transplantbillsfan

Was I wrong?

I guess we are. That was poor joking... or I should say it was not the "haha for all" type of joke, it was more "I'm going to be a condescending jerk to you because I think it's funny and others (not you) will think it's funny, too" type of joke. So you pretty much asked for a response like that from me.

I watched Jim Kelly from the moment I became a Bills fan in 1988 to 1996. I've seen a HOFer at QB in a Bills uniform. I know what it looks like, thanks. I'll never hate a Bills QB. I don't hate Peterman. I didn't love Taylor. I don't love Allen, though I'm excited about his prospects. I'm definitely more of a positive person than so many on here, though. Being a sports fan is supposed to be enjoyable, so I enjoy watching every minute of every game the Bills play, even when we absolutely suck like in 2010 when we were 4-12 and were out of even remote playoff contention in October. You can whine and complain if you want, I'll be positive, thank you very much... maybe it's the Hawaiian sun that does it for me. Even if Peterman starts (I don't want him to, just like I desperately hated the idea of drafting Allen), I'll manage to be positive about it. Sorry if that bothers you. Feel free to do what redneck claims he's now going to do and what Shady has clearly unsuccessfully been doing for a long time and ignore me.

Weird... the article isn't entirely critical of Peterman and actually leaves ambiguity here. Another useless irrelevant post bitching about a thread just because of personal feelings. You're definitely one of a small handful of posters on this message board one could point to in order to define the word Curmudgeon. Nice to see you still feel so much affection for me, though

Exactly. There are clearly fans here who root more for or against players than anything, but despite being utter dog dung against the Chargers, every time Peterman took the field with the 1st string offense, I convinced (deluded...?) myself that he would find a way to pull a complete 180 and look like a viable Franchise QB who could eventually lead us to the promised land. That didn't happen. But if he starts for us this year from the beginning, I'll do the same: trust McDermott's judgement, root for the laundry, and Billieve in the guy under center, even if I'm incredibly apprehensive about him.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.buffalorumblings.com/platform/amp/2018/6/27/17484226/all-22-analysis-buffalo-bills-quarterback-nathan-peterman-kelvin-benjamin-charles-clay Beginning "For this all-22 look, we’ll cut right to the chase. Nathan Peterman has shown some good things along with some bad things. His low volume of game tape (52 pass attempts) makes statistical evaluations exceedingly difficult, so we won’t even try. No one should be selling a definitive “Book of Peterman,” as his trajectory is unknown at this point. What follows are simply notes on the Ghost of Peterman past. Should he elect to undergo Ebenezer Scrooge-like self-evaluation and correction, the Ghost of Peterman future should be a much nicer picture. Because quarterbacks are special, we have a limited edition format for this dive." Click the link for All-22 Analysis of 7 Plays End "Skeptics will likely continue to cringe at the sheer number of things he needs to work on, which is a valid take. Petermaniacs can hang their hat (or ripped muscle shirt) on the fact that repetition should lead to improvements in all of his weak areas. This is also a valid take. More than anyone else in the position group, Peterman exemplifies Schrödinger’s QB."

And Maury Balstein, too.

And yet, in the modern era of quarterbacking over the last 10 years, 76.5% of the QBs drafted in the top 10 started week #1 and 56% of all QBs drafted in the 1st round drafted have started week #1, game #1 of their rookie year for the team that drafted him. 96.3% of all QBs drafted in the 1st round in the last 10 years started at some point during their rookie year. General odds actually seem to favor Allen starting week 1, especially given a new offensive system and no incumbent.

Ah I see it. I really don't know who his source is or how close he is to McDermott or Dabol, but I think much will be revealed in that first week of Training Camp. I said I think Allen has somewhere around a 50% chance of becoming the week 1 starter, and I still think that's about right. As much as Colorado and a couple others are painting me as a "he WILL be the starter!!!" guy, the reality is I think he's got about a 50/50 shot to win it. His sheer physical talent, leadership that's already showing, intelligence, and glowing praise from vets are some of the reasons for that combined with the fact that the 2 guys he's up against are probably the "frontrunner" who's had 5 NFL starts and was a backup for 4 years otherwise to a mediocre Franchise QB and a guy with a serious physical detriment for an NFL QB (at least as far as last year) who's shocked everyone this spring with how good he's been--and that shock largely stems from how appallingly bad he was last year. But I'd say Peterman/McCarron are about as likely to be the starter as Allen. Just my opinion.

Hap, I assume you're referring to this tweet by Allbright? Is that it? I don't think that one says anything at all about Allen, especially him being distantly in 3rd. I looked through that conversation and didn't see any of it brought up, either.

Soooo... 4 snaps? Link? Here, I'll follow CoC and provide you with a link to the practice where you think he had 4 snaps: https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-1-of-minicamp-20724711 Allen got a series with the first team during an 11-on-11 team segment and for a series during a nine-on-nine segment when two of the defensive linemen are on the field taking a knee and do not rush the passer. In what world does 2 series equal 4 snaps??? And what do the words "som" and "concider" mean? I see you're not ignoring me anymore, so I'll have to give you a big thanks for that, but I look forward to an explanation.

Quick doesn't necessarily mean rash. Naming the starting QB within a week would be rash given how close they are right now. On the other hand, naming the starting QB by preseason game #2 would be quick, but not necessarily rash. After all, the season's already coming up pretty quickly.

I agree that McDermott will likely name his QB pretty quickly. Again, he and Dabol did say multiple times that OTAs and Minicamp were more about a rep chart than depth chart, and considering Allen progressively got more and more reps until the last day of Minicamp, the idea that Allen is so much more behind the eight ball seems a bit misguided. I think we know if Allen's truly in the mix still within the first week of Training Camp. If he's relegated solely or primarily to the 3rd string reps at that point, I think it'll be pretty clear McDermott isn'tfactoring him into the competition.

Well, of course the starting QB for the 3rd preseason game will be the odds favorite to start the season. Right? Yep, Allen is getting less 1st string reps than Peterman or McCarron, but McDermott and Dabol keep on bringing up that OTAs and Minicamp was more a rep chart than a depth chart, and Allen's reps seemed to increase consistently, particularly on the last day of Minicamp. I think Allen's chances of starting week 1 are the same as I thought they were initially simply because of that increase in reps and his incremental improvements thus far. After a week or so of Training Camp, we're going to have a much better idea, but the longer Allen is actually in this QB competition and actually getting #1 reps, the greater I think his chances become of starting week 1. I think McDermott is going to name his week 1 starting QB before game #3 of the preseason.

10 whole snaps??? Geez, talk about a misrepresentation... as though it was a "let's just throw him a bone" attitude that got him snaps with the 1s. Allen got significant time with the 1s through Minicamp, and it was more than just a handful of snaps... day 1: https://www.cover1.net/josh-allen-buffalo-bills-micah-hyde/ Allen played a handful of snaps with the first-team Tuesday, getting a series in 11-on-11 drills and another in nine-on-nine. day 2: https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-2-of-minicamp-20727276 For the second straight day, rookie Josh Allen was rotated in with the ones for a series or two here and there through the course of practice. And then day 3 there simply weren't many 1st string reps at all for any of the QBs because it seemed almost like the 1st team had a bit of a rest day, but even with that, Allen got the Lion's share of reps overall that day and took advantage of it: https://www.buffalobills.com/news/5-things-we-learned-from-day-3-of-minicamp-20731093 He’s had his share of plays in the passing game through the course of the spring, but most of Josh Allen’s more eye-opening passes have been surfacing every so often. On Thursday, Allen delivered quality plays on a more consistent basis. Part of it was due to the fact that he saw the most reps at quarterback with the second and third team units seeing the bulk of the 11-on-11 and 9-on-9 team work in practice. But you can’t fault Allen for taking advantage of the additional reps. It's pretty obvious to anyone who doesn't have his/her head strapped at the beginning of a narrow tunnel faced permanently towards the small light at the end of the tunnel that Allen is very much in the mix for the starting QB job and is pretty significantly ahead of where most thought he'd be. And the kid is constantly and actively learning: “Micah Hyde broke one of my passes up so I went up to him after practice and just asked what he saw,” said Allen. “He said he saw my eyes. So being able to talk to the defense like that and pick up on keys that they’re looking at to help them make plays on the football is valuable. So I’m just trying to learn from all the reps that I get.”

Yep... and not just a veteran, but a veteran who's started bunches of games the way Taylor/Bradford/McCown all have ahead of the rookies their respective teams have drafted in Mayfield/Rosen/Darnold. Allen has that ahead of those guys. I believe it bodes extremely well for Allen that the "talk-of-the-town" in this QB competition is not, in fact, the veteran, but is instead the guy who mere months ago lacked the physical attributes to play starting QB in the NFL for any length of time.

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/expo/sports/erry-2018/06/8e6296d4ed1573/will_buffalo_bills_qb_josh_all.html Will Buffalo Bills QB Josh Allen record any starts as rookie? History says yes By the numbers First-round quarterbacks to start in last 20 years: 46-of-55 Top-10 quarterbacks who did not record at least one start as rookies: Jake Locker, Philip Rivers, Carson Palmer Based on history, Josh Allen is likely to start at some point as a rookie. In the last 20 seasons, 84 percent of first round quarterbacks have started for their respective teams. Top 10 quarterback selections are even more likely to see the field. The only cases of top 10 picks not starting as rookies were Locker, Rivers and Palmer. The Tennessee Titans, San Diego Chargers and Cincinnati Bengals were all in playoff contention during with veterans starting (Hasselbeck, Brees, Kitna) during those seasons. Buffalo does not have an established veteran on their roster so Allen's odds of starting at some point this season should be seen as very high.

Why? Tyrod has established himself as an NFL starting QB with 3 seasons starting under his belt. And his conservative, protect the football style of play is something I think you'll find historically that NFL coaches love. I remember listening to separate interviews with Jimmy Johnson and Bill Parcells, and when talking about what they said to their QBs--whoever they were--regarding turnovers, it was that "a punt is a good thing." Mayfield is brand new to NFL style offenses. He still has a lot of learning, by his own admission. It says nothing about Mayfield really that he's really far behind a QB who just started 3 seasons and has been in the NFL for 7, going on 8.

Geez, whatever anyone's thoughts might be right now on Taylor, if the QB competition right now results in QB play in McCarron/Peterman/Allen having a 2018 season like Tyrod Taylor's in 2015, I think all will be very happy and will believe we drafted a legit Franchise QB if that QB is Allen or there will be a legit conversation by some questioning whether we really needed to draft Allen if it's Peterman or McCarron. SaviorPeterman is back under a different username with the same ole tricks.

There are actually 3 QBs battling for the job, not 2. And I'll be 100% supportive of whoever is under center for the Bills, despite whatever level of apprehension I might feel about that player. It's good Peterman has been working on arm strength and velocity, because if his arm strength remains the same from his rookie year through the rest of his career, he won't ever be more than a backup.

Obviously all is TBD, but there's no doubt that Allen is very smart and handles himself well. He also operated an NFL style offense at Wyoming. I would say my long term excitement about him largely stems from (and I've said this time and time again) just how much of a late-bloomer he was, and not just physically but also in terms of how late it was he was truly immersed in high-level Football. He played in college, but he was a 3 sport athlete rather than concentrating year-round on learning and honing his skills and knowledge as a QB. He played at a JuCo, so he didn't get a ton there. Then he was at Wyoming where he really was exposed full-steam ahead to the game. I already posted that quote at the top of the page from the Buffalo News article regarding Allen talking about never going to QB camps the way the other prospects did, but I think a couple of these quotes from an interview with Brent Vigen are also telling and respond a bit to what you bring up: https://www.google.com/amp/s/draftwire.usatoday.com/2018/05/07/josh-allen-nfl-draft-bills-wyoming-brent-vigen/amp/ JM: You’ve worked very closely with him for a number of years now. He’s had his fair share of ups and downs as a player. How do you feel he grew during his time at Wyoming? BV: I would say he grew in every which way. When he arrived here, he was about 205 pounds. He was probably still 6-foot-4. He grew physically. That was significant, because he’s about 240 pounds now. He hadn’t really found himself in the weight room before he got to Wyoming. Once he got more comfortable in there, it made a significant impact on his physical ability. Mentally, having played just one season in junior college, that was small-school ball in California. His baseline for what they did wasn’t very significant. His understanding of the game and the nuances of both offense and defense, those ideas in his mind really grew in his time here. I would say maturity-wise, as well, but that’s probably the same for all our guys. You just see them through that phase of life where they mature and start to figure things out. I think it was a great benefit in a lot of ways for Josh coming back for an additional season. I think the biggest thing was maturity. It was about having to deal with the expectations that were placed upon him from the early part of last year. It doesn’t always go as planned, but you learn how to deal with those things. I would say that he grew a tremendous amount physically, mentally and emotionally throughout his three years at Wyoming. JM: At this point in time, which aspects of his game would you say are the most developed? His understanding of a fairly sophisticated offense that we ran at Wyoming is there. There’s not gonna be this dramatic shift for him. He can speak the language. He can recite a play. He can make decisions at the line of scrimmage. These are all things he’s already done. For some kids who go from college to the pros, that’s a transition for them. He is not perfect by any means, but he’s already been exposed to a lot of things. I don’t think the transition is gonna be great as a lot of people out there seem to think.

Yeah I saw that, I'm just skeptical of how much he improved it in thread 4 or 5 months the offseason was. But we shall see.

I think this is an interesting tidbit... pretty good indication of his room to grow: https://buffalonews.com/2018/06/22/josh-allen-says-michael-strahan-give-him-the-best-pre-draft-advice/ The most interesting answer from Allen came when the quarterbacks talked about the rise in personal quarterback coaches and a growing camp circuit. “I never did that growing up,” Allen told host Robert Klemko. “I came from a small town. I didn’t really go the camps. I was too busy playing different sports. … Watching kids grow up and play different sports, allowing them to develop different parts of their athleticism, to me was a big part of my success in college."

As I stated a few times already, if Peterman significantly improved his arm strength, that could be a game changer. But it would have to be a significant improvement. And muscle-mass doesn't necessarily mean he's developed those quick-twitch muscles an NFL QB has in his arm in order to release the ball quickly and with velocity. And if this is just the media watching him throw the ball around to his own teammates in shorts with no threat of being hit and using their own judgement on improved arm strength... well, I'll wait at least til the pads come on to start getting excited. Soooo... you're SaviorPeterman, riiiiight??? His last post was late February. You joined during the draft... actually the day after Josh Allen was drafted was when you became a member. Been to any high level business meetings lately?