jahnyc Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 The Bills were a poor team last year, and the front office has created so many new holes in the roster that it will be impossible to improve this team without stellar drafts and significant free agent acquisitions, both of which seem highly unlikely given the track record of this franchise. Assuming we build primarily through the draft (and even assuming some strong drafts), this team is years away from being competitive. Why were none of the needs addressed in the past offseason? How can we improve if needs are not addressed and new holes are created? Players that seemed to have promise last year are regressing (i.e., Byrd, Levitre and Wood) and our rookies are not contributing in a meaningful way. High picks in the draft (Whitner, Lynch (traded), Maybin, McCargo, McKelvin and Hardy) did not or have not developed into strong players, particularly considering where they were drafted. Why does anyone think that this front office can rebuild this mess? I know that many posters think that we need to hit rock bottom before we can really improve, but we hit rock bottom last year and now we are worse. I am starting to believe that we have reached a tipping point. The talent on this team is so poor and the plan to reconstitute the team so undeveloped and underfunded that we will not be able to recover (kind of like a death spiral). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Seems like we all thought we hit rock bottom last year, unfortunatly it seems like they felt they weren't deep enough and decided to dig down trying to get out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakeeyed Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 how is a 6-10 team rock bottom? hell, 5 of our losses were by a td or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I just want a franchise top 10 QB. We have won 7 games with terrible starting QBs in Losman and Edwards. Look at what Bradford has done for the Rams. I hate losing with a passion but I love the top 3 QBs this year. That is my light at the end of the tunnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakeeyed Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 a qb with a terrible line will just bring us back to mediocrity. draft the line first so we're not throwing our franchise to the wolves when he gets in the game. this isn't going to happen in one season people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 a qb with a terrible line will just bring us back to mediocrity. draft the line first so we're not throwing our franchise to the wolves when he gets in the game. this isn't going to happen in one season people. Aaron Rodgers and Big Ben say hi. Good QBs can make olines much better. You don't pass on a franchise QB for a lineman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infernus Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 (edited) ^ agreed sometimes you just have to go out and get your guy... yeah he needs protection.. but how many teams/analysts say "wow look at the heart that Left Tackle plays with--he is really a game changer" vs how many times they'd say it about their QB Edited October 6, 2010 by infernus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FightinIrishBills Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Aaron Rodgers and Big Ben say hi. Good QBs can make olines much better. You don't pass on a franchise QB for a lineman. I do agree with your overall point, but Jay Cutler would like to have a word with you about bad O-lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 I do agree with your overall point, but Jay Cutler would like to have a word with you about bad O-lines. So would David Carr- Joey Harrington-Trent Edwards et al- and to any other poor SoB QB that gets drafted to a crap team that never builds a decent O line to protect him. Don't bring up Payton Manning, because the year before they drafted him #1 overall, they drafted a LT #1 in Tarik Glenn in 97, the year BEFORE...Bill Polian built a solid O line for his QB at Indy just like he did for Kelly in Buffalo. Jeff Saturday has been the Colts starting center for the last 10 years, 4 time pro bowler ...not even drafted. Payton Manning is one of the least sacked-touched-harried QB's in the NFL every year because he has had a solid O line, he is also one of the hardest working QB's who demands his receivers stay after practice to keep working on passing drills so his passes are out very quickly. The entire offense is highly scripted and precise and one of the very best offensive units in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 So would David Carr- Joey Harrington-Trent Edwards et al- and to any other poor SoB QB that gets drafted to a crap team that never builds a decent O line to protect him. Counterpoint: Tom Brady. 6th round pick. New England had a line before they drafted him. It's a lot easier to find a franchise QB when you've already got a line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Things turn around quickly in the NFL if you have a good quarterback and somebody to block for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 (edited) Counterpoint: Tom Brady. 6th round pick. New England had a line before they drafted him. It's a lot easier to find a franchise QB when you've already got a line. Run that counterpoint to C.Bsicuit97, because I agree that even the greatest QB is going to fail behind a poor O line. Like I stated with the Colts, they drafted a LT with their #1 pick the year before they drafted Payton Manning. To the OP question, have they reached a tipping point? no, not yet! I'm hoping that at some point after the mid point this season, when the Bills are 1-7 or 0-8 that Nix comes to the realization that he made a huge mistake by hiring Chan Gailey, he grows a pair and fires that loser. Marty S is available and would jump at the job. If Nix remains a vage all season, then I would hope that Grampy Wilson gets fed up with a 1-15 season, realizes that the fans are going to abandon ship and fires both Nix and Gailey Cowher wants back into a HC job Edited October 6, 2010 by Harvey lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 Counterpoint: Tom Brady. 6th round pick. New England had a line before they drafted him. It's a lot easier to find a franchise QB when you've already got a line. That line looked like garbage with Bledsoe behind it. Brady MADE that line all-pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloATL Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 The Bills were a poor team last year, and the front office has created so many new holes in the roster that it will be impossible to improve this team without stellar drafts and significant free agent acquisitions, both of which seem highly unlikely given the track record of this franchise. Assuming we build primarily through the draft (and even assuming some strong drafts), this team is years away from being competitive. Why were none of the needs addressed in the past offseason? How can we improve if needs are not addressed and new holes are created? Players that seemed to have promise last year are regressing (i.e., Byrd, Levitre and Wood) and our rookies are not contributing in a meaningful way. High picks in the draft (Whitner, Lynch (traded), Maybin, McCargo, McKelvin and Hardy) did not or have not developed into strong players, particularly considering where they were drafted. Why does anyone think that this front office can rebuild this mess? I know that many posters think that we need to hit rock bottom before we can really improve, but we hit rock bottom last year and now we are worse. I am starting to believe that we have reached a tipping point. The talent on this team is so poor and the plan to reconstitute the team so undeveloped and underfunded that we will not be able to recover (kind of like a death spiral). I feel the same, but I also think that drafting a QB and trading for/signing a decent LT will help things enough to get us excited again (even though we might not be able to put it all back together anytime soon). Luck/Locker/Mallet with a new LT, our current G/C/G - which I actually think is fine- Evans, Spiller and Freddie- I think can be pretty good. I do question the ability of our front office to get it done, but we're due to get one of these draft picks right, right? Our DEF, that's another story..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bisonbrigade Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 You draft the BEST player on the board. If that happens to be a franchise QB you do it. Otherwise you never improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 The Bills were a poor team last year, and the front office has created so many new holes in the roster that it will be impossible to improve this team without stellar drafts and significant free agent acquisitions, both of which seem highly unlikely given the track record of this franchise. Assuming we build primarily through the draft (and even assuming some strong drafts), this team is years away from being competitive. Why were none of the needs addressed in the past offseason? How can we improve if needs are not addressed and new holes are created? Players that seemed to have promise last year are regressing (i.e., Byrd, Levitre and Wood) and our rookies are not contributing in a meaningful way. High picks in the draft (Whitner, Lynch (traded), Maybin, McCargo, McKelvin and Hardy) did not or have not developed into strong players, particularly considering where they were drafted. Why does anyone think that this front office can rebuild this mess? I know that many posters think that we need to hit rock bottom before we can really improve, but we hit rock bottom last year and now we are worse. I am starting to believe that we have reached a tipping point. The talent on this team is so poor and the plan to reconstitute the team so undeveloped and underfunded that we will not be able to recover (kind of like a death spiral). i do disagree about Byrd, Levitre and Wood. Hell all three of them were injured. The only way to truly build a solid line is through playing time. Look at Peyton Mannings OL. At one point they played together for what 6-7 years? If the Bills keeping dumping O-linemen they will never get stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 That line looked like garbage with Bledsoe behind it. Brady MADE that line all-pro. Kinda funny how it took an injury to Bledsoe to give Brady a chance to show he could play... The thing about Bledsoe that even Donahoe didn't realize right away is that if he played against teams with a bad pass rush he would carve them to pieces once he got into a rhythm. He did this with the Bills also, Bledsoe had some really good games as a Bill. .BUT! if he got knocked around at some point in the game and hit and hurried, he would start to hear phantom footsteps, it would destroy his confidence and the game would go out the window. Opposing team saw this and started going all out to blitz the guy and take him out of his game, and it worked. Give Bill Belichick credit as he saw this much eariler then anyone else and got rid of him, it did help that Tom Brady was his back up and showed he could out perform Bledsoe in games! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 So would David Carr- Joey Harrington-Trent Edwards et al- and to any other poor SoB QB that gets drafted to a crap team that never builds a decent O line to protect him. Don't bring up Payton Manning, because the year before they drafted him #1 overall, they drafted a LT #1 in Tarik Glenn in 97, the year BEFORE...Bill Polian built a solid O line for his QB at Indy just like he did for Kelly in Buffalo. Jeff Saturday has been the Colts starting center for the last 10 years, 4 time pro bowler ...not even drafted. Payton Manning is one of the least sacked-touched-harried QB's in the NFL every year because he has had a solid O line, he is also one of the hardest working QB's who demands his receivers stay after practice to keep working on passing drills so his passes are out very quickly. The entire offense is highly scripted and precise and one of the very best offensive units in the NFL. check your dates...polian didn't get there until right before the '98 draft, when he took Manning. Polian didn't "build" the Colts OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 The what comes first the franchise QB or a solid O-line is a debate without a correct answer. It has been done both ways with success and with failure. If you think Luck, Mallet, or Locker is that guy then you take him. But you better be right or else you've set yourself back another 3 years. The problem with the Bills front office is not with the 'plan'. Every team pretty much has the same plan. Nobody goes into the draft or free agency planning to fail. The question isn't the plan but their ability to execute it. Based on recent draft and free agent pickups by the various regimes during this decade its difficult for me, being a relative optimist, to have any confidence that all of a sudden the Bills are going to start hitting on their draft picks and bring in impact free agents. And while I like Spiller, look at the first Nix/Gailey draft. Who is contributing, who is starting? Meanwhile other teams, most importantly, those in our division are able to identify, draft, and plug in a couple rookies and put more and more distance between the Bills and themselves. What was it Buddy said? 'Show me the baby'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted October 6, 2010 Share Posted October 6, 2010 check your dates...polian didn't get there until right before the '98 draft, when he took Manning. Polian didn't "build" the Colts OL. where exactly did I state that Polian drafted LT Tarik Glenn, all I stated was that he was already a Colt before Manning got there.The RT was drafted in 97 also 2006 SB champs- Tarik Glenn LT 1997 DP- Dylan Gandy 2005 DP LG-Jeff Saturday C- FA Jake Scott RG 2004 DP- Ryan Diem RT 2001 DP so 4 of 5 on that SB team where brought in by Bill Polian, I'd say that's a yea Besides, Guard Jim Ritcher was drafted by Chuck Knox in 1980 and was with the Bills all through their SB years, yet I still contend that O line that Jim Kelly had protecting him was a result of Polian putting the pieces together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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