree with my presumption. Odds are odds. What numbers? I'd be interested in seeing them. The simple reality is, the VAST majority of players never even sniff a SB win, let alone do it. The HOF is littered with greats that never won the prize. Perhaps it's better to accept this reality going in. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 You know what I know? There are more busts than SB winners. The same could be said for Canton by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 The same could be said for Canton by the way. Nicely put. I wish I had your eloquence. Short, concise and says it all. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOGNESS Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 (edited) Washington spent two high picks on QB's in one draft last year. Looked smart to me. Much better prospect. There is no RGIII in this draft. These qbs are alot closer to last years draft than they are to Luck and Griffin III. Jury is still out on Griffin BTW. Injuries. Problems with his coach and him getting along. Wouldnt put him in canton just yet. Next years college QB class looks stronger. Id be all for moving up next year if EJ flames out. No QB in this draft class is worthy of giving up multiple # 1s for. Edited April 14, 2014 by DOGNESS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Much better prospect. There is no RGIII in this draft. These qbs are alot closer to last years draft than they are to Luck and Griffin III. Jury is still out on Griffin BTW. Injuries. Problems with his coach and him getting along. Wouldnt put him in canton just yet. Next years college QB class looks stronger. Id be all for moving up next year if EJ flames out. No QB in this draft class is worthy of giving up multiple # 1s for. I agree. When Luck and Griffin came out, actual scouts had them rated as the 1st and 3rd overall rated prospects in the draft. The highest I've seen a QB rated so far this year, again by actual scouts, is Manziel at 15 overall (he moved up from 18 last month). Bortles still sits tight at 23 and Bridgewater has taken a bit of a dive to 26. By comparison, last year, a week before the draft, EJ had risen to 26. None of that means they all won't go in the top 10, though I'd be shocked if they all did. It just means that in terms of rating them as FOOTBALL players and prospects at the next level, there are 14 better players listed above the best of them. Please bear in mind these are ALL subjective ratings. Such is the nature of scouting. All it takes is one guy from one team pounding on the table to make his case and VOILA!, some QB suddenly becomes THE guy. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 The same could be said for Canton by the way. Maybe, but I want to win a SB. That takes precedence over Canton. [/size] What numbers? I'd be interested in seeing them. The simple reality is, the VAST majority of players never even sniff a SB win, let alone do it. The HOF is littered with greats that never won the prize. Perhaps it's better to accept this reality going in. GO BILLS!!! What are the odds EJ is a HoFer? The point still stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColdBlueNorth Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 If he can stay healthy, he has the tools to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 (edited) Maybe, but I want to win a SB. That takes precedence over Canton. What are the odds EJ is a HoFer? The point still stands. I don't know. Why don't you tell me. Are they the same as Johnny Manziel's odds? Bear in mind, there have only been TWO Heisman Trophy winning QBs to win a SB. If I had to guess, I'd say less than 3% of all players make the Hall of Fame. GO BILLS!!! Edited April 14, 2014 by K-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 (edited) In your opinion, which again, no one's listening. There's a Heisman Trophy winner among this group and every year QB play at the college level improves as ex-NFL coaches take more reins there. I don't think Manuel will be good, unlike you who KNOWS everything.You're shtick is old and boring. News flash: you don't know crap about the future -just like all the rest of humankind.I'm listening and K-9 sounds like he's on the money. Just cause you don't agree doesn't mean no ones listening. I don't see anything that resembles an elite QB in this years draft. Once again Heisman Trophy winning QBs don't equate to NFL success. As far as QBs improving, I don't know about that, since 2006 93 QBs have been drafted only 8 have a QB rating of 80 or better for their careers, and an 80 QB rating is no where near elite. Edited April 14, 2014 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxy312 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 I don't know. Why don't you tell me. Are they the same as Johnny Manziel's odds? Bear in mind, there have only been TWO Heisman Trophy winning QBs to win a SB. If I had to guess, I'd say less than 3% of all players make the Hall of Fame. GO BILLS!!! Not entirely accurate. Here's the complete list: 1 - Paul Hornung 2 - Roger Staubach (2 Superbowls) 3 - Jim Plunkett (2 Superbowls) 4 - Tony Dorsett 5 - Mike Garrett 6 - Desmond Howard 7 - Marcus Allen 8 - George Rogers 9 - Reggie Bush Those aren't in order and obviously Reggie Bush had to give up his Heisman after the fact due to the cheating ways of USC, but who cares? Now if you had said there were only 2 Heisman trophy winners that were selected #1 in the draft to have won superbowls, you would be right and that would be Plunkett (with 2) and Hornung. That's a different stat though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Maybe, but I want to win a SB. That takes precedence over Canton. I think we all want to win a SB as do 31 other teams in the league and their fans. QB is the most important position granted, but no QB either wins or loses a SB on his own. It takes a whole team. What exactly did Russell Wilson do to win the SB last year? What did Jim McMahon do exactly in the one he won that made the Bears win? If you want to win a SB you better build a whole team, and not just go for the franchise golden armed SB-winning-QB-to-be.. That's my point. Just because a QB "wins" a SB doesn't mean he's great and one that doesn't isn't a bust. I can think of several HOF QBs that never won a SB. Dan Fouts. Dan Marino. Jim Kelly. As memory serves me correctly, after Dan M's rookie season it was a pretty sure deal that he'd win several. Rich Gannon on the other hand got to a SB, but who would have thought that a few years before he did? Many NFL teams didn't think Kurt Waner was worthy of a roster spot, much less a SB win. You can't judge who will and who won't win a SB, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 Not entirely accurate. Here's the complete list: 1 - Paul Hornung 2 - Roger Staubach (2 Superbowls) 3 - Jim Plunkett (2 Superbowls) 4 - Tony Dorsett 5 - Mike Garrett 6 - Desmond Howard 7 - Marcus Allen 8 - George Rogers 9 - Reggie Bush Those aren't in order and obviously Reggie Bush had to give up his Heisman after the fact due to the cheating ways of USC, but who cares? Now if you had said there were only 2 Heisman trophy winners that were selected #1 in the draft to have won superbowls, you would be right and that would be Plunkett (with 2) and Hornung. That's a different stat though. He said 2 Heisman winning QBs...your list proves him right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 He said 2 Heisman winning QBs...your list proves him right. Beat me to it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted April 14, 2014 Share Posted April 14, 2014 I don't know. Why don't you tell me. Are they the same as Johnny Manziel's odds? Bear in mind, there have only been TWO Heisman Trophy winning QBs to win a SB. If I had to guess, I'd say less than 3% of all players make the Hall of Fame. GO BILLS!!! Johnny Manziels odds + EJ's odds > EJ's odds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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