BillsFanForever19

Correct - but Daryl Johnson was one of the key pieces of our Special Teams core. It was his biggest role on this team. In an earlier post you even used keeping Daryl Johnson as a reason why they could afford to cut Taiwan agreeing that it's unlikely that they cut both pieces on that side of the ball. Now Johnson's out the door and with the extra spot on your roster - you still give it to someone else. In your defense, I do see your roster being almost perfect otherwise. And I do lean towards Obada staying now as well. The difference in your projection vs. mine is that in keeping 6 DE's (of which 3 have the ability to shift inside on occasion), I don't see them also keeping 5 DT's. Either Zimmer or Phillips will be released. And with Phillips being injured, he'll probably be put on the IR anyways.

So on top of all the other factors pointing to Taiwan Jones being safe - we just traded one of our core Special Teamers away (after already losing Dean Marlowe, one of our core pieces in FA). Yet you still have him being released. You once asked me if I was related to him. Now I ask you - did he kick your dog or something? Or are you just of the mind that Special Teams really doesn't matter and you can just put anyone with legs back there?

And Obada doesn't play Special Teams. Which is the only reason I had them keeping Johnson and 6 DE's instead of 4 or 5. He may very well stay on. But I wouldn't look at Daryl Johnson being traded as a guarantee Obada makes it. I could very easily see them just keeping Hughes, Addison, Rousseau, Epenesa, and Basham.

Rousseau and Basham also slid inside quite a bit in College, so that alone doesn't make him so unique we have to keep him.

I've been saying all offseason that Marquez Stevenson's speed and return ability trumps Hodgins' size and red zone ability for what this WR core needs. With things being the way they are with a good portion of our WR core, I think it's necessary we keep 7 on the 53 and at least a couple more on the Practice Squad. I have no doubt that with the way he's flashed and being our 5th Draft Pick just a few months ago, Marquez Stevenson will be on the 53 opening day.

Not sure how that logic works when Kumerow was signed to a futures deal on January 26th and Taiwan Jones was re-signed as a Free Agent on March 29th...

I agree with pretty much everything. Except Harrison Phillips will be IR'ed or straight up released and that spot on the 53 will go to Taiwan Jones. I don't see them carrying 11 Defensive Lineman. The number is usually somewhere between 8-9, 10 tops. With the logjam at Defensive End and us keeping six guys there in lieu of the normal 4-5 (of which some play inside as well), I always saw it coming down to either Zimmer or Phillips being released. And Phillips injuring his knee again settled that. I agree that Efe Obada will be traded, especially if Beane is saying teams are calling at that position. We've had this argument before. And again - I'm not saying it's the only reason. But the fact that they didn't play Taiwan Jones AT ALL during the preseason is the biggest indication of his importance to the team in their eyes. It makes zero sense to sign him this offseason for Special Teams, knowing they're already losing a key contributor to their Special Teams core in Dean Marlowe, not playing him even for a single snap, and then just cutting him. If he were on the bubble, he'd have been out there. Other than that - I'm with you. Though it wouldn't shock me if Joe Giles-Harris beat out Tyrell Dodson. He's reportedly had a very good camp and played well in the Preseason. Also wouldn't be surprised to see Josh Thomas make it in lieu of Jaquan Johnson.

See my post directly above yours.

If you read on in Joe's article - you would see: Re-sign RB Taiwan Jones and TE Jake Hollister: Now to the roster madness. This is a move Beane loves using at final cuts. He identifies vested veterans — players with over four accrued years of NFLservice or more — near the middle to bottom of the roster, on the final year of their contracts and without a ton of guaranteed money owed. Vested veterans do not need to pass through waivers and may immediately sign wherever they choose. Beane releases them initially, gives them some money for their trouble and re-signs them to give his team flexibility. In this case, it’s with the injuries to McKenzie and Phillips. That small move with Jones and Hollister would keep McKenzie and Phillips available to return off IR this year while keeping on two other younger players they otherwise would have had to cut. Jones has $700,000 guaranteed this year, and Hollister only has $137,500 guaranteed, according to OverTheCap.com. Upon their re-signing, it’s fair to expect their new contracts would be close to fully guaranteed for the season with a nice little signing bonus.

Think there's a difference between "nobody wanted him" and "their wasn't an offer from someone to be their starting QB prior to the Draft". I'm sure he had other offers to be a backup and we were the best team, so he went with us. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that if someone either has a banged up QB (like Indy) or there's a team that isn't thrilled with their room post-draft that someone would call. That said, seeing how he looked under Daboll in the last Pre-Season game, knowing were a contender right now, and getting a look at Jake Fromm - I wouldn't trade him for what would realistically be offered.

If that were their logic, they wouldn't have signed Taiwan Jones 11 days after they signed Matt Haack...

Taiwan is someone Beane and McDermott value WAY more than some of the fans on the board. They've talked about the importance of having a core of Special Teams Specialists. Taiwan being their #1 guy in that core. But a vocal part of this board just isn't hearing it. You can't just be a very good Special Teams player on this board. Even if it means you're active every single game - they'd rather keep a 6th Defensive End or a 7th WR who will never see the field unless there's an injury instead. It's absolutely baffling. They'll probably protect him again this weekend with the rest of their untouchable players and people still will reach for reasons why he won't be here.

I see the 53 for the D-Line as Jerry Hughes, Mario Addison, AJ Epenesa, Greg Rousseau, and Carlos Basham at Defensive End and Ed Oliver, Star Lotulelei, Vernon Butler, and Justin Zimmer at Defensive Tackle. Possible that Harrison Phillips edges out Zimmer. But I see both Obada and Bam gone regardless. Of course, any injuries could change things.

Although Obada is a fan favorite because of his size, story, and potential - I don't think he's staying for a number of reasons. 1.) I believe his signing just before the Draft was more of a cover your butt type signing in the event that the board didn't fall in our favor at the position. Not only did it fall in our favor - but they landed TWO in the first two rounds. 2.) As someone pointed out earlier in the thread, if they thought as highly of him as members of this board do - he wouldn't have been on the field at the end of the game on Friday. 3.) Ultimately, the numbers game isn't in his favor. Although fans have written off Addison after one year and made him the new Trent Murphy of the board (who also didn't fall as they wanted) - it doesn't appear to me that's how McBeane see it. Hughes and Addison sat to not risk they're health because they're important pieces in their eyes. Greg Rousseau, A.J. Epenesa, and Carlos Basham are premium Draft Picks over the past two Drafts who won't be released. In my time as a Bills fan - they've only kept 4 Defensive Ends, 5 tops. I don't see them keeping 6. Even if he plays a hybrid role like Quinton Jefferson last season - he'd have to be good enough at DT to justify them releasing both Harrison Phillips and Justin Zimmer. Not to mention, from what I've seen from Rousseau and Basham - both played Inside quite a bit in College. Thus eliminating that specialized role for him. So, yeah, I just don't see it.

If there were someone out there that was an upgrade over Levi Wallace, maybe. But after Steven Nelson signed with Philadelphia and Richard Sherman became persona non grata, there isn't anyone that fits the bill on the market right now. If McBeane themselves thought anyone was an upgrade and/or were interested, they'd have done it by now. Not two weeks into Training Camp. And anyone who would be an upgrade over Levi wouldn't be released in the final cuts and even if they were, it'd be too late in the process for them to be expected to step in, know the system, and start right away. I wouldn't expect a signing at CB unless there's an injury. Maybe.

McDermott praised Jones as being in his eyes "the best gunner in the NFL". We've already lost Andre Roberts and will most likely lose Daryl Johnson from a pure numbers standpoint. I don't see us then voluntarily getting rid of someone who is considered our top Special Teams player. McDermott and Beane have spoke of the importance of having a core of Special Teams specialists. When you trade those guys in for guys who might not be as good there but offer more on Offense or Defense - you get burned. As we did in 2019 when we didn't match Houston's offer for Taiwan. We brought him back as soon as we could. And then re-signed him this offseason, knowing he's used almost exclusively on Special Teams. Last Friday, he was a healthy scratch by McDermott. He didn't want to risk him getting hurt, even when we were already down Zack Moss and Christian Wade at RB. Even when Antonio Williams went down, they still didn't put in Jones. If you look at everyone else who sat on Friday, they're all locks. They view him as an important part of the team. If he was even in so much of a training camp battle, they wouldn't have done that Much like I stated above about Jones, Addison wasn't risked to injury last Friday amongst the rest of the locks on the roster. Beyond that, Beane has been steadfast in stating he's relying on Addison for leadership and expects big things from him this year. Often speaking of a new plan they have for reps for him to get back to where he was before last season. And if they were to move on from him, they would have released him before the season. Not asked him to restructure to stay. Never under Brandon Beane's regime has he approached a player and told them they need to take a paycut to stay and then released the player. Not even someone we ended up not even using like Tyler Kroft. It's a bad look to the locker room and Beane places a heavy emphasis on morale and trust in the process. A trade is even more unlikely as it's an even worse look to say "thanks for taking that pay cut, it made it easier for us to move you to a new team at the start of the season for you to play catch up with all year". I think I remember seeing cutting Adisson wouldn't save us any money now either. I see Addison as way more unlikely to be released or traded then Trent Murphy was. Especially after only one season with us. And they never even cut or traded Murphy. I just see a big disparity between how many of you view Addison and Jones and how Beane and McDermott view them.

😳😆😂

It's all the rage amongst fans for them to cut Mario Addison and Taiwan Jones and I guarantee neither is going to happen.

I think even keeping 6 is pushing it. There's no way they're keeping 7. I've never seen them team keep more than 5 and most of my life it's only been 4. I think it's very likely we only keep Hughes, Adisson, Rougeau, Epenesa, and Basham. I know everyone fell in love with the story, size and potential of Obada. But I could easily see a scenario where he was signed as a cover your @$$ by Beane in the event that the Draft didn't fall right for us at DE. Then not only did it fall right for us, but he was able to land not one, but two of his top guys.

Hodgins did nothing and injured his knee. Kumerow did nothing. Stevenson made a big play to win the game for us and flashed his speed and shiftiness in returns. Like I said, it's only one Preseason game, but compared to the other two who did literally nothing - Stevenson showed some stuff.

I've been saying all offseason that the hype for Kumerow and Hodgins and everyone writing off Stevenson to the Practice Squad was misguided - given his speed and return ability. Only one Preseason game, but it rang true last night.

Apparently, you're not reading my posts. As stated in my previous post, they have never cut him or even let him go without a contract offer. They made an offer to him after his one year deal in 2018 during the 2019 FA process. Houston offered more money and more opportunities as a RB in a less crowded backfield. So he chose to go there instead for a season. And this goes to the crux of our back and forth. You make points to argue against what I say and I simply reply back with why I don't agree with the assessment or in this case, point out the parts that are simply incorrect. That's... kinda how message boards work? This last post is a prime example of what I've been saying. You spend most of the post taking a stance of me "overreacting" and spend time defending yourself that you never said Taiwan couldn't make the team. Yet you couldn't help but end the post with a (incorrect) negative on him.

You literally wrote him off the roster by having him as a cut. And while I point out that was extremely unlikely in the first place and that tonight points to it being even more unlikely than that - you maintain that it means nothing. Hell, even when Antonio Williams was dinged up - they still opted to keep him on the bench and then put Williams back in later when he was cleared. If he were a fringe player on the roster or even in a battle to keep his job, they wouldn't have done that. You can hedge your bet by saying "he might still make it". But you don't seem to want to hear the logic pointing to that already being the case and continue to point to reasons why he could/should be cut. I don't know any other way of reading it than you're personally writing him off the roster. And I hate to break it to you, but McDermott never cut him. He's also not been cut multiple times in his career. He was cut once in 2017 after 6 seasons with the Raiders, most likely for cap reasons while being on the final year of a 3 year contract extension there. He was a Free Agent after the 2018 season with us and chose Houston in FA because they offered him more. And after a year of subpar Special Teams, McDermott and Beane realized their mistake and brought him back for last year and this year.

I don't know how you can say "you fully understand the value of STs" and then write a guy off the roster who was called "the best gunner in the NFL" by McDermott in Camp, then disregard what it says that we're not risking him getting hurt when we're already down a number of RB's by saying (that as opposed to literally every other player we're doing that for) we're just doing it because "they know what he is". I'm not saying that just his sitting makes him a lock. I'm saying he was already a lock and them not risking him getting injured tonight says all you need to know.

If you look at the healthy guys who aren't playing, they're all locks. So you're suggesting Taiwan Jones and only Taiwan Jones is sitting bc they know what he is? With Zach Moss and Christian Wade hurt so we're already short staffed tonight at RB and need bodies? C'mon 🙄 That's not why he's sitting tonight. He's sitting because he's an important piece to our squad like the others who are sitting. You look at Special Teams and say you want someone who does more than just that. But that's not how McBeane looks at it. They realize and have talked about the importance of having a solid core as when you just rely on offensive and defensive contributors, you get burned. Yes, Taiwan Jones doesn't offer much outside of Special Teams. But that doesn't matter. Because Special Teams is one of the three phases of the game and he's our most important player in that role. I think you're seriously disrespecting that side of the ball by saying it's not enough that he's only a good Special Teams player.